Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

[Flabbibulin]

Originally Posted by Muta

How is a religious debate not appropriate in this thread? It's directly the cause of the shootings today. All associated discussion on everything that happened today should be welcome in here.

Ah yes, the 'ol PC way of approaching this. It can't be ok to just hate on and blame Islam... we have to blame all religions equally! Which is fine with me I guess. I have no use for any type of religion.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

I'm not sure if it was Richard Dawkins or someone else I heard, but he was saying (satirizing) that for a guy who build this complex planet in six days, formulating fire, wind, water, earth, air, mountains, plains, volcanoes, etc. and building this perfect world for life . . . Why is he apparently so obsessed about things humans do now, like playing with their ######s or which direction you face when you pray? Does that sound like a competent, all-knowing entity that runs the show and loves everyone equally? Seems pretty petty to worry about stuff like that, given the size of the solar system and beyond.

Religion is a human manifestation and something to kill time with between birth and death.

NSFW!

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Muta

How is a religious debate not appropriate in this thread? It's directly the cause of the shootings today. All associated discussion on everything that happened today should be welcome in here.

I totally disagree.

The fundamental issue is freedom of religion and speech. People have a right to believe the religion they want. People saying that religion in general is the problem are no different than people saying you v should only believe in X religion.

We need to have tolerance of belief, not an attack on a person's right to believe the religion of their choice.

[polak]

I don't tolerate the belief of killing in the name of religion.

[cDnStealth]

Originally Posted by polak

I don't tolerate the belief of killing in the name of religion.

Don't kid yourself. If it wasn't killing in the name of religion it would be killing in the name of something else. If there is one thing religious debates have taught me it's that atheists are just as annoying as devout religious people.

[speede5]

Originally Posted by Muta

How is a religious debate not appropriate in this thread? It's directly the cause of the shootings today. All associated discussion on everything that happened today should be welcome in here.

Because it's not a debate, it's a lynchmob. Everytime something bad happens that can be linked to religion all the atheists of the internet unite, light their torches, grab their pitchforks and hit the keyboard for another anti-religion circle jerk.

My God doesn't want these things, but this world doesn't want Him either. You(the world) blame a God you don't believe in for not acting when you have told him flat out to get lost. Why get all shocked when he doesn't intervene?

You ever try and control a teenager? Tell them what not to do? Watch them f up because they won't listen? Not much you can do but be there for them when they come around. Same deal. We(humanity) don't want to follow rules or be told how to do things. We're so smart we can manage it all on our own. Big surprise it's turned into such a gong show.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

that's not how it works unless you have a god that doesn't believe in the will.

The Lord helps those who help themselves.

I'm not religious at all, but the reason why God allows evil in this world is to test the faith of his followers.

that's crazy.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by blankall

I totally disagree.

The fundamental issue is freedom of religion and speech. People have a right to believe the religion they want. People saying that religion in general is the problem are no different than people saying you v should only believe in X religion.

We need to have tolerance of belief, not an attack on a person's right to believe the religion of their choice.

Islamic extremism is the cause of today's shootings. How is discussing this not relevant to the thread? I did probably veer off topic earlier, but will keep it more on the specific issues at hand now as opposed to religion as a whole.

[polak]

Originally Posted by speede5

You ever try and control a teenager? Tell them what not to do? Watch them f up because they won't listen? Not much you can do but be there for them when they come around. Same deal. We(humanity) don't want to follow rules or be told how to do things. We're so smart we can manage it all on our own. Big surprise it's turned into such a gong show.

Funny. Your God has to be the biggest example of an absentee parent I have ever heard of... Maybe that's why we "teenagers" are the way we are...

[WCW Nitro]

As a Muslim, I really don't think there is any solution. The Taliban/ISIS supporters were cheering the fact that 130 kids died in a Pakistani school shooting-and they were Muslim. How the heck do you counteract that kind of thinking? They think there is a global war, not just between non-Muslims and Muslims, but also between regular Muslims and them.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by speede5

Everytime something bad happens that can be linked to religion all the atheists of the internet unite, light their torches, grab their pitchforks and hit the keyboard for another anti-religion circle jerk.

I must have missed the memo from my fellow atheists, because I haven't joined in an internet circle-jerk to blame all religious people for today's massacre. In fact, I've been among the people in this thread who have been defending moderate, peaceful, law-abiding Muslims (who comprise the majority of that religion's adherents) and urging others not to lump them together with the radical Islamic extremists.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

that's not how it works unless you have a god that doesn't believe in the will.

The Lord helps those who help themselves.

I'm not religious at all, but the reason why God allows evil in this world is to test the faith of his followers.

Never got this line of 'reason', it's god, an all knowing being, he knows exactly how much faith you have as he created you, he doesn't need to test us, nor do we need to be tested, we are his creation, what we do is, by definition, all his creation.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I must have missed the memo from my fellow atheists, because I haven't been blaming all religious people for today's massacre. In fact, I've been among the people in this thread who have been defending moderate, peaceful, law-abiding Muslims (who comprise the majority of that religion's adherents) and urging others not to lump them together with the radical Islamic extremists.

I agree, there's nothing wrong with moderate, peaceful, law-abiding Muslims. Or any people of any religion for that matter. It's the extremists, like those d!ckbags that did what they did today, that do it in the name or religion that inevitably initiates any religious debate.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by WCW Nitro

As a Muslim, I really don't think there is any solution. The Taliban/ISIS supporters were cheering the fact that 130 kids died in a Pakistani school shooting-and they were Muslim. How the heck do you counteract that kind of thinking? They think there is a global war, not just between non-Muslims and Muslims, but also between regular Muslims and them.

I have hope that the extremes of Sunni philosophy have got so out of extreme it will cause a movement back towards a more Sufist view of the faith, not holding my breathe though.

[scottish_flame]

Can't help but hate that religion to be honest

[WCW Nitro]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

I have hope that the extremes of Sunni philosophy have got so out of extreme it will cause a movement back towards a more Sufist view of the faith, not holding my breathe though.

I don't think it will happen. The extremists like one thing more than killing, and that is being in the headlines. They relish the fact that the world talks about them. The larger the attack, the more attention they get, and the happier they are.

[Huntingwhale]

Stuff like this is why I worship Zeus

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

Stuff like this is why I worship Zeus

Isn't he the god of sky and thunder? He's probably responsible for the killing of more human beings than anyone else - pitchforks and burning at the stake!

[Senator Clay Davis]

As was feared when Westerners started going to fight with ISIS en masse, the suspected gunman are Saïd and Chérif Kouachi who just returned from Syria. (article is in French)

http://www.charentelibre.fr/2015/01/...do,1933643.php

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by WCW Nitro

I don't think it will happen. The extremists like one thing more than killing, and that is being in the headlines. They relish the fact that the world talks about them. The larger the attack, the more attention they get, and the happier they are.

I don't think anything will change the wack jobs, but funding for the madras's, political support in Saudi and Pakistan, to be honest I find the application of rape and blasphemy laws in Pakistan far more disturbing than this idiocy as that does speak to something being profoundly wrong in both the religion and the body politic of the region.