Another tragic bullying story

[Reanimate]

Originally Posted by hmmhmmcamo

no you're right...making her close her FB account would have fixed everything

Yeah. Because that's what I said. Don't be obtuse.

[hmmhmmcamo]

Originally Posted by Reanimate

Yeah. Because that's what I said. Don't be obtuse.

huh?

Originally Posted by Reanimate

This is gonna sound cruel. But if you are being harassed on Facebook. Close your account. You can't be tagged or followed any longer.

This girls parents are ####ing tools and sound like they are the exact candidates for a study in why you should have a license to be a parent.

[hmmhmmcamo]

I can’t imagine what it would be like to be a teenager in high school today. I think back on all the stupid crap I did as a kid and can’t believe how lucky I am that it’s not plastered all over the internet in glorious 1080p.

[pylon]

As someone who is a very recent 'suicide survivor' (god I hate that term) I have empathy for the family more than all else. In our particular case, bullying was not the cause. There was a finger that could be pointed to someone, in fact a few people, that could have changed the course of events, and saved a loved one from doing what they did. A lot of people want to place blame at "So and so should have said this." or "Such and such should have done that." But at the end of the day, the ultimate decision was made, the person has found their peace, and our family now has to suffer for the rest of their lives asking themselves "What did I do wrong? I should have intervened. Why didn't I see the signs?" MO MATTER WHAT anybody tells you, you will live with that forever.

I never understood the term "It is a selfish act." Until I had to live through the fall out, and resulting consequences, both mentally, and lets be honest, financially as funerals are not cheap. I miss the hell out of the person I lost, and would do anything to get them back. I would give my own life if it could change the course of history, because so much potential was lost and their impact on this world could have been greater than I could have ever made. But I can't. I have to live with this doubt that I failed the rest of my life. I have to avoid looking at years worth of pictures that now rip my heart out, instead of filling it with happiness every time I look at them.

This is what scares me. Kids see this outpouring of support when people take their lives now in media. This incredible level of sympathy and kind words that pour out when they are gone, and the hatred, and wrath that their tormentors have to live through as a result. They are getting what they wanted all along. Acceptance, sympathy, and payback. What they fail to think through, is that it is game over. Lights out. You are never waking up or having another thought.

I can understand the pain of depression. But not all suicide is the result of it. A low point in life, or sadness doesn't exactly equal clinical depression. It is just exactly what it is, a low point in life. I fear that the media putting so much attention on these kids that are doing this, they are doing the exact opposite, and giving a lot of teenagers and young adults, who tend to be incredibly impulsive, a rationale to do something just for the post humous attention.

I really, really hope they can find a solution for the internet hate machine. But no matter how you slice it and dice it. You can unplug the computer. And you can walk away if it is hurting you. As many mean words as someone can sling at you, it is not a rational nor balanced reaction is to murder yourself. These bullies, as vile as they can be, don't put the pills in your mouth, the gun in your hand, or the belt over the rafters. And the people you ultimately end up hurting the worst, are the only ones that cared for you in the first place, and you will hurt them until the day they die. And in the the bully? They will forget all about it and move on because they were born an unsympathetic a-hole anyway.

[SeeBass]

Well we could just follow Mikey the redneck's advice from the last time we discussed this issue

"Maybe you should teach the kids better self esteem instead of dumping all this suicide guilt on anyone who disagrees with you"

Mikey the Redneck April 4/12

[Papi34]

Man thats tough to watch. Problem is that bullying will never stop. There will always be clicks and that will never change. Its the sad reality. No matter how many stories you hear like this there will continue to be more.

We have all seen it or been through it. It takes a damn special kid to stand up to friends in a bullying situation and risk being outted by the group for standing up for the bully victim.

Its so frustrating because as i sit here i cant even begin to think of a way to prevent this kind of stuff.

Sad story.. sad sad story. Unfortunately not the first or the last.

[pepper24]

Originally Posted by Reanimate

This is gonna sound cruel. But if you are being harassed on Facebook. Close your account. You can't be tagged or followed any longer.

This girls parents are ####ing tools and sound like they are the exact candidates for a study in why you should have a license to be a parent.

You should read and learn more about the story before you post such uninformed nonsense. Closing her FB page would have done nothing as the picture was orgininated from the stalkers fake FB accounts.

.....

Her ordeal started while she was fooling around online with friends. She probably didn’t think it was risky behaviour when she lifted her top to flash the person who was flattering her at the other end of the webcam.

Amanda’s moment of indiscretion was not unusual for someone her age: Sexting and using webcams to share sexual photos is a growing trend among children, some so young they are still in grade school.

“The Internet stalker she flashed kept stalking her,” said Carol. “Every time she moved schools he would go undercover and become a Facebook friend. What the guy did was he went online to the kids who went to (the new school) and said that he was going to be a new student — that he was starting school the following week and that he wanted some friends and could they friend him on Facebook.”

“He eventually gathered people’s names and sent Amanda’s video to her new school.”

The video and photos went to teachers, to parents, to Facebook friends, which lead to repeated taunts: “Oh, there’s the porn star.”


Read more: http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Ama...#ixzz29CPqhmhB

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by Reanimate

What's dumb about what i said? She was being harassed on FB. Her parents should not have let her be on it anymore. They failed this poor girl. They are as much to blame as anyone.

I don't know why this comment angers me as much as is does - this girl obviously had some mental health issues brought on in large part through social media and bullying. It seems to me as though to say that turning the computer off is only wilfully ignoring the actual issue which is the bullying of the victim.

To blame the parents for their child's suicide is one of the most disgustingly heartless things I have ever read on this message board. I can't imagine the pain the parents are going through right now, knowing that their daughter was tormented for years not only by her peers but in turn also by herself driving her to this horrifying end. I can't even imagine what would have to be going through your head to believe that this is the case.

As this is a hockey site I would absolutely love it if some NHL players took part in public service announcements to address the issue of bullying in schools. Get some people who tweens and teens look up to telling them that this isn't right, that this needs to stop. It wouldn't take much and I strongly believe it would go a long way towards reducing this. The Canucks did a good thing with the mindcheck program but I really think that these organizations can do more, it wouldn't cost anything to have a Sedin, Iginla, Eberle, Hall, Kiprusoff or any of these players post a video on youtube under the Flames channel saying that this needs to stop. Look at the number of people on this message board who have said that they are the victims of bullying, it is such a hidden issue that needs to be brought out into the light and not just when tragedy strikes. I know that this will likely never happen but I think that this could have a positive influence on the lives of children across Canada.

[V]

I agree that it's not a good thing to point at the parents in a specific situation. There is no value in picking apart a specific situation, especially when you have no real idea about the specifics. And the parents are no doubt going through hell right now.

However I do have a problem with what appears to be a sentiment on here that parents are relatively helpless in this type of situation. Maybe I'm misinterpreting people's opinion on here, but that's what I'm reading.

I have an eight year old daughter, and I can say with a very, very high degree of certainty that my daughter could not possibly end up in a situation similar to this one.

I do worry about my daughter at times. She's very empathetic (didn't get it from me...) especially towards the underdog. She has no problem sticking up for kids getting teased. When she was in grade one she broke up a fight between a bunch of grade three kids. I have no doubt at some point in her life she's going to be picked on for standing up to a bully.

But I do strongly believe that the steps we've taken in raising her have set her up with everything she needs to deal with it, even when she makes a bad decision that will put her in a compromising position. Maybe I'm wrong and naive, and have no idea what's waiting for me in the next 4 to 10 years, but I doubt it.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

I agree in part but suicide is a choice - it is obviously an awful choice that people make and for reasons that really they can only understand but it is a choice none the less. To say that people don't have the choice in my opinion makes it a situation in which the people are helpless to the disease/illness of depression, which isn't the case at all. Suicide such as this one is a choice that is made by people who are not thinking logically or rationally and are solving a temporary problem with a permanent solution. The fact is that people always have a choice, not just the people who do suffer from depression but also those that surround them as well, they have the choice to reach out and contact those people who do suffer from depression and who have suicidal ideations.

I understand from reading your posts on the subject that this is a very personal issue for you as well so I mean absolutely no disrespect by these comments by the way and I am not minimizing the impact that depression has on the person because I have seen it myself in family members, friends as well as myself to a certain degree and I know how pervasive it is and how it warps your thoughts into thinking you are worthless.

I actually had a boss force me to write out a list of things about myself I didn't like while I was at work which really upset me a great deal and while I know am strong enough that I would feel confident in telling him to screw off, I will admit now that writing a list for someone of every fault about myself, for someone with already low self confidence really made me think about suicide, just with being tired and not thinking straight. Oddly enough this is the first time that I have mentioned that to anyone and I guess the anonymity of the internet is the only reason that I feel confident in doing so sadly enough.

Yes, it is a very personal issue for me and my views that suicide is not a choice are based on my own experience. The fact that this a public forum that anyone can read prevets me from going into greater detail to further explain my stance. I'm going to agree to disagree and leave it at that.

I appreciate that we all are allowed to voice our opinions on the issue and no disrespect was ever taken.

[OutOfTheCube]

Originally Posted by pepper24

Closing her FB page would have done nothing


“Every time she moved schools he would go undercover and become a Facebook friend."

Sounds like closing her FB page might have helped a lot...

Anyways, to me this sounds more like a stalker/pedophile leading someone to suicide, not bullying. The bullying didn't help, of course, but it would've subsided and faded if this creep would've left her alone. Media just likes to play up the bullying angle.

[afc wimbledon]

I worked at the school this lass went to a few years ago, its a good school but to be frank schools/teachers are all but powerless to stop bullying either on the net or in real life, teenage kids, in pack form, being arseholes off the first order and proof positive that we are descended from monkeys.

Closing down the facebook account would have been a good idea, not because it would have stopped the bullying but would have made the girl less available to it.

When my daughter had some problems a few years ago one of my foster kids, a downtown eastside gang member, without my knowledge I have to add, tracked down the boy that was the cause of the trouble on line and let him know how truely ####ty his life would be if my lad and several of his friends stole a car and headed out to the burbs to beat him down, funnily enough she never ever had a problem with any one after that, couldn't really approve of the lads actions but suffice to say he got to chose dinner for a while.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

, funnily enough she never ever had a problem with any one after that, couldn't really approve of the lads actions but suffice to say he got to chose dinner for a while.

One of those stern lectures followed by a re-assuring pat on the back.

I guess the only question is did he go full Batman and talk with the growl.

[krazycanuck]

Every bully ultimately has low self esteem. They've probably been bullied themselves, which makes this whole cycle hard to stop.

I know personally I was a bit of a bully in Junior High and on the flip side I would get bullied. I still do, and always will always feel bad about some of the things that I did back then. Why did I do those things? I didn't realize it at the time but ultimately I wanted acceptance from "the cool kids." I didn't feel like an outsider if I was pulling out a nerd's chair as they tried to sit down and everyone laughed at them. I felt included if I made fun of someone's weight like other kids were doing. I never had any ill will to those kids I picked on. I didn't hate them (although I'm sure they felt that I did), I just wanted to be part of a larger group.

As an adult you come to appreciate in hindsight that when you're in school EVERYONE is self conscious. EVERYONE is looking for acceptance. EVERYONE thought less of themselves than others did.

So why don't kids stand up for each other? It takes guts and self confidence. Bullies think they're the leaders, they're really the followers.

[flamesfever]

Originally Posted by krazycanuck

Every bully ultimately has low self esteem. They've probably been bullied themselves, which makes this whole cycle hard to stop.

I know personally I was a bit of a bully in Junior High and on the flip side I would get bullied. I still do, and always will always feel bad about some of the things that I did back then. Why did I do those things? I didn't realize it at the time but ultimately I wanted acceptance from "the cool kids." I didn't feel like an outsider if I was pulling out a nerd's chair as they tried to sit down and everyone laughed at them. I felt included if I made fun of someone's weight like other kids were doing. I never had any ill will to those kids I picked on. I didn't hate them (although I'm sure they felt that I did), I just wanted to be part of a larger group.

As an adult you come to appreciate in hindsight that when you're in school EVERYONE is self conscious. EVERYONE is looking for acceptance. EVERYONE thought less of themselves than others did.

So why don't kids stand up for each other? It takes guts and self confidence. Bullies think they're the leaders, they're really the followers.

In grade two, I used to get beaten up by this kid who was 3 years older than me. My Mom went to the principal and he was strapped, and never again laid a hand on me. Strangely, he turned out to be one of my best friends later on. I recall he and his brother had a father who was quite extreme with regard to physical punishment... until one day they got big enough and gave their father the same treatment they had received.

This happened over 65 year ago, growing up in Toronto, when almost everyone got the strap at one time or another. I got strapped twice...once for laughing at a supply teacher in grade 2, and another time when half the school got strapped in one incident for throwing snow balls.

[flamesfever]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

I worked at the school this lass went to a few years ago, its a good school but to be frank schools/teachers are all but powerless to stop bullying either on the net or in real life, teenage kids, in pack form, being arseholes off the first order and proof positive that we are descended from monkeys.

Closing down the facebook account would have been a good idea, not because it would have stopped the bullying but would have made the girl less available to it.

When my daughter had some problems a few years ago one of my foster kids, a downtown eastside gang member, without my knowledge I have to add, tracked down the boy that was the cause of the trouble on line and let him know how truely ####ty his life would be if my lad and several of his friends stole a car and headed out to the burbs to beat him down, funnily enough she never ever had a problem with any one after that, couldn't really approve of the lads actions but suffice to say he got to chose dinner for a while.

I believe this could be a problem. If the consequences by the courts, for cyber bullying, or bullying of any kind, are not sufficient to deter the problem, then society may use other means to seek justice.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Agreed, I believe we have had our differences, and at no point did I ever feel bullied by you.

That is because as 'blunt' as valo tends to be, he doesn't ever make it personal. There are others on CP that love to dog pile though when someone says something that goes against the apparent standard on here.

Kids are very much alike. Not everyone is the same, and many are different in ways that are 'strange' and 'weird' from the rest of the 'cool' kids, and as a result they get bullied. When that happens, most of the other kids that aren't really bullies by nature tend to join in on the dogpile because it is the 'cool' thing to do, and they want to fit in with the cool kids.

What I often noticed during school is that it only takes one person to stand up for the victim to turn the 'dogpile' in the opposite direction.

I think Matty has the right idea. We should put a much bigger effort into educating not only the parents, but all the kids in the school. There are many kids that don't understand what bullying really does to a victim, and I really think if we educate everyone involved in the process, maybe some of the fellow kids who are innocent bystanders can help make a difference. Because to be bluntly honest, I'm not so sure the parents will ever make a difference. On top of being naive to the idea that their child is capable of physically and emotionally driving someone to take their own life, kids don't share everything with their parents. But a fellow child is capable of becoming a friend that can help a victim work through being bullied.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Azure

That is because as 'blunt' as valo tends to be, he doesn't ever make it personal.

I respectfully disagree, he tends to make it personal quite a bit. He is right up there with C.O.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I respectfully disagree, he tends to make it personal quite a bit. He is right up there with C.O.

Who is C.O.?

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Dion

Who is C.O.?

It should be rather Obvious who is the Captain of personal insults and bullying others on CP.