Uniformed Soldier Shot at War Memorial in Ottawa-R.I.P. Cpl. Cirillo

[zukes]

Originally Posted by Acey

Handheld metal detectors and patdowns at Rexall for Capitals/Oilers.

This happens at Blue Jays games, happened at the Columbus game last weekend, Leafs game last year...surprised this doesn't happen yet everywhere.

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by Acey

Handheld metal detectors and patdowns at Rexall for Capitals/Oilers.

Calgary as well, for a while now.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Grimbl420

Radical groups like the UN?

This isn't a thread about the UN, but my thoughts on that organization have been made very clear in the past, and I'd prefer that we don't get into that here because it has nothing at all to do with the last three days or the situation with ISil

[OffsideSpecialist]

Good news is that the downtown lockdown has been lifted (courtesy Police Press Release via Live 88.5 Facebook page), though investigations continue.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I do agree with an earlier post, Canada is now at war.

With who? Angry, white, French dudes?

[J epworth]

Originally Posted by browna

As mentioned, really odd (and not sure we'll ever know) how the guy waltzed within a door of caucus meetings deep into the Centre block.

He strolled past McIver (I assume after shooting the solider) through a big open square/parking lot structure, after he drove his car as close as he did, so its not as if he tried to sneak in.

Is there not camera security around our Parliament that could've seen a guy carrying a shotgun, coming? Cameras at the War Memorial may have also helped prevent another shootout (sadly, not the tragic and senseless loss of life).

Not to turn this into a big brother issue, but on Parliament Hill, Federal Buldings and monuments, there should be absolutely full camera scrutiny 24.7...really, all of downtown Ottawa in my opinion.

It's the question that lots of people are asking, it is very weird how he was able to make it so far into Centre Block before shooting began. Taking McIver's testimony, and others that saw him walking on parliament hill, I think there was a lot of confusion about the calm that this guy had. He was walking to centre block from all accounts, which on camera would not look like someone who is a threat. How he got in through the doors he used is the biggest question, from all accounts today that entrance is usually fairly secure, you think he would have had to fire his weapon just to get into the building, but it doesn't sound like he did.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Grimbl420

I wonder what ISIS' thoughts about Israel are.

Probably the same thought that they have against anyone that doesn't ascribe to their evil ideology.

Murderous Genocidal hatred.

Lets ask about their thoughts about Christians, Muslims who don't follow their interpretation, Gays, Agnostics, Atheists, woman and children.

But frankly who gives a good god damn what ISIS thinks about Israel.

Your trying to make a point where none exists.

[combustiblefuel]

Originally Posted by browna

As mentioned, really odd (and not sure we'll ever know) how the guy waltzed within a door of caucus meetings deep into the Centre block.

He strolled past McIver (I assume after shooting the solider) through a big open square/parking lot structure, after he drove his car as close as he did, so its not as if he tried to sneak in.

Is there not camera security around our Parliament that could've seen a guy carrying a shotgun, coming? Cameras at the War Memorial may have also helped prevent another shootout (sadly, not the tragic and senseless loss of life).

Not to turn this into a big brother issue, but on Parliament Hill, Federal Buldings and monuments, there should be absolutely full camera scrutiny 24.7...really, all of downtown Ottawa in my opinion.

This was addressed. They said they can't be looking at all the screens at once.

[flylock shox]

Text of Harper's speech for those who missed it:

For the second time this week, there has been a brutal and violent attack on our soil.

Today, our thoughts and prayers are with the family and friends of Cpl. Nathan Cirillo of the Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders. Cpl. Cirillo was killed today, murdered in cold blood, as he provided a ceremonial honour guard at Canada's National War Memorial. That sacred place that pays tribute to those that gave their lives so that we could live in a free, democratic and safe society.#

Likewise, our thoughts and prayers remain also with the family and friends of Warrant Officer Patrice Vincent who was killed earlier this week by an ISIL inspired terrorist. Tonight, we also pray for the speedy recovery of the others injured in these despicable attacks.#

Fellow Canadians, we've also been reminded today of the compassionate and courageous nature of so many Canadians, like those private citizens and first responders who came to provide aid for Cpl. Cirillo as he fought for his life -- and of course the members of our security forces in the RCMP, the City of Ottawa police and in parliament who came quickly at great risk to themselves to assist those of us who were close to the attack.#

Fellow Canadians, in the days that come, we will learn more about the terrorist and any accomplices he may have had. But this week's events are a grim reminder that Canada is not immune to the types of terrorist attacks that we have seen elsewhere around the world.#We are also reminded that attacks on our security personnel and our institutions of governments are, by their very nature, attacks on our country, on our values, on our society, on us Canadians, as a free and democratic people who embrace human dignity for all.#

But, let there be no misunderstanding. We will not be intimidated. Canada will never be intimidated. In fact, this will lead us to strengthen our resolve and re-double our efforts and those of our national security agencies to take all necessary steps to identify and counter threats and keep Canada safe here at home. Just as it will lead us to strengthen our resolve and re-double our efforts to work with our allies around the world and fight against the terrorist organizations who brutalize those in other countries with the hope of bringing their savagery to our shores. They will have no safe haven.#

Today has been, without question, a difficult day. I have every confidence that Canadians will pull together with the kind of firm solidarity that has seen our country through many challenges. Together we will remain vigilant against those at home or abroad who wish to harm us.#

For now, Lorraine and Ben and Rachel and I join all Canadians in praying for those touched by today's attack. May God bless them and keep our land glorious and free."

[Grimbl420]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Your trying to make a point where none exists.

They most definitely exist, It's whether you choose to acknowledge them or not.

[combustiblefuel]

Originally Posted by rubecube

With who? Angry, white, French dudes?

Well we are bombing In Iraq.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by flylock shox

You've had great insight into the ISIS issue in another thread CC. I've enjoyed reading your posts on the subject, and the difficulty in addressing the threat, particularly where individual actors are concerned.

A question I'd like to pose to you is where you draw the line (or whether you draw a line at all) between: (1) a person who sees some appeal in ISIS, learns about them and believes in their cause, gets in touch with them, gets direction from them, and conducts an attack like today's; and (2) a person with mental health issues and a propensity for violent or anti-government thinking who latches onto ISIS-inspired ideology as a basis for carrying out an attack like today's, but without a real understanding or genuine attachment to the ideology itself.

Obviously person 1 is what you'd think of as your classic single-cell or lone-wolf terrorist; while person 2 might be your run-of-the-mill survivalist-paranoiac-freeman-on-the-land type who doesn't really belong to or even fully understand the ideology he's serving.

Is one a terrorist and the other not? Are they both terrorists? Does it matter?

I subscribe to the interpretation of threats in this case and not motives. You need to cancel the threat first in this case.

While I agree that nations are going to have to deal with root causes that create what seems to be a fairly fertile recruiting base. Once their radicalized and preparing for an action, whether they're mentally ill or a loner or whatever to me isn't relevant in the face of public safety.

Also sometimes its too easy to label people with the "Mental Illness" label when they do something that we don't see as rational in our mind set to justify and feel better about humanity as a whole. The whole "a sane person" wouldn't do that.

I don't know if I'm answering your question, however to end that string Osama Bin Laden was a very rational human being in his personal world view, and his sense of right and wrong was defined by his interpretation of his religion and a twisted world view, he wasn't by most definitions insane, however his actions by some could be interpreted as Insane.

But to me, in both cases they're terrorists because they committed an act of terror and they could justify it as the right thing to do.

The proper question of number two though to be honest and it defines state of mind, does he has an understanding of the consequences of his actions?

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Grimbl420

They most definitely exist, It's whether you choose to acknowledge them or not.

Sorry I completely disagree with what your trying to get at, blaming Canada's support of Israel on attacks inspired by a terrorist group that hasn't even bought Isreal into their ideology makes little to no sense.

I will respectfully disagree with what your saying.

But have a nice night.

[Acey]

Originally Posted by rubecube

With who? Angry, white, French dudes?

Well yesterday we did send 600 people and 10 airplanes to fight ISIS. So we're fighting somebody.

[Arya Stark]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Sorry I completely disagree with what your trying to get at, blaming Canada's support of Israel on attacks inspired by a terrorist group that hasn't even bought Isreal into their ideology makes little to no sense.

I will respectfully disagree with what your saying.

But have a nice night.

Has there been any confirmation this had anything to do with a terrorist group?

[scottish_flame]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Probably the same thought that they have against anyone that doesn't ascribe to their evil ideology.

Murderous Genocidal hatred.

Lets ask about their thoughts about Christians, Muslims who don't follow their interpretation, Gays, Agnostics, Atheists, woman and children.

But frankly who gives a good god damn what ISIS thinks about Israel.

Your trying to make a point where none exists.

Every post you type is well thought out and bring some great points into the thread

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Acey

Well yesterday we did send 600 people and 10 airplanes to fight ISIS. So we're fighting somebody.

Oh I'm with you there. I'm just wondering how today's events put us in a more war-like state than we were yesterday.

[combustiblefuel]

Originally Posted by Arya Stark

Has there been any confirmation this had anything to do with a terrorist group?

They choose there words very carefully not to confirm or Deny.

[J epworth]

Trudeau just spoke:
"Losing ourselves to fear and speculation is the intention of those who commit this heinous acts."

"We will remember who we are. We are a proud democracy. A welcoming and peaceful nation."

"Canadians know acts committed in the name of Islam is an aberration to your faith."

"Staying true to our values in a time of crisis will make us an example to the world."

All three leaders talk about how we will not be swayed by fear, that this event will not change Canada.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Grimbl420

I wonder what ISIS' thoughts about Israel are.

Interestingly enough they are completely avoiding the subject. Probably because it is the one country that would unequivocally and ruthlessly destroy them at this point.

Keeping the dog on the chain so to say.