Location: A simple man leading a complicated life....
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Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby
I don't disagree, I just don't think reporting stupid comments is fear mongering.
Leaders of parties reporting stuff like that is fear mongering. Especially when all they tell you is how bad or evil this person is and you should vote for us.
Location: A simple man leading a complicated life....
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Originally Posted by crazy_eoj
It's also fearmongering in the sense that many of the PC party candidates hold exactly the same views. Look up Morton's vigorous attack on gay marriage in the papers. Yet, Nanny Redford would have you believe ONLY the wildrose would have these kinds of viewpoints.
There's probably equally batshizzle crazy quotes from the Liberals and NDP, but because they have no chance at forming government, they don't recieve nearly the same amount of scrutiny.
Serious question. All these guys (Hunsperger, Leech) knew they were running for public office. Why did they not have the foresight to maybe delete these things in advance?
Because they believe what they wrote. They think they have the Truth(tm).
They honestly don't see it as wrong, they see it as right in a sea of wrong; anyone that would take issue with it is the one who is misled by satan.
Look at how he defines marriage:
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A fact of life, in contrast, is "any aspect of human existence that must be acknowledged or regarded as unalterable." And the fact is, marriage between one man and one woman is ordained and maintained in its integrity by God and His Word.
Marriage is not my idea or yours; it was God's design from the beginning.
Completely unassailable and beyond any form of debate.
If you think that you are unassailably right, you have no motive to hide it.
If he didn't actually believe what he said then he might hide it because he knew it would hurt his chances.
Or maybe I'm over-thinking, maybe he just thinks that more people agree with him than disagree.
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Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed
I don't see the point of the journalist bringing up that point, it just seems inflammatory.
Maybe, I see it more of a character issue, there are standards for using titles like Dr. or Engineer or whatever, and ignoring those standards (or believing one is above them) says something, especially for someone who is working to participate in government, where the whole point is standards and compliance.
But in this context yeah it's a bit of a shot.
__________________ Uncertainty is an uncomfortable position.
But certainty is an absurd one.
No? If homosexuality and rape are both sins, and Leech believes that all sin is equally reprehensible to God, and He does not identify "levels of sin", what does Leech mean?
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Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby
That God doesn't quantify sin. So basically being gay to God is as wrong as stealing a Mars bar from 7/11, which is equal in God's eyes to murder.
Exactly, but that's not a bad thing, as Bunk was alluding to. I don't want to get too theological here, but all sin is the same, and all are sinners, so Leech is saying that homosexuals are no different than HE HIMSELF is.
That doesn't mean that homosexuality is "on par" with rape. One is obviously a criminal act, and one isn't, and certainly should not be. I'd be VERY surprised if Leech thought any differently (though, unfortunately, there are so called Christians out there who would like Homosexuality to be criminal).
Pointing out what a person might do, if elected is fear mongering. It's so easy to take someones words and create fear. All parties do this and I hate that crap. All parties must think we're so stupid that we can't make informed descions.
You are 100% right, had someone else claimed this to be true, it would be fear mongering. However, he said it himself, so it really isn't fear mongering about his supposed beliefs, it is direct statement of his actual beliefs.
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Originally Posted by Dion
That's what i'm saying.
You would still be electing a bigot though, even if he didn't get a say in policy.
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"Wake up, Luigi! The only time plumbers sleep on the job is when we're working by the hour."
First --- I haven't caught up on the 10-12 pages I've missed.
Seen comments about Leech and thought I would add this to the mix.
No party is immune to candidates making stupid comments.
I'm a little surprised there haven't been more.
Agreed, Mr. Rasheed's comment was pretty stupid as well. However, in our society, these sorts of comments will, for obvious reasons, continue to be more inflammatory when they come from old white men than when they come from less traditionally priviliged people.
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"Life of Russian hockey veterans is very hard," said Soviet hockey star Sergei Makarov. "Most of them don't have enough to eat these days. These old players are Russian legends."
Maybe, I see it more of a character issue, there are standards for using titles like Dr. or Engineer or whatever, and ignoring those standards (or believing one is above them) says something, especially for someone who is working to participate in government, where the whole point is standards and compliance.
But in this context yeah it's a bit of a shot.
If he actually has a doctorate degree, even unaccredited, then no one should have a problem with him calling himself "Dr. Leech."
Exactly, but that's not a bad thing, as Bunk was alluding to. I don't want to get too theological here, but all sin is the same, and all are sinners, so Leech is saying that homosexuals are no different than HE HIMSELF is.
That doesn't mean that homosexuality is "on par" with rape. One is obviously a criminal act, and one isn't, and certainly should not be. I'd be VERY surprised if Leech thought any differently (though, unfortunately, there are so called Christians out there who would like Homosexuality to be criminal).
But isn't he saying that they are morally equilavent then?
Do you think that he would also say that wearing cloth made from two different fabrics is also an equivalent sin to rape (this is a sincere question)?
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"Life of Russian hockey veterans is very hard," said Soviet hockey star Sergei Makarov. "Most of them don't have enough to eat these days. These old players are Russian legends."
Exactly, but that's not a bad thing, as Bunk was alluding to. I don't want to get too theological here, but all sin is the same, and all are sinners, so Leech is saying that homosexuals are no different than HE HIMSELF is.
That doesn't mean that homosexuality is "on par" with rape. One is obviously a criminal act, and one isn't, and certainly should not be. I'd be VERY surprised if Leech thought any differently (though, unfortunately, there are so called Christians out there who would like Homosexuality to be criminal).
As much as I don't like the WRA I agree with you on this point.
I mean Catholicism is venial and mortal sin, but that's a different bag all together.
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Originally Posted by Locke
Thats why Flames fans make ideal Star Trek fans. We've really been taught to embrace the self-loathing and extreme criticism.
The goal is to get voters to vote for the PC party. They think invoking fear is the best way to garner votes. Tell me what you're going to do and not what the other guy might do.
If I'm choosing between to canadidates, what the other guy might do is important information for me to make a good decision. I lean the other way from you. I think if there was more calling other people out on their BS, there would be less BS, and that would be better for everyone.
For example, imagine a promise to keep infrastructure spending below Canada's average. Sounds good on the surface, but the implications are terrible (way below average infrastructure development). I don't have faith that voters will figure that out unless the other parties and/or media point it out to them. If they don't point it out, I see that as not doing their job. Ideas should be challenged, not coddled. (So that natural selection can kill of the weak ones and we evolve into a better society!)
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"Life of Russian hockey veterans is very hard," said Soviet hockey star Sergei Makarov. "Most of them don't have enough to eat these days. These old players are Russian legends."
Location: A simple man leading a complicated life....
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Originally Posted by Rathji
You are 100% right, had someone else claimed this to be true, it would be fear mongering. However, he said it himself, so it really isn't fear mongering about his supposed beliefs, it is direct statement of his actual beliefs.
You're right, talking about his beliefs is not fear mogering. Telling the voting public how his view might be used if elected is fear mongering in my eyes.
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You would still be electing a bigot though, even if he didn't get a say in policy.
Not me personaly but if someone else voted him in based on what he says he will do for his region, i'd have no problems with that.
If he actually has a doctorate degree, even unaccredited, then no one should have a problem with him calling himself "Dr. Leech."
Sure they should. Some people get their degrees from diploma mills in months for a few hundred dollars, I have a major problem with those people calling themselves "Dr", because they haven't done the work or demonstrated the competency that having a "Dr" on your name usually brings with it.
I did all the education that an engineer would have, but the school I went to wasn't properly accredited, so I don't call myself an engineer. If I did I would be being dishonest because I haven't met all the criteria.
__________________ Uncertainty is an uncomfortable position.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Please, in all if not most Christian demonstrations Christ represents a new covenant with God. No one is held to levitical law. So your point is moot.
Sorry, I'm not familiar with Christianity. I thought that the Old Testament was still an important book. I think my first question is still valid though. Is Leech saying that all sin is morally equivalent? (I'm not trying to score points; I'm sincerely curious.)
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"Life of Russian hockey veterans is very hard," said Soviet hockey star Sergei Makarov. "Most of them don't have enough to eat these days. These old players are Russian legends."
If I'm choosing between to canadidates, what the other guy might do is important information for me to make a good decision.
Not as important as what the guy you vote for WILL do. If you are afraid of WR, why do you vote PC? There are NDP, LIB, Green Party, Alberta Party for you to vote for. The reason you vote PC for the fear of of WR is that you actually like PC to begin with. Whether WR is scary or not is largely irrelevant.
Fear mongering doesn't work because there's no guarantee even when it works, the voter will vote for you. And if voters do vote for you, they probably vote for you anyway to begin with.
Sorry, I'm not familiar with Christianity. I thought that the Old Testament was still an important book. I think my first question is still valid though. Is Leech saying that all sin is morally equivalent? (I'm not trying to score points; I'm sincerely curious.)
Yes, that is what I interpret Leech as saying.
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Originally Posted by Locke
Thats why Flames fans make ideal Star Trek fans. We've really been taught to embrace the self-loathing and extreme criticism.
Not as important as what the guy you vote for WILL do. If you are afraid of WR, why do you vote PC? There are NDP, LIB, Green Party, Alberta Party for you to vote for. The reason you vote PC for the fear of of WR is that you actually like PC to begin with. Whether WR is scary or not is largely irrelevant.
Because, aside from the WRP, the Progressive Conservatives are the only party with a chance to form government. Therefore, although I don't like the PCs, I will likely vote for them. Such is life in a stupid system like first-past-the-post.
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Originally Posted by darklord700
Fear mongering doesn't work because there's no guarantee even when it works, the voter will vote for you. And if voters do vote for you, they probably vote for you anyway to begin with.
Well, we'll see what happens next week I guess.
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"Life of Russian hockey veterans is very hard," said Soviet hockey star Sergei Makarov. "Most of them don't have enough to eat these days. These old players are Russian legends."
