Jay Feaster update (Stan Fischler interview)

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by edslunch

Can we put this it was the scout not the GM thing to bed? The GM is responsible for everything the team does. If he chooses not to overrule his scouts that's still a choice. He's responsible for the scouts, the broad draft criteria and actually making the pick. I have no problem if he delegates to his staff but the buck still stops with him. History will judge that he is a good or bad drafter regardless how he went about it

can he get credit/critisism if he didn't watch a single game? There is a article (referenced here on CP) that one of the years Feaster was a GM, he did not watch a single junior hockey game.

[Chill Cosby]

Originally Posted by codynw

Getting rid of Bork was a win no matter what the return was, but getting Cammalleri back, as well as getting Ramo?

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Erixon for 2 2nd's and Horak.

Both true! Which goes to show you there are probably a lot of opinions on the guy made without remembering the little things.

He certainly had his wins. Horak wasn't anything remarkable, but those 2nds have absolutely helped improved our fortunes.

Originally Posted by edslunch

Can we put this it was the scout not the GM thing to bed? The GM is responsible for everything the team does. If he chooses not to overrule his scouts that's still a choice. He's responsible for the scouts, the broad draft criteria and actually making the pick. I have no problem if he delegates to his staff but the buck still stops with him. History will judge that he is a good or bad drafter regardless how he went about it

All true. That's what Feaster did, and it's the unfortunate part of how he did it. When you go "hands off" at the draft you put all your trust in the scouts, you give up credit for their wins, but you're still saddled with responsibility for the losses, because you're the guy who is supposed to stop them from making mistakes.

Perhaps Feaster's worst mistake was talking too much. It seems like many of his mistakes were amplified by his own explanation of them, and his victories diminished by the very same.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

can he get credit/critisism if he didn't watch a single game? There is a article (referenced here on CP) that one of the years Feaster was a GM, he did not watch a single junior hockey game.

Yes. He was ultimately responsible for all the drafting. It might be that he simply didn't screw it up, fine, but he still is responsible for the results good or bad. If he followed Buttons list but let Weisbrod overrule on Jankowski he is equally responsible for both. This shouldn't be confused with him having a good eye for talent of course

[Hackey]

Landing O'Reilly could have been crippling to the franchise. We would 100% be without Monahan and Kanzig right now. Almost guaranteed we wouldn't have Bennett. And worst of all O'Reilly could very well be leaving us in 2 years just like he likely will in Colorado. Would we have still traded Iginla and Jbo? Who knows. All I do know is we would be without our two best prospects and O'Reilly would likely be counting down the days till free agency.

[CaramonLS]

The sheer amount of mental gymnastics that some people continue to practice when it comes to Jay Feaster is simply astounding.

But here are some facts:

He was fired by the Flames
He isn't employed a Hockey Ops Capacity (His current position is basically PR)
He will not be employed as a GM in the NHL again (If you disagree, I have a standing offer for anyone who wants to take it)

Some of the posts in this thread make it sound like we just fired Ken Holland or Lou Lamerello. I think that since Calgary really hasn't had a decent GM since Fletcher is skewing the vision of some people.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by Chill Cosby

I'm unaware of any trade he completed where he got anything more than the absolute bare minimum you would expect in return.

Traded Piskula for McGrattan
Traded Comeau for a 5th
Traded 5th for Russell
Traded 4th for Colborne
I thought we won the Smid trade

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

The sheer amount of mental gymnastics that some people continue to practice when it comes to Jay Feaster is simply astounding.

That works both ways.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by Jacks

That works both ways.

Not really.

If Jay Feaster is so truly under appreciated by many segments of the fan base, why is he not employed in a hockey ops capacity on another NHL team?

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Jacks

Traded Piskula for McGrattan
Traded Comeau for a 5th
Traded 5th for Russell
Traded 4th for Colborne
I thought we won the Smid trade

We absolutely won the Smid trade. We got a solid NHLer for a tweener and a goalie prospect (by definition, a long shot)

[FAN]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

can he get credit/critisism if he didn't watch a single game? There is a article (referenced here on CP) that one of the years Feaster was a GM, he did not watch a single junior hockey game.

An NHL GM should at least watch the Memorial Cup. Geez.

[dino7c]

Jay Feaster will never be an NHL GM again, that is all that needs to be said

[MolsonInBothHands]

Darryl Sutter and Craig Button may never GM again either. Risebrough scored another GM job. What does it all mean?

Nothing.

All these absolutes are absolutely silly.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I totally agree.

My problem in all of this is that people are so sour on Feaster for this fireable offence that they feel the need to rewrite Feaster's entire history with the Flames into a comprehensive narrative of utter incompetence. It wasn't. Feaster had good days in Calgary. He made good decisions while he was here. While those in no way rectify the damage done by this egregious error and the balance of his less than satisfactory full tenure, it's ridiculous to pretend that he did virtually everything wrong.

There is an insanely long list of blunders and near misses for his short tenure with the club that were/would have been horrific for the franchise.

People are giving way too much credit for the simply doing his job aspect where he neither won nor lost transactions. For me, the only positive of his reign is that he was able to get the team to finally rebuild (if that was even by his design or not).

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Not really.

If Jay Feaster is so truly under appreciated by many segments of the fan base, why is he not employed in a hockey ops capacity on another NHL team?

And why was his job prior to the Flames blogging in his sweatpants for THN? Clearly, the rest of the league has a pretty clear opinion of his ability...

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Not really.

If Jay Feaster is so truly under appreciated by many segments of the fan base, why is he not employed in a hockey ops capacity on another NHL team?

People on both sides of the argument have gone to silly lengths. You have people here claiming that Feaster never made a good trade so it works both ways.

I don't think Feaster was particularly great but he doesn't even come close to the worst GM we have had, he was mediocre IMO.

[browna]

KK and the owners (Edwards) got fleeced by Feaster twice (at least). After Sutter, who Edwards wanted out earlier, Feaster took advantage of the situation to both get the AGM job and then and used his slick lawyer-speak and said and did whatever needed to be said to get the full time gig....which included allowing Edwards and King to be more aware/part of the day to day decision making, an attitude that was so anti-Sutter and so much of a change and a potential boost to those guy's need for control, that it was convincing enough to convince the executive.

It was clear though that after you got past the cliches, "doing the opposite" at every turn from Sutter after he left (remember the "I'll let the guys turn up of the music after the game" line?) to placate his weary bosses and some in the fanbase who wanted a change from "stick in the mud" Sutter, and his expanded vocabulary, that his cache and reputation, where it really mattered, in the league and with players, GM and agents, was pretty spotty. He went for his home run in Richards, then blamed Sutter for his cap situation and made irrational moves with Regher and others in the leadup. After that, a lot of shuffling of deck chairs. Empty, heated proclamations of massive changes, odd drafting choices etc, etc.

He played his final card in getting Hartley here, hooking onto his wagon. I think that year he started really relying on King and Edwards to provide advice (especially with Iginla) in that last season, and I think those guys soon realized he didn't have the ability to be an NHL GM and deal with the situations and make things happen (which involve a lot of moving peices). It was clear that that Sutter, through straight talk and honesty, was able to do a lot of things the executive took for granted, effortlessly as coach and GM.

The O'Reilly things sealed his fate...100% his responsibility, and for the first time in his almost 3 years here, he went/was forced silent for more then 3 weeks until the few days before the Iginla trade. With the short season and Iginla trade looming, KK and Edwards couldn't ditch the GM at that point, but he was as done as dinner at that point. Pissing off agents and others around the league with further bumbling of the Iginla Boston/Pittsburgh thing was the cherry on top. As has others above had said, he was working for the Hockey News prior to being AGM, and now is a poor man's Jim Peplinski in his alumni role with Tampa right now.

The window was too short for Edwards to get Shanahan or Burke before the draft last year, so I think Button ran that show.

The only positive out of the tenure is that it made the owners/Edward realize they shouldn't mess around with /weren't cut out for hockey operations. Also, that the need for a well respected, strong, no nonsense leader with a solid and proven league reputation league, as they had in Sutter but possibly didn't fully appreciate, until they saw the all flash and no substance alternative, was once again required.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Jacks

People on both sides of the argument have gone to silly lengths. You have people here claiming that Feaster never made a good trade so it works both ways.

I don't think Feaster was particularly great but he doesn't even come close to the worst GM we have had, he was mediocre IMO.

The only trade that I think took any skill was acquiring Cammallari but even then he made the team smaller.

As someone else said he managed to put the team into a rebuild situation which was good but it was his failure that put the team into that situation.

[Hackey]

Cammalleri and Montreal were having problems and he wanted out. We also gave up the 36th overall pick. Sure we picked up Ramo but that type of goalie can be had easily. Hiller perfect example who is even better and we didn't have to give up anything to get.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

The sheer amount of mental gymnastics that some people continue to practice when it comes to Jay Feaster is simply astounding.

Originally Posted by browna

KK and the owners (Edwards) got fleeced by Feaster twice (at least). After Sutter, who Edwards wanted out earlier, Feaster took advantage of the situation to both get the AGM job and then and used his slick lawyer-speak and said and did whatever needed to be said to get the full time gig....which included allowing Edwards and King to be more aware/part of the day to day decision making, an attitude that was so anti-Sutter and so much of a change and a potential boost to those guy's need for control, that it was convincing enough to convince the executive.

It was clear though that after you got past the cliches, "doing the opposite" at every turn from Sutter after he left (remember the "I'll let the guys turn up of the music after the game" line?) to placate his weary bosses and some in the fanbase who wanted a change from "stick in the mud" Sutter, and his expanded vocabulary, that his cache and reputation, where it really mattered, in the league and with players, GM and agents, was pretty spotty. He went for his home run in Richards, then blamed Sutter for his cap situation and made irrational moves with Regher and others in the leadup. After that, a lot of shuffling of deck chairs. Empty, heated proclamations of massive changes, odd drafting choices etc, etc.

He played his final card in getting Hartley here, hooking onto his wagon. I think that year he started really relying on King and Edwards to provide advice (especially with Iginla) in that last season, and I think those guys soon realized he didn't have the ability to be an NHL GM and deal with the situations and make things happen (which involve a lot of moving peices). It was clear that that Sutter, through straight talk and honesty, was able to do a lot of things the executive took for granted, effortlessly as coach and GM.

Hey CaramonLS, here are some gymnastics for you. Feaster is apparently both a moron and an evil mastermind at the same time

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

The only trade that I think took any skill was acquiring Cammallari but even then he made the team smaller.

As someone else said he managed to put the team into a rebuild situation which was good but it was his failure that put the team into that situation.

I think getting Horak+two 2nd's was pretty good, as was Kris Russell.

Also, Jiri Hudler was a very astute pickup, a very perfect fit.

But I agree that the best thing Feaster did was that he did such a bad job he forced the team into a proper rebuild... a semi-competant GM may have kept delaying the rebuild. And it helped show ownership we need a hockey guy at the top (Burke) and I have a lot of hope for Treliving & co, so I guess all's well that end's well.