[News] Roman Horak to the KHL

[Henry Fool]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

My how some have short memories. Most of you ranked him higher than Granlund and Reinhart last summer. The proof is there;

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=129804

So ranking him the 12th best prospect amounts to grossly overrating him?

Prospect evaluations change from year to year, for obvious reasons. Not just for fans, for the teams as well. Not a huge difference between ranking him 12th instead of 14th.

[sun]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I dunno. I felt both guys were better prospects at the time without the use of a crystal ball.

The king of self-back-patting returns. Looks like it took you till round 11 to vote for Granlund. What a huge difference - no wonder you are so proud. Would you still put Knight at #5?

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Henry Fool

So ranking him the 12th best prospect amounts to grossly overrating him?

Prospect evaluations change from year to year, for obvious reasons. Not just for fans, for the teams as well. Not a huge difference between ranking him 12th instead of 14th.

And 12th best prospect doesn't even mean many thought he was nhl bound. In fact, I think most said he wouldn't likely make it...

[FlamesAddiction]

I admit, I had high hopes for him making the NHL full-time as a bottom 6 forward. I still think he could play on some teams in that roll.

The thing is with the Flames, as bad as we used to be when it came to drafting top 6 talent, we were actually pretty good at finding bottom 6 muckers and there was always someone just a little better than Horak to lean on. He always seemed close, but there was no cigar.

I think he'd stand a pretty good chance to make the Oilers next season though.

[Vinny01]

Wow reading the hf thread on this topic and the fan rationalization that Smid is terrible and it was a good trade. One poster claiming we couldn't trade Smid for a 7th at the deadline? Lol

Smid has been a warrior for the Flames and is a great bottom pairing D/penalty killer who is just entering his prime.

There are a few Oiler fans who rip the trade but it seems the majority are trying to say we too a boat anchor contract and they got a stud goalie prospect

[CalgaryFan1988]

^^^ good. I hope they keep believing their management team is smarter than everyone else.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

I guess to be fair, the website says he signed a 1 year deal. Oilers have his NHL rights for another 4 years.

Could be a Mark Giordano type deal where he goes to Russia for a year then comes back to win a roster spot.

I'm thinking there's a big difference here, Gio is Canadian and Horak is Czech.

Gio didn't want to be there but stood his ground for bigger pay, Horak will happily stay there forever as long as they pay him.

[puckluck2]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

No just proving that fans here overrated Horak. At least I can go back to those threads and pick out the posts where I was saying the same things then as I am today that he was going to be an AHL tweener.

Oh really?

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Horak will never be a star but he looks to have potential as a versatile 3rd line mainstay in the NHL.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by puckluck2

Oh really?

[Scoreface]

So it's a big stinky finger in the Oiler's faces and he likes their Soviet skyline better than Edmonton's. still think he would have been their best two way guy since Brodziak, but both are long gone now.

Really says a lot about their 2 bit point producing exit interview stage left run joke show side show of a carnival there. Those guys and cup rings et al should be ashamed of themselves.

Smid and Roy for Brossoit. Okee dokee !

[Calgary4LIfe]

The prospect rankings conducted left a lot of room for individual interpretation on how they should be ranked. The posters who ranked Horak much higher than rest did so because he had more NHL games under his belt and was more 'proven', and thus closer to making the NHL.

I don't think they were wrong for doing so - that was the criteria (which was undefined in the polls) that they used.

Perhaps this year a bit more of an explanation on criteria that posters should consider when voting may be of some benefit. I myself would rank prospects drastically different if we were using 'ceiling' vs 'floor', or potential impact vs closer to NHL ready, for instance. I think I weighed my own criteria as ceiling, then probability of getting there, then floor, then NHL ready (though I didn't see Horak as being a scrub either, and have no idea where I ended up ranking him to be honest).

I remember in those polls some posters calling out Horak as being very underrated because of the fact he had so many NHL games under his belt. They were bang-on according to their criteria. I am assuming the intent was to leave the interpretation open as to what criteria to use, but when people were weighing NHL experience too highly (or being more NHL ready vs another prospect) I do think it can skew the results.

I am too lazy to search and review the results, but it would lead to situations like Bouma or Hanowski being rated higher than Monahan and Gaudreau at the time (not that anyone did - just making a bit of an extreme example to illustrate the point).

What would be interesting to me (and I doubt this would happen as it would leave the forum a bit cluttered) is to have two concurrent polls for "Most NHL ready" and "Most Value"/"Highest Ceiling" or something like that. Would make for some interesting discussion and would be interesting to see where they start to intersect. For instance, I would rank Jankowski easily in the top 4 or 5 in the "ceiling" or "potential impact" poll, but would be much lower on the list of "NHL ready".

I actually quite liked the prospect polls, as it was interesting to see what everyone thought of each prospect and what the rationales behind their voting behaviors were - looking forward to doing that exercise again.

[4oh3]

With Orts and Gillies in the system I'd count Brossoit to be expendable as of right now, even though were flames fans it's clear calgary won the trade. We got an established NHL quality defenceman who has grit. He is what the oilers need but oiler fans will say how Smid played awful for them and Brossoit is tearing up the ECHL.

[Drury18]

Apparently Roman is liberating the Oilers prospects/players now.

Denis Grebeshkov also signed with Vityaz today.
http://www.hcvityaz.ru/news.php?full=1301

[codynw]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

[Coach]

Hahahaha that XMen GIF needs to be split up. Each reaction is so perfect for different things. Hugh Jackman's would have been perfect for this scenario. While Fassbender would be great for like a "Woah, slow down/back up" moment. And McAvoy would work for something that is awesome/nut shot.

[Plett25]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Yeah he was and the evidence is in the prospect rankings thing we did over the summer where guys like him and Cundari were ranked ludicrously high by fans.

A good indication of what Calgarypuck thought of Horak is the reaction to when he was traded. Here's the most thanked post on the first 2 pages of the thread...

Originally Posted by 868904

wow overreaction here...

Smid is a quality NHL defenseman.

Horak really has no place on the Flames and Broissot is still years away and there's still a lot of uncertainty.

I really don't see how this helps the Oilers right now.

I see how it helps the Flames though.

The other highly thanked posts talked about Horak being a depth prospect and being unlikely to pass anyone on the depth chart.

There were lots of negative posts, but they generally weren't thanked... it was like the nattering nabobs of negativity felt a need to post, while posters ok with trading Horak for Smid thanked positive post.

So at the very least, Calgarypuck was split on Roman Horak as a prospect. Although pretty much all of us really wanted him to succeed to rub Erixon's nose in it.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by Plett25

A good indication of what Calgarypuck thought of Horak is the reaction to when he was traded. Here's the most thanked post on the first 2 pages of the thread...

The other highly thanked posts talked about Horak being a depth prospect and being unlikely to pass anyone on the depth chart.

There were lots of negative posts, but they generally weren't thanked... it was like the nattering nabobs of negativity felt a need to post, while posters ok with trading Horak for Smid thanked positive post.

So at the very least, Calgarypuck was split on Roman Horak as a prospect. Although pretty much all of us really wanted him to succeed to rub Erixon's nose in it.

To be fair, a lot of times those threads start out pretty vague with not a lot of information and people tend to react/overreact. I think as soon as the whole trade was confirmed it was pretty unanimous that the trade benefited the Flames and could have benefited the Oilers if Horak was actually playing there but his defensive play was just too damn good.

I think most people considered that Horak may have been a full-time NHLer, but there was no guarantee of that, but combine the fact that he returned an established NHL dman was pretty hilarious considering the Oilers' needs.

[The Fonz]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Yeah he was and the evidence is in the prospect rankings thing we did over the summer where guys like him and Cundari were ranked ludicrously high by fans.

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

My how some have short memories. Most of you ranked him higher than Granlund and Reinhart last summer. The proof is there;

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=129804

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I dunno. I felt both guys were better prospects at the time without the use of a crystal ball.

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

No just proving that fans here overrated Horak. At least I can go back to those threads and pick out the posts where I was saying the same things then as I am today that he was going to be an AHL tweener.

From your link:

11. Horak
12. Granlund
14. Reinhart

Holy shart. You could fit the grand canyon between those rankings!

The seasons the each player had following the summer 2013 rankings:

Horak
AHL - 53GP - 21G - 27A - 48PTS (.91 ppg)
NHL - 2GP - 1G - 0A - 1PT

Granlund
AHL - 52GP - 25G - 21A - 46PTS (.88 ppg)
NHL - 7GP - 2G - 1A - 3PTS

Reinhart
AHL - 66GP - 21G - 42A - 63PTS (.95 PPG)
NHL - 8GP - 0G - 2A - 2PTS


EE, what exactly did Granlund/Reinhart accomplish this year to suggest they are so far ahead of Horak that you find it humourous that anyone could have lumped all 3 together last summer?

As for not needing a crystal ball... You may want to consider one. You had Knight 5th, ahead of Jankowksi, Granlund, Reinhart, Bouma, Klimchuk, Poirier, and Wotherspoon.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by fotze

He's got the patting on his own back down. Its just the quality of the backpat that needs more effort. The physical act of patting oneself on the back is not the difficult part, its the doing something worthy of the backpat, that takes the real foresight and effort. - Seinfeld

There are two herds of sheep in regards to Roman Horak, and EE has no idea what a sheep is.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

There are two herds of sheep in regards to Roman Horak, and EE has no idea what a sheep is.

Thanks, now I feel dirty for thanking a post of his from another thread..