CP Mafia 4 - The Unknown Host - Game Over!

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Now he is trying to say I have never made a case for him being scum but really I have all game. Just because I did not do a huge post like on Timbo does not mean I have not posted reasons.

I already went back and quoted all the posts you list your reasons for me being suspicious. You literally had 2 arguments against me the whole time.

I asked you to go back and do a post showing just why you thought I was suspicious and you refused. Go look at post #1385.

[starseed]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

He assured us GS was a host, I even gave him the benefit of the doubt there and voted with him and she was a passenger.

You are deflecting responsibility for your votes. Blaming someone else for your own actions is pretty scummy. This is in the same category as clinging to a known townie for direction so as to hide.

What do you mean benefit of the doubt? Do you think he had more information than you did?

[squiggs96]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

He speaks in absolutes all the time for one and they have proven to be misleading. He assured us GS was a host, I even gave him the benefit of the doubt there and voted with him and she was a passenger. He has been after me all the time and I know I am town and then when mrkajz44 took a stand for me and he could not get the votes to stay on me he switched to mrkajz44 once again assuring us he is a host.

What I like about HG's posting is that he has some conviction in it. So often in this game we see players post a theory about a person/vote/event/etc. and then end it with "honestly I could be wrong". In a game where only three people know everything, and the rest of us are having to take educated guesses, make assumptions and take chances, we are going to be wrong. That is a given. I don't like the constant hedging or straddling the fence. I like when people make a prognostication, give reasons (asinine or logical) and then evaluate the results. It's okay to say you were wrong after, but to say "Well I might be completely crazy, but Girly is could be the captain." When it turns out that she was a townie, you (general you, not specific to anyone) have your built in excuse saying, "Well I said I might be crazy. Don't pin that one on me. I'm just generating ideas".

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by starseed

You are deflecting responsibility for your votes. Blaming someone else for your own actions is pretty scummy. This is in the same category as clinging to a known townie for direction so as to hide.

What do you mean benefit of the doubt? Do you think he had more information than you did?

Speaking of scummy posts I think we just discovered who was one of the lurkers.
So Legoman was too inactive, gets swapped out for starseed who wants to get the post count up to take the suspicion away. HG and starseed is a pretty decent tandem, I wonder who your 3rd is? You said you were going to look back through the game to make some opinions but you didn't, you basically jumped on me from the start. My gut tells me you are not the Captain either though, the Captain is still a mid to low post count lurker. Good strategy though, HG was driving the ship, now he can back off a bit and let you do some leading. As for benefit of the doubt I was onto him on day 1, everyone was posting that they thought he was town. On day 2 I laid off, even listened to him and look where that got us. But you would already know all this by now right?

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

I did not assure you that Girly was a host. I said I was sure was infected and had the possibility of being a host. I've corrected you on this before and you still say it.

Ok, my bad, you assured us she was a turned passenger. You still assured us she was on scum side.

[dissentowner]

Ok, I will find some time this evening and do a long post with the reasons why I believe HG is scum and has been manipulating and steering the game. It will take some time though.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Ok, I will find some time this evening and do a long post with the reasons why I believe HG is scum and has been manipulating and steering the game. It will take some time though.

Looking forward to it, I hope you come up with more than your previous 2 reasons.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

He speaks in absolutes all the time for one and they have proven to be misleading. He assured us GS was a host, I even gave him the benefit of the doubt there and voted with him and she was a passenger. He has been after me all the time and I know I am town and then when mrkajz44 took a stand for me and he could not get the votes to stay on me he switched to mrkajz44 once again assuring us he is a host. People have this theory that the scum will lay back and lurk but that would be stupid because that is what a lot of the town would expect. Much better to hide in the wide open and try and gain the town's trust. Oling, you wondered why HG would have you get the spore on day 0. I think the answer to that would be obvious no matter who the scum is. 1) You are a strong player, maybe the strongest. 2.) You made a post about getting the spore on day 1, so they pass it to you to hope to turn you or at least start the suspicion train.

Once again you get the rules of the game wrong. The spore was passed to him on night 0, before any posts were made on day 1.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

Once again you get the rules of the game wrong. The spore was passed to him on night 0, before any posts were made on day 1.

Still makes sense to pass it to Oling doesn't it?

[dissentowner]

Ok, in this post I hope to show how HG has steered the game for the scum. How he has built up taking things where he wants while trying to spread the suspicion around. He starts early.
On post #76 he states this.

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

So ECF and Peanut thanked the opening post but haven't said anything in the thread? I'm fairly sure that they thanked it after day 1 started and we were allowed to post.

Probably is nothing, but you never know.

We already know ECF was a passenger but we don't know much about Peanut, still he is getting the ball rolling.
Post #101 is this.

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

There are only 3 hosts to be worried about, I'm not that concerned about the possible 1 infected yet. I think we should put the infected talk/planning on the back burner for now since there is 1 at the most currently. Losing because we all become infected would be death by 1000 cuts, we need to focus on taking out the hosts.

Right now the question is would one of the 3 hosts be trying to lead the charge out of the gate? I'm thinking that MAYBE 1 would be super active (probably not the captain) and the other 2 might be looking to stay in the bush and blend in.

Here he advocates the spore/infected is not important. He knows Oling has it and is hoping for a turn. Interestingly he reveals the same thing I have thought on how the scum would play. Is that a brilliant scum play for revealing that strategy or could I be wrong? We will see.
I am also not going to quote them all but in the first 7 pages a lot of posters were struggling with how the spore works and the rules. HG had the answers to those questions, he knew exactly how the spore worked. Could be nothing, maybe he just grasped it better than the rest of us. Could be something though.
At post 173 there had been some discussion that all the talk was just noise. His response was:

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

Here is my issue with the whole minimize "noise" nonsense.

Right now all but 3 (maybe 4) of us are passengers. If we talk now and hunt for hosts, point out posts that interest us then we have a record of how people behave. If someone is infected by the spore and their victory condition changes then maybe they act differently and we can pick up on it.

Thoughts on that SebC and Elephant?

He does not want a quiet thread, he wants lots of accusations being thrown around, that benefits the scum. The more confusion the better. Then he picks two more players and tries to get some discussion going there, add to the noise and confusion.

On post 186 there is this.

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

mrkjz then comments that activestick has 1 post but it seemed game related, then squiggs comes up with this reason to vote for activestick.

Honestly I am probably wrong, since the odds of lynching a host aren't in our favour but we have to start somewhere.

Vote: squiggs96

Activestick is lying low which HG knows will draw suspicions as the game goes on. Better to try for a stronger player. Interesting that HG is convinced now that mrkjz is a host but here he seems to agree with mrkjz's reasoning on Activestick.

Post #231 confirms what I have seen, he is playing this game more aggressively trying to steer things his way. He is responding to a post to a post by Oling saying that maybe the scum would pass the spore to a weaker player.

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

I can't see it with the way this game is currently going, no one is posting. You and I both know from last game when no one was posting we were more than happy to sit in the weeds and let time drag on.

Here Lego and HG do a couple of posts at each other early so they look at ends with each other but it is all a show to me.

Originally Posted by Lego Man

I've been sitting on this comment for a few days.

I don't have anything actually worth posting in this game yet. It's literally, and I mean LITERALLY much ado about nothing so far. Like someone else mentioned before, it's hard to piece together useful information during the first day - even when looking though the posts after the game is over.

I've sat down and written paragraph-long responses numerous times, only to delete them because... what am I gonna do... accuse someone because they posted on on a minute ending with an odd number while everyone else that hour posted during even minutes? That's essentially the quality of information we have going for us now. Sample size is ridiculously small to draw even the simplest of conclusions.

So Hockeyguy15... what do you expect exactly? What are you trying to do exactly? Should I go back and look at the posting activity of Day -4? How am I supposed to even defend myself if I accuse someone? I voted for Girly, and everyone here knows it's for no good reason. Just a reason.

I wonder what the post count would be for some posters if you factored out them b*tching about other posters not posting. Seems like an easy way to hide in plain sight.

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

In my opinion posting something is better than posting nothing. This is your 4th post and if we wanted to nitpick you should technically have at least 6.

I know day 1 is always a crap shoot but all we are doing is helping the hosts by not posting at all. If we don't post, they don't have to post and they will be less likely to slip up now/down the line.

I know my theories aren't bulletproof and if I get lynched because of them then so be it, that's the game. I would rather go down trying to find hosts rather than go out without leaving a trail in my wake.

More to come...just getting started

[Timbo]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Still makes sense to pass it to Oling doesn't it?

Ask starseed if was privy to all of Lego's PMs
He would then know for sure where it was passed to

SebC silence is disturbing. I feel that Peanuts going to play the whole game with minimal posting.
Diss If you had anything solid or plausable on HG15 I think more could get on your page but for now that does not look to be happening.

Oling, SebC are my guesses for spore carrier

mrkajz44 is still my prime suspect as scum
The starseed sub is disconcerting .
If more people would contribute we could/would have more to work with.

[dissentowner]

Post #293 he changes his vote. Nothing doing on squiggs, that ball didn't roll so now he will help get things going on Activestick, at least it is a town member going down and we all have to be gone for the scum to win.
At #309 and a few posts are exchanged between squiggs and HG.

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

Also when have any games been ruined for the town? The town lost the last game and that was it, and I don't think the game was lost because of 'crazy analysis' from the town.

Originally Posted by squiggs96

Although this is not the place to discuss it, I will vehemently disagree with you here. I'm not taking away from how well the mafia played the game, and they definitely deserved to win, but there were a few strongly worded tangents by townfolk that convinced other townfolk to vote out their own. Perhaps one day, in another thread or in PMs we can chat about my still bitter feelings.

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

Fair enough. It just seems like a fear mongering comment to me, "we lost last game because people had theories that were wrong, so we better ignore all the theories this time so we don't lose!"

Squiggs is right imo. The town destroyed the town more than anything last game with suspicions and those damn Eternals threads. HG wants as many theories on as many posters as possible, that way he can keep the confusion going and steer the ship.
#331 he states he will give Lego and Peanut a free pass. Peanut he has a reason for, she is a newbie, Lego is why again?

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

SebC I have no idea what he is doing, so I am waiting to see what's going to happen. Lego I expect more from so I am giving him a chance to step it up based on a couple of his posts. I'm willing to give Peanut a pass for this vote since I'm hoping she is just new to the game and trying to figure it out.

Next round however if this keeps up I have to assume this is how they are playing the game and I'll adjust my opinion as needed.

Will be interesting to see how much heat he turns up on Lego on the next day.

So Day 2, Activestick is dead, Oling had the spore, he sent it to GS.
post #446 he starts at GS which does make sense, she has the spore.

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

Because you've clearly turned, so we know that you will be dead after you're investigated. After that if we have nothing else to go on they can look at Oling.

[dissentowner]

So I could keep going but what is the point because my goal was to research HG's posts and prove he was scum and steering the town...but I can't. It doesn't add up now, once I went over all of his posts I can see my tunnel vision and most of his posts did have reasoning behind him. I can spin it to make him look scummy but it honestly still doesn't add up. I think I was mistaken, HG is a passenger. You would not believe how hard it is for me to write that though. The evidence to meet however after thouroughly going over it is I am leaning town now. I hate this game sometimes....

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Still makes sense to pass it to Oling doesn't it?

Well my thinking was this; if I was host, as much as I would want hockeyguy15 and GirlySports on my team, I don't think I would send the spore to them right away because if it's found they were turned/had the spore someone might be like "who would send the spore to him/her?" and so early in the game the only real connection would be last game.

So there would be a little bit of an unnecessary risk for Hockeyguy15 to encourage the spore going to me the first night, in my opinion.

I was really hoping to see if anyone pushed the agenda on Day 2 about trying to figure out who would send the spore to me.

[Timbo]

Originally Posted by Timbo

Diss If you had anything solid or plausable on HG15 I think more could get on your page but for now that does not look to be happening.

Posted this when you posted your HG case.
I need to read it to see if it has substance.

[Timbo]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

So I could keep going but what is the point because my goal was to research HG's posts and prove he was scum and steering the town...but I can't. It doesn't add up now, once I went over all of his posts I can see my tunnel vision and most of his posts did have reasoning behind him. I can spin it to make him look scummy but it honestly still doesn't add up. I think I was mistaken, HG is a passenger. You would not believe how hard it is for me to write that though. The evidence to meet however after thouroughly going over it is I am leaning town now. I hate this game sometimes....

Jebus H Cripes Diss lol I can't keep up with your posts and swings.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Timbo

Posted this when you posted your HG case.
I need to read it to see if it has substance.

Too me the more I dug the more I came to the conclusion he is town. I felt my reasonings were being proven more wrong than right when I researched him. I hate to admit when I am wrong but I think I was wrong this time.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Ok, in this post I hope to show how HG has steered the game for the scum. How he has built up taking things where he wants while trying to spread the suspicion around. He starts early.
On post #76 he states this.

We already know ECF was a passenger but we don't know much about Peanut, still he is getting the ball rolling.

You got me there, I was looking for something to go on during day 1 when there wasn't much to go on.

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Post #101 is this.

Here he advocates the spore/infected is not important. He knows Oling has it and is hoping for a turn. Interestingly he reveals the same thing I have thought on how the scum would play. Is that a brilliant scum play for revealing that strategy or could I be wrong? We will see.
I am also not going to quote them all but in the first 7 pages a lot of posters were struggling with how the spore works and the rules. HG had the answers to those questions, he knew exactly how the spore worked. Could be nothing, maybe he just grasped it better than the rest of us. Could be something though.

At post 101 we already knew that if the person wasn't infected we wouldn't find out until day 2, Mazrim said so on post 54. So the talk about infected wasn't going to get us anywhere because there was either 1 infected person would wouldn't say they were, or we wouldn't know until the next day who was passed the spore to start. If I was scum I wouldn't be hoping Oling was turned, it says right in the rules the hosts always know who is turned. I'm not sure how I supposedly knew more about the spore and the rules than anyone else? The answer to pretty much all the questions are in the rules, then Mazrim clarified a couple other points in the thread.

Originally Posted by dissentowner

At post 173 there had been some discussion that all the talk was just noise. His response was:


He does not want a quiet thread, he wants lots of accusations being thrown around, that benefits the scum. The more confusion the better. Then he picks two more players and tries to get some discussion going there, add to the noise and confusion.

I wanted people talking because as the game goes on and people are infected by the spore their posting habits and ideas may change, so I wanted a record of that to look back on. The reason I asked what Seb and PE thought is because they were both saying less posting was better.

Originally Posted by dissentowner

On post 186 there is this.


Activestick is lying low which HG knows will draw suspicions as the game goes on. Better to try for a stronger player. Interesting that HG is convinced now that mrkjz is a host but here he seems to agree with mrkjz's reasoning on Activestick.

ActiveStick is town, if I was a host why would I care what he did? Where in that post did I say mrkajz was a host and where did I agree with his reasoning?

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Post #231 confirms what I have seen, he is playing this game more aggressively trying to steer things his way. He is responding to a post to a post by Oling saying that maybe the scum would pass the spore to a weaker player.

Actually if you look back Timbo asked who everyone thought was passed the spore. I said that question made me think Timbo was town because at that time no one was posting so it made no sense for the hosts to get people thinking about that. Oling replied saying maybe it was to get us thinking they passed it to a strong player so we would vote them out. That is when I said I couldn't see them doing that since no one was posting, because last game Oling and I were fine sitting back and not saying a word when no one else was.

Originally Posted by dissentowner

'
Here Lego and HG do a couple of posts at each other early so they look at ends with each other but it is all a show to me.

So I called Lego out for not posting a lot, he responded, and I said I wanted people to post more so we had a record to go back and look at.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Timbo

Jebus H Cripes Diss lol I can't keep up with your posts and swings.

I know. The thing is you can build an argument against anyone really but for me it just fell apart. No matter what he thinks of me I have to lay off HG now that I am leaning toward town now because he can be a benefit against the scum. I suck at this, lol.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Too me the more I dug the more I came to the conclusion he is town. I felt my reasonings were being proven more wrong than right when I researched him. I hate to admit when I am wrong but I think I was wrong this time.

WOW...All this time I said go back and actually look at my posts instead of being lazy and you fought me, now you actually joined the game and did some digging and look what happens.

Should I even bother going back and addressing part 2 of your post?