[News] With the #22 overall pick the Flames select LW/RW Emile Poirier

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

I honestly think they passed on Shinkaruk because they didn't scout him very much. Where the Flames picks were, Shinkaruk shouldn't have even been an option. I think that's what was mean't when Feaster said "we'll stick to our list".

Odds are that Shinkaruk was probably one of the most scouted players by the organization. The Tigers played the Hitmen six times last year, and their advance scouts would have seen numerous other Medicine Hat games.

I think they passed on him because they honestly thought Poirier is better.

[saillias]

We didn't draft Shinkaruk because he doesn't have an NHL future.

Honestly he'd be lucky to have Rob Schremp's career. I'm willing to bet on that.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

He had an interview with the Flames

https://twitter.com/CruickshankCH/st...98290994708481

Buffalo interviewed him multiple times according to that tweet and still passed on him at #8 and #16

Phoenix passed on him at #12 even though interviewing him multiple times...

No mention about Columbus interviewing him but they passed on him at #14 and # 19

It is more than likely he left a bad impression with the Flames in his one interview

I was reading threads in HF (I know, I know) and apparently he did not fare well in the interview process and teams were concerned about his character. To be fair this kid was not universally loved by all scouts as I had read about the attitude concerns and lack of well rounded game.

NHL Scout for ESPN Grant Sonier had him ranked lower than he was actually picked;

26.)Hunter Shinkaruk

Shinkaruk is another player whom I have lower on my list compared to most projections. I have nothing personal against Shinkaruk, but think he has to make a few small -- but very important -- changes to his game in order to play in the NHL. He will need to show a greater willingness in winning loose puck battles and in playing both sides of the puck. His offensive thinking and skills are very good, and he has an excellent shot. In order for those skills to be effective at the NHL level, he will need more overall determination.

I know TSN and some fans are taking shots at the Flames for not taking him but he was passed over after the Flames picked as well which shows that few teams in the league had him amongst the top picks on their list. The Flames likely had the same concerns all the other teams had that passed over him.

[Withnail]

Hello I'm new to posting here on CP, but I'm been a long time reader. I have a question about how the Flames have been drafting since new management have taken over and I think it's on topic. The Flames seem to have gone off the board with Porier (although it looks now like Montreal was interested at 25) Mark Jankowski, and Keegan Kanzig. My question is do you think drafting these players earlier in the draft delivers a psychological punch to the gut that tells a player that they can compete at a high level? Is there a precedence for this? Is this what our management is attempting? I'd appreciate CP's incites.

[Isbrant]

I would define compete level as the players willingness to sacrafice the individual for the good of the team. The sacrafice could be pain (taking a hit, blocking shots), effort (skating hard on the backcheck), or stat (playing better defensivly but not getting as many points) related.

As for the Poirier pick, it sounds like he made some technical improvements to his game over the season that really started to pan out in the second half. Specifically his shot and skating. Say a team scouted him a few times and had him pegged as a 3rd round pick and was not as activily following him. When his stats improved over the the second half of the season, the team would probably only risk moving him up to the second round on their list. They might not know if the better second half was a statistical annomality or not.

If another team was actively following Poirier, they could better see the changes he made over the season and he would gradually move up their list in this time frame.

I knew nothing about him before the Flames picked him but am willing to see how he develops.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I know TSN and some fans are taking shots at the Flames for not taking him but he was passed over after the Flames picked as well which shows that few teams in the league had him amongst the top picks on their list. The Flames likely had the same concerns all the other teams had that passed over him.

TSN is terrible that way. They try to sensationalize "off the board" picks like it's a huge deal, and of course, fans eat it up. I could see it if it was a top 5 or 10 pick and we went off the board, but after the 20th pick, there is a lot of hair splitting on the next 30 to 40 players... especially this year I imagine with the depth that there was. It's very easy to over look players in that range.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

The Ruutu comparison seems a little strange as well. Not a bad player, but is he really known as a speedster/scorer?

[Withnail]

Is there a psychological payoff for a player who's been drafted off the board?

[dammage79]

Randy Sportak ‏@SUNRandySportak 1m
Not sure how that rumour got started but #Flames draftee Emile Poirier told me he's NOT - repeat NOT - related to Vinny Lecavalier.
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[MissTeeks]

nm

[Cheerio]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Randy Sportak ‏@SUNRandySportak 1m
Not sure how that rumour got started but #Flames draftee Emile Poirier told me he's NOT - repeat NOT - related to Vinny Lecavalier.
Expand Reply Retweet Favorite More

He's not not related to Vinny? So are they cousins orrr?

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Cheerio

He's not not related to Vinny? So are they cousins orrr?

Someone tweeted the day of the draft that Vinny was Poiriers Uncle.

[Cheerio]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Someone tweeted the day of the draft that Vinny was Poiriers Uncle.

Oh I never heard that, I was just making a stupid joke

[Plett25]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

TSN is terrible that way. They try to sensationalize "off the board" picks like it's a huge deal, and of course, fans eat it up. I could see it if it was a top 5 or 10 pick and we went off the board, but after the 20th pick, there is a lot of hair splitting on the next 30 to 40 players... especially this year I imagine with the depth that there was. It's very easy to over look players in that range.

I think rankings are analogous to navigating by dead reckoning. The further you get from certainty (be it the #1 overall pick or your place of origin) the higher the potential error.

#4 on a draft list could be selected anywhere from #2 to #6 without a lot of surprise.

If #46 on a list is picked anywhere from #23 to #69, it isn't "off the board"

[_Q_]

Originally Posted by Withnail

Hello I'm new to posting here on CP, but I'm been a long time reader. I have a question about how the Flames have been drafting since new management have taken over and I think it's on topic. The Flames seem to have gone off the board with Porier (although it looks now like Montreal was interested at 25) Mark Jankowski, and Keegan Kanzig. My question is do you think drafting these players earlier in the draft delivers a psychological punch to the gut that tells a player that they can compete at a high level? Is there a precedence for this? Is this what our management is attempting? I'd appreciate CP's incites.

Welcome to CP Withnail.

As for your question, that's definitely an interesting way of looking at it. I haven't seen any studies that discuss this "psychological punch to the gut" as you would say. I think, however, that the effect of being drafted first round are short lived. Maybe it boosts your confidence for a couple weeks after the draft, but I can't imagine it having any long term effects on the player's development.

If there are any studies out there regarding this, I would be interested in seeing them, although, I have no idea how they would research this.

[troutman]

Yesterday TSN showed the 2009 WJC game between Canada and Russia. I was surprised to see how few of the players on the Candian team are now playing in the NHL, or how few games they have played. An 18 year old draft is a crap shoot.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Wo...nships_rosters

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by troutman

Yesterday TSN showed the 2009 WJC game between Canada and Russia. I was surprised to see how few of the players on the Candian team are now playing in the NHL, or how few games they have played. An 18 year old draft is a crap shoot.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Wo...nships_rosters

Hmmm

10 of the 20 skaters are NHL regulars, and most of them are out right stars already.

Plus, the jury isn't completely out on a few more of them making it.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by troutman

Yesterday TSN showed the 2009 WJC game between Canada and Russia. I was surprised to see how few of the players on the Candian team are now playing in the NHL, or how few games they have played. An 18 year old draft is a crap shoot.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Wo...nships_rosters

it's funny I look a tthe roster and thought that there was a ton of really good players on there Myers, Pietro & PK on the backend. Benn, Eberle, Kane & JT up front. Goaltending is suspect though

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by troutman

Yesterday TSN showed the 2009 WJC game between Canada and Russia. I was surprised to see how few of the players on the Candian team are now playing in the NHL, or how few games they have played. An 18 year old draft is a crap shoot.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Wo...nships_rosters

I watched it too and, while I thought the number of Canadian kids now in the NHL seemed about right (a few misses but also some guys really blossomed), what stood out for me was the complete lack of ANY Russians from that team being in the NHL now.

Their top guys included Filatov, Petrov and a few others that were very highly touted. When you watch the games, there is no doubt that there is as much talent on the Russian team as the Canadian team.

And yet, when it comes to turning them into NHL players, it just doesn't happen much.

Fun fact from that WJ tourney... the two defensemen on the all star team that year were Karlsson and Subban (the last two Norris Trophy winners)

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by Withnail

Hello I'm new to posting here on CP, but I'm been a long time reader. I have a question about how the Flames have been drafting since new management have taken over and I think it's on topic. The Flames seem to have gone off the board with Porier (although it looks now like Montreal was interested at 25) Mark Jankowski, and Keegan Kanzig. My question is do you think drafting these players earlier in the draft delivers a psychological punch to the gut that tells a player that they can compete at a high level? Is there a precedence for this? Is this what our management is attempting? I'd appreciate CP's incites.

Everyone reacts differently to these types of things, so there may be some element of that. I believe that confidence is a heavily weighted criteria to get drafted to begin with, so I don't think it would be a huge factor, and certainly not a reason to draft someone.