Flames assign Sven Baertschi to the Heat

[calgarywinning]

Originally Posted by stignasty

...and the value of scouting.

The value of scouting, but also the raw talent of the scouts to deliver. Can it be the magic men of the game are the road warriors picking the talent up through the league? Just gotta love an organization that can draft well for 5,6,7 years in a row.

Something the flames are due for.

[The Fonz]

Jesus people, calm your tits.

Sven will be fine.

[sun]

Originally Posted by getbak

Crazy thing is that Saad was their 4th pick of the draft and Shaw was their 8th. It really shows the value of stocking up on draft picks.

Reading up on that draft, and it looks like Saad was picked with the Flames pick that Chicago got from Toronto that Toronto got from us in the Wayne Primeau trade

[saXon]

Originally Posted by sun

Reading up on that draft, and it looks like Saad was picked with the Flames pick that Chicago got from Toronto that Toronto got from us in the Wayne Primeau trade

That's a Saad story.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by sun

Reading up on that draft, and it looks like Saad was picked with the Flames pick that Chicago got from Toronto that Toronto got from us in the Wayne Primeau trade

He probably wasn't even on our radar anyway.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by calgarywinning

The value of scouting, but also the raw talent of the scouts to deliver. Can it be the magic men of the game are the road warriors picking the talent up through the league? Just gotta love an organization that can draft well for 5,6,7 years in a row.



Something the flames are due for.

Let's also be honest: There was an extreme amount of luck in picking Saad and Shaw. If Chicago actually thought they were going to be two of the best players from that draft, they would've drafted them sooner.

[Tinordi]

The lesson from that draft isn't that Chicago got lucky, it's that Chicago had many draft picks this increasing their chances of picking the right players. That's how you stay perpetually competitive. You draft a great core and then continue to shed assets for futures which improve your chances of drafting depth and youth.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by strombad

Let's also be honest: There was an extreme amount of luck in picking Saad and Shaw. If Chicago actually thought they were going to be two of the best players from that draft, they would've drafted them sooner.

Yeah, it isn't as if the Blackhawks have an ability to find and take extremely productive players in late rounds.

I mean they really don't have a pattern of doing that at all the last 12-13 years.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Yeah, it isn't as if the Blackhawks have an ability to find and take extremely productive players in late rounds.

I mean they really don't have a pattern of doing that at all the last 12-13 years.

Not saying they aren't very talented, but it does take a lot of luck.

I mean, these guys are on their radar, but it's not like they ever rate them as high as they end up producing. In 2006 and 07 they missed completely outside of Kane and Toews. In 2010 they didn't have one pick make it thus far.

Even in rounds where they took a steal like Troy Brouwer (7th round) they had 3 seventh round picks and didn't even take him first with the 3 they had!

I hope you're not seriously denying the amount of luck it takes. If you think Chicago honestly thought they were picking 2 of the top 3 players in the 2011 draft with their 4th and 8th pick (2nd and 5th round) then I can only assume you're having a laugh.

[Roof-Daddy]

It doesn't hurt that Chicago's line up is chalk full of elite players in their primes either. I'm sure it's a big help to help to a young player to enter the league playing on a line with the best of the best on a nightly basis.

[RyZ]

Sven needs confidence and NHL playing time. He should have never been sent down. The moment he was sent to Abby it became a wasted season for his development. How many other guys on that chart are even being threatened with a demotion? And all of them other than Nuge are on better, deeper teams.

The new GM can't come in and hire his new coach soon enough.

[bucksmasher]

Originally Posted by RyZ

Sven needs confidence and NHL playing time. He should have never been sent down. The moment he was sent to Abby it became a wasted season for his development. How many other guys on that chart are even being threatened with a demotion? And all of them other than Nuge are on better, deeper teams.

The new GM can't come in and hire his new coach soon enough.

pretty sure the current GM gave the nod for the send down

[flamesfan1297]

Originally Posted by nemanja2306

We all preach about how the Flames should have been patient with St. Louis, well, let's practice that a little bit on Sven before we ship him out and declare him a bust.

we should have been more patient with marc savard too

[strombad]

When people bring up St.Louis and Savard in relation to Baertschi, I can only assume they have no idea what actually happened with those two players.

Neither situation had much to do with "patience" or any relevance to Baertschi.

[transplant99]

Troy Ward was on the morning show with Boomer today and Baertschi was a pretty main topic.

Short version is this...

SB has some maturity issues off the ice that has affected his on ice peformance. 0 goals in 9 games and 1 assist in his last 7 or something along those lines.

He just hasnt grasped what is needed from him to be a good pro...yet, Thus it has manifested itself to a pretty poor showing on the ice and particularly in the area of poduction on the offensive end. Ward feels he (Sven) is starting to grasp things and that will start to show in his numbers. Ward did not sound too woried that it wouldnt happen, just wasnt sure how long it would take at this point.


Sounds reasonable to me.
Like many young guys befoe him and many more in the future....you just have to be patient with some of them more than others. SB appears to be one of those guys right now.

[Skaloper]

I think part of the problem is that the Flames didn't exactly set him up for success either. Most skilled rookies that are doing well are paired with a couple of veterans/superstars which make it quite a bit easier to do well. Had he been in Hertl (Thornton), Johnson (St.Louis) or MacKinnon (Duchene) shoes I think he would be up in the NHL producing right now. The Flames have Hudler who has been good for helping Monahan.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Troy Ward was on the morning show with Boomer today and Baertschi was a pretty main topic.

Short version is this...

SB has some maturity issues off the ice that has affected his on ice peformance. 0 goals in 9 games and 1 assist in his last 7 or something along those lines.

He just hasnt grasped what is needed from him to be a good pro...yet, Thus it has manifested itself to a pretty poor showing on the ice and particularly in the area of poduction on the offensive end. Ward feels he (Sven) is starting to grasp things and that will start to show in his numbers. Ward did not sound too woried that it wouldnt happen, just wasnt sure how long it would take at this point.


Sounds reasonable to me.
Like many young guys befoe him and many more in the future....you just have to be patient with some of them more than others. SB appears to be one of those guys right now.

Until you can show that you are a pro, then to the farm you must go!

[Dorkmaster]

Originally Posted by Skaloper

I think part of the problem is that the Flames didn't exactly set him up for success either. Most skilled rookies that are doing well are paired with a couple of veterans/superstars which make it quite a bit easier to do well. Had he been in Hertl (Thornton), Johnson (St.Louis) or MacKinnon (Duchene) shoes I think he would be up in the NHL producing right now. The Flames have Hudler who has been good for helping Monahan.

Don't really agree. Mackinnon is a 1st overall, Johnson spent time in the AHL and Hertl played pro prior to this year. I don't think that's really the issue here. Hudler has been able to help Monahan and there's still Cammalleri and a few others who are solid pros. I think from his lackluster performance all the way back to rookie camp indicates the problem is elsewhere.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Skaloper

I think part of the problem is that the Flames didn't exactly set him up for success either. Most skilled rookies that are doing well are paired with a couple of veterans/superstars which make it quite a bit easier to do well. Had he been in Hertl (Thornton), Johnson (St.Louis) or MacKinnon (Duchene) shoes I think he would be up in the NHL producing right now. The Flames have Hudler who has been good for helping Monahan.

Except and I know that Baert is the local hero in these parts. But keeping him in the NHL and "pairing" him with a veteran wasn't going to do much good. He came into camp with an entitled I am the savoir body languange, then proceeded to half float around til the coach basically pulled him aside and poop on him, and then he lost his confidence.

By keeping him up and "rewarding" him with a spot with Hudler in the top half of the lineup is basically rewarding him for floating around the ice, and bailing out of corner battles and not driving the hard areas nearly enough.

Sven can do one of two things. He can go to Abbotsford and act like everyone hates him and he can do no right and continue not to find his game.

Or he can grab his balls, and start playing like he did in his first couple of stints up here.

But when it gets to the point where the GM calls you out for it and questions your pride, and then your minor league coach is saying he needs to grow up and start playing hockey then its getting close to the time for the kids gloves to come and and the paddle to come out.

[Clever_Iggy]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Troy Ward was on the morning show with Boomer today and Baertschi was a pretty main topic.

Short version is this...

SB has some maturity issues off the ice that has affected his on ice peformance. 0 goals in 9 games and 1 assist in his last 7 or something along those lines.

He just hasnt grasped what is needed from him to be a good pro...yet, Thus it has manifested itself to a pretty poor showing on the ice and particularly in the area of poduction on the offensive end. Ward feels he (Sven) is starting to grasp things and that will start to show in his numbers. Ward did not sound too woried that it wouldnt happen, just wasnt sure how long it would take at this point.


Sounds reasonable to me.
Like many young guys befoe him and many more in the future....you just have to be patient with some of them more than others. SB appears to be one of those guys right now.

The bolded part could have so many possible interpretations. Hopefully it's more along the lines of what I did when I was that age - playing XBox until all hours and maintaining a diet of pizza, hotwings and anything that could be heated up in the microwave.