I am 100% in support of a pre-emtive strike by Israel (as I was when they attacked reactor facilities in Iraq and Syria) but only if the Iranian program can be destroyed. Simply delaying their capability by a year or two serves no purpose. This has the potential to ignite wars on multiple fronts. It may the most difficult decision Israel has had to make since its creation.
I am 100% in support of a pre-emtive strike by Israel (as I was when they attacked reactor facilities in Iraq and Syria) but only if the Iranian program can be destroyed. Simply delaying their capability by a year or two serves no purpose. This has the potential to ignite wars on multiple fronts. It may the most difficult decision Israel has had to make since its creation.
This whole thing really blows, the Iranian people have so much potential if they could simply shake off their leadership. Iraq is such a mess now and Iran will be in the same boat if things spiral out of control. From Israel's perspective, Iraq won't be launching scuds anytime soon. What will it take to guarantee peace from Iran? At the moment, it is complete military destruction.
I thought Canada pulling their staff out might be a tactic meant to heighten Iranian defenses, Israel was probably watching very closely.
I really don't know what motivates Iran to head down this path...
I am 100% in support of a pre-emtive strike by Israel (as I was when they attacked reactor facilities in Iraq and Syria) but only if the Iranian program can be destroyed. Simply delaying their capability by a year or two serves no purpose. This has the potential to ignite wars on multiple fronts. It may the most difficult decision Israel has had to make since its creation.
In principle I agree. Unfortunately, there are several extenuating circumstances that weren't in play with Iraq and Syria. The entire region is sitting in a delicate balance at the moment. The oppressive but consistent regimes in Egypt and Libya are no more. Syria is on the verge of governmental collapse. Under previous conditions Israel could attack Iran and neither Syria, Libya, Iraq, Saudi, Jordan nor Egypt would have done much about it rather than a little sabre-rattling. In fact, most of those nations leaders would be cheering very quietly in a secluded room somewhere. Now that Egypt and Libya no longer have a strong dictator at the helm, an Israeli pre-emptive strike could cause Muslims in the region to demand action against Israel. We've already seen large demonstrations against the US embassies in Libya and Egypt. An attack on Iran, despite being the best thing for the region, would likely inflame tensions and possibly see more Ayatollah's pop-up throughout the Middle-East.
I think the best thing that Israel can do at the moment is to continue their quiet assault on the Iranian nuclear infrastructure.
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^^ Agreed. As do the Palestinian people, the Syrian people etc etc. Man I feel so bad for them. They have no rights, no freedoms, no say in the policies of their fanatical leaders.
I read your posts as well and couldn't find a answer for "hate"
Just a suspicion, but I believe your hatred lies with yours or the way you were brought up with your family's religious beliefs.
Might be just the paranoid me as I would love to build a big freakin religious bomb that would engulf the planet and rid this world of bul**hit.
That's hilarious. My hatred for Iran, fellow Muslims, is because of my religious upbringing?
That's gold, really.
My hatred for Iran lies with the way that country funds hezbullah and with how they are just begging for ww3.
I already made my point with Israel and I'll leave it at that. Accusing me being Muslim having to do with my hatred for Israel is insulting. I hate Iran just as much.
That's hilarious. My hatred for Iran, fellow Muslims, is because of my religious upbringing?
That's gold, really.
My hatred for Iran lies with the way that country funds hezbullah and with how they are just begging for ww3.
I already made my point with Israel and I'll leave it at that. Accusing me being Muslim having to do with my hatred for Israel is insulting. I hate Iran just as much.
I have not read the chain of posts but correct me if I am wrong, your hatred is for their leaders - the mullahs in Iran and Likud in Israel (perhaps Labor as well). In Iran and the Arab countries the hatred, for the most part, is for all Jews in general and not just for the policies of the Israeli government.
In Iran and the Arab countries the hatred, for the most part, is for all Jews in general and not just for the policies of the Israeli government.
I think that's true up to a point.
Prior to 1948 there wasn't much, if any, hatred of Jews in the region. In fact, I'd argue that most Arabs saw the Jews like distant cousins and as relatively kindred spirits. It was because of what happened in 1948 and thereafter that really sparked the hatred of Israel. Since then that hatred of the nation has evolved for many Arabs in the region, but not all, into a hatred of Jews in general.
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The of and to a in is I that it for you was with on as have but be they
That's hilarious. My hatred for Iran, fellow Muslims, is because of my religious upbringing?
That's gold, really.
My hatred for Iran lies with the way that country funds hezbullah and with how they are just begging for ww3.
I already made my point with Israel and I'll leave it at that. Accusing me being Muslim having to do with my hatred for Israel is insulting. I hate Iran just as much.
I'm Christian. Some people blames the Jews for Jesus' death. That's why I hate Israel.
Man, the crusades were the best thing for the Levant.
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Originally Posted by Locke
Thats why Flames fans make ideal Star Trek fans. We've really been taught to embrace the self-loathing and extreme criticism.
I have not read the chain of posts but correct me if I am wrong, your hatred is for their leaders - the mullahs in Iran and Likud in Israel (perhaps Labor as well). In Iran and the Arab countries the hatred, for the most part, is for all Jews in general and not just for the policies of the Israeli government.
Yep, that sounds about right. I definitely don't hate Jews, but I don't really know about the Arab world hating Jews or just Israel.
This whole thing really blows, the Iranian people have so much potential if they could simply shake off their leadership. Iraq is such a mess now and Iran will be in the same boat if things spiral out of control.
I think the West and Israel need to seriously consider the example of Iraq when dealing with Iran. Iraq also had a tonne of potential. They were a well educated nation with a young demographic. They were also, in relation to the region, not particularly devout to their chosen orthodoxy. That's not to say that they weren't religious but rather that they weren't as fundamentalist as many other nations in the region. Unfortunately, because of the bungled invasion and subsequent "management" of Iraq, the country became susceptible to outside extremist influences and has devolved into the mess we see now.
The "Arab Spring" could quickly turn into a long "Arab Winter" if the West charges into Iran just as stupidly, brazenly and arrogantly as Cheney and company did in Iraq.
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The of and to a in is I that it for you was with on as have but be they
I'm Christian. Some people blames the Jews for Jesus' death. That's why I hate Israel.
Man, the crusades were the best thing for the Levant.
I assume you're joking. If you're not then consider that the whole mythology of Jesus being put to death and resurrected wouldn't have happened without the Jews, so you should be grateful to them.
I think the West and Israel need to seriously consider the example of Iraq when dealing with Iran. Iraq also had a tonne of potential. They were a well educated nation with a young demographic. They were also, in relation to the region, not particularly devout to their chosen orthodoxy. That's not to say that they weren't religious but rather that they weren't as fundamentalist as many other nations in the region. Unfortunately, because of the bungled invasion and subsequent "management" of Iraq, the country became susceptible to outside extremist influences and has devolved into the mess we see now.
The "Arab Spring" could quickly turn into a long "Arab Winter" if the West charges into Iran just as stupidly, brazenly and arrogantly as Cheney and company did in Iraq.
Iraq prior to the invasion was ruled by one of the most brutal and entrenched dictators the world has ever seen. There was no hope of a revolution there.
I didn't support the Iraq invasion, but don't make it out to be some burgeoning paradise that was ruined by the US. And as much as a mess Iraq is now, since the invasion there has been huge leaps improvements in literacy rates, access to education, infant mortality rates, and, most importatly, deaths due to violence:
Also, you can't paint all muslims with one brush. The Iranians are shi-ite. The arab world is largely Sunni. There are a lot of Sunnis who would love to see the Ayatollahs taken out.
I assume you're joking. If you're not then consider that the whole mythology of Jesus being put to death and resurrected wouldn't have happened without the Jews, so you should be grateful to them.
I was being somewhat facetious.
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Originally Posted by Locke
Thats why Flames fans make ideal Star Trek fans. We've really been taught to embrace the self-loathing and extreme criticism.
You started by asking a pretty good question, then jumped into a bunch of what-if gunk that again just vilifies Israel.
For starters, the settlements are entirely built on land that belonged to Egypt, Syria and Jordan, and all of the land was taken by Israel during times of war. Some of the countries even have peace treaties with Israel. However, the world seems to forget the origins of the land. Israel already gave back the Sinai to Egypt (which is larger than the entire country of Israel) when they signed a peace treaty and also gave back the Gaza Strip to the Palestinians and a chunk of the Westbank, and the Westbank was actually Jordan land. The goal for Israel is land for peace, you decide to be peaceful, we will give you the land.
Why does Israel build on this so called land? They were attacked and kept the strategic land. They have offered the land back, for peace treaties. Had there been someone willing to negotiate, then there probably wouldn't be an issue.
Your entire what-if scenario is based on a complete false history of the region so I won't even bother commenting.
Such a peaceful process that Israel denies the UN Human Rights Council from even visiting said settlements. If this is such a peaceful/helpful process why not allow UN oversight? What are they hiding from the international community?
Settlement has been long stated as one of the major issues stalling the peace process. There are a lot of hard-liners on both sides of this conflict.
That's hilarious. My hatred for Iran, fellow Muslims, is because of my religious upbringing?
That's gold, really.
My hatred for Iran lies with the way that country funds hezbullah and with how they are just begging for ww3.
I already made my point with Israel and I'll leave it at that. Accusing me being Muslim having to do with my hatred for Israel is insulting. I hate Iran just as much.
Have you explained how or why your family was detained by Israeli authorities? Pretty sure you've been called out on that one a couple times.
Such a peaceful process that Israel denies the UN Human Rights Council from even visiting said settlements. If this is such a peaceful/helpful process why not allow UN oversight? What are they hiding from the international community?
Settlement has been long stated as one of the major issues stalling the peace process. There are a lot of hard-liners on both sides of this conflict.
I don't disagree with your statement that there are hardliners on both sides. However, where are you getting this information that the UN has been denied entry into the settlements or any part of the West Bank for that matter. There is probably mroe UN involvement in the Palestinian territories than any place in the world.
I don't disagree with your statement that there are hardliners on both sides. However, where are you getting this information that the UN has been denied entry into the settlements or any part of the West Bank for that matter. There is probably mroe UN involvement in the Palestinian territories than any place in the world.
This topic of who did what first and who is right is fustrating.
Just trying to find a really good book to break it all down without a preceived bias is very difficult.
It is an unfair thought on my part but a Jewish or Muslim author comes across to me as somebody who has skin in the game and I can't take the info without some doubt. I would assume that there are many authors of those faiths that have tried but for every fact presented on one side, the other side says they are lies with their own version of facts
So where does that leave one who would like balanced facts. Do I have to try the Buddhist author section at Chapters?
