#occupy<insertlocalehere>

[valo403]

Perhaps we should all form a meditation circle and allow are differences to evaporate into the sky

Btw, that wasn't meant to be condescending

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by valo403

Perhaps we should all form a meditation circle and allow are differences to evaporate into the sky

What we need is the sacred healing fire they are using at the Vancouver site, apparently it is in the sacred 44 gallon oil drum, again the irony escapes them.

[To Be Quite Honest]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

All of it, I utterly reject all of the assertions that keep getting thrown around about how much worse it is today, I have an immeasurably better life than either my parents or grand parents.
I grew up without a TV or a car, and phone calls cost 10p a minute, 40 odd years later I live in a world where we all throw working TVs and computors and cell phones away because they arn't cool anymore, the homeless have cell phones for gods sake, I have a TV on my wall which I have no doubt is almost identical to Bill Gates's TV, the same applies to my phone, and computor.

So your experience is the end all be all for everyone? Is that fair?

I'm not talking about toys. More people spend their money on crap today then when we were kids. I had 2 transformers and lego... TV's were $1000.00 for a 19inch screen and cars were bigger than our minivans today. Whatever!

Can a bus driver own a home today? I bet he could 20/30 years ago. I believe everyone in Canada should have the opportunity to OWN a home and by opportunity I mean if they don't want one then that's fine they can decline. A home is not an investment, having a home is a right. Not a fancy Trump home just something reasonable for a family. Do we really think housing materials make a house $300 000 and up to build? But because of housing price increases caused by banks over the last 10 years who can get a home? Unfortunately, most people can't afford a $300 000.00 and feed themselves or their kids (which the houses prices in-itself are ridiculous and ONLY benefit banks)

Savings in particular have been stolen in the USA causing MASSIVE world economy collapses. It isn't some insignificant glitch, it was a calculated system wide money grab by financial corporations. What happens when a corporation fails? Well if your phone breaks, or your computer stops working you probably can't get the warranty work, but if a financial corporation fails by the deliberate actions of investors and employees does that money go back to the people? Nope, it stays with the thieves who took it because of corporate law. Now MILLIONS are out of savings and homes and they want to do something about it...

Sorry I'm on my second BIG martini and if I'm not making sense I apologize. I'm trying not to be so lazy in posting like I was earlier because we really were not having discussions then and I prefer discussions to name calling and talking down to others.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

What we need is the sacred healing fire they are using at the Vancouver site, apparently it is in the sacred 44 gallon oil drum, again the irony escapes them.

Perhaps some of them should sit in there and 'occupy' the oil barrel as fuel.

[woob]

Originally Posted by valo403

Perhaps we should all form a meditation circle and allow are differences to evaporate into the sky

Oh look, now the square wants to be a hippy! Grass is greener (and funner to smoke) over here, isn't it?

(I really hope I don't need to put the above in green for everyone )

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by To Be Quite Honest

So your experience is the end all be all for everyone? Is that fair?

I'm not talking about toys. More people spend their money on crap today then when we were kids. I had 2 transformers and lego... TV's were $1000.00 for a 19inch screen and cars were bigger than our minivans today. Whatever!

Can a bus driver own a home today? I bet he could 20/30 years ago. I believe everyone in Canada should have the opportunity to OWN a home and by opportunity I mean if they don't want one then that's fine they can decline. A home is not an investment, having a home is a right. Not a fancy Trump home just something reasonable for a family. Do we really think housing materials make a house $300 000 and up to build? But because of housing price increases caused by banks over the last 10 years who can get a home? Unfortunately, most people can't afford a $300 000.00 and feed themselves or their kids (which the houses prices in-itself are ridiculous and ONLY benefit banks)

Savings in particular have been stolen in the USA causing MASSIVE world economy collapses. It isn't some insignificant glitch, it was a calculated system wide money grab by financial corporations. What happens when a corporation fails? Well if your phone breaks, or your computer stops working you probably can't get the warranty work, but if a financial corporation fails by the deliberate actions of investors and employees does that money go back to the people? Nope, it stays with the thieves who took it because of corporate law. Now MILLIONS are out of savings and homes and they want to do something about it...

Sorry I'm on my second BIG martini and if I'm not making sense I apologize. I'm trying not to be so lazy in posting like I was earlier because we really were not having discussions then and I prefer discussions to name calling and talking down to others.

Actually more people own homes now than ever before.

[To Be Quite Honest]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Actually more people own homes now than ever before.

Good talk... How many homes are in foreclosure in the USA?

[To Be Quite Honest]

Saw this and chuckled...

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Don't worry, those aren't true Occupiers. Just the bridge and tunnel crowd.

Pretty much the "Professional Rioters" line all over again:

The VPD said that "while some legitimate protesters remain there appears to be an increasing number of problem people who seem bent on breaking the law and fighting with anyone who gets in their way, including the news media."

Read more: http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Occ...#ixzz1dBXuyaZZ

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by To Be Quite Honest

Good talk... How many homes are in foreclosure in the USA?

So homes are cheaper than ever!

[To Be Quite Honest]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

So homes are cheaper than ever!

I guess we are done.

[To Be Quite Honest]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

So homes are cheaper than ever!

I guess we are done with this attempt at conversation.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by To Be Quite Honest

So your experience is the end all be all for everyone? Is that fair?

I'm not talking about toys. More people spend their money on crap today then when we were kids. I had 2 transformers and lego... TV's were $1000.00 for a 19inch screen and cars were bigger than our minivans today. Whatever!

Can a bus driver own a home today? I bet he could 20/30 years ago. I believe everyone in Canada should have the opportunity to OWN a home and by opportunity I mean if they don't want one then that's fine they can decline. A home is not an investment, having a home is a right. Not a fancy Trump home just something reasonable for a family. Do we really think housing materials make a house $300 000 and up to build? But because of housing price increases caused by banks over the last 10 years who can get a home? Unfortunately, most people can't afford a $300 000.00 and feed themselves or their kids (which the houses prices in-itself are ridiculous and ONLY benefit banks)

Savings in particular have been stolen in the USA causing MASSIVE world economy collapses. It isn't some insignificant glitch, it was a calculated system wide money grab by financial corporations. What happens when a corporation fails? Well if your phone breaks, or your computer stops working you probably can't get the warranty work, but if a financial corporation fails by the deliberate actions of investors and employees does that money go back to the people? Nope, it stays with the thieves who took it because of corporate law. Now MILLIONS are out of savings and homes and they want to do something about it...

Sorry I'm on my second BIG martini and if I'm not making sense I apologize. I'm trying not to be so lazy in posting like I was earlier because we really were not having discussions then and I prefer discussions to name calling and talking down to others.

Don't Calgary Transit drivers start at $20.00 per hour or about 40k per year?


You're right having a home is a right, but owning a home is not considered a right, that's why there are rental properties.

[To Be Quite Honest]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Don't Calgary Transit drivers start at $20.00 per hour or about 40k per year?


You're right having a home is a right, but owning a home is not considered a right, that's why there are rental properties.

Well there are CT bus drivers and school bus drivers that haul our children everyday.

CT varies from $13.00 to $29.00 last I checked.

As far as owning a home, I believe it is a right to have safe affordable homes. No need for rental properties on a mass scale. No need for $200 000+ homes. However if you want a luxury home you can certainly pay for it.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by To Be Quite Honest

Well there are CT bus drivers and school bus drivers that haul our children everyday.

CT varies from $13.00 to $29.00 last I checked.

As far as owning a home, I believe it is a right to have safe affordable homes. No need for rental properties on a mass scale. No need for $200 000+ homes. However if you want a luxury home you can certainly pay for it.

I don't understand why owning a home would be a right, or even how society would fullfill it.
Do I have a right to a home if I choose not to work?
Do I have a transferable right, say I decide living in Toronto would be nice, can I dump my house in Vancouver and demand a house in Ontario?

In practice this is what you get to live in when you have a 'right' to housing

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by To Be Quite Honest

Well there are CT bus drivers and school bus drivers that haul our children everyday.

CT varies from $13.00 to $29.00 last I checked.

As far as owning a home, I believe it is a right to have safe affordable homes. No need for rental properties on a mass scale. No need for $200 000+ homes. However if you want a luxury home you can certainly pay for it.

When I looked at the CT employment pamphlet it had a starting wage of $20.00 with an increase to $21.50 per hour after the first year.

I'm just not on board with the whole right to own a home, I agree that you have a right to have shelter.

I think you would find it difficult to find any contractor who's going to make a living building extremely cheap houses, the business model is unsupportable.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I think you would find it difficult to find any contractor who's going to make a living building extremely cheap houses, the business model is unsupportable.

Isn't that what half of Calgary's outlying burbs are?

[To Be Quite Honest]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

When I looked at the CT employment pamphlet it had a starting wage of $20.00 with an increase to $21.50 per hour after the first year.

I'm just not on board with the whole right to own a home, I agree that you have a right to have shelter.

I think you would find it difficult to find any contractor who's going to make a living building extremely cheap houses, the business model is unsupportable.

The quality of builds is crap. I owned a suburban home built in 2002 and it was crap (tank god I don't have it anymore). Every house I visited on the block was crap. In fact most houses built after 1994 have been crap. I have a family member that was involved in house construction with his own business for 15 years and this was his opinion. The materials and training are subpar and yet we pay ridiculous amounts for these homes...

This was opinion. Homes should not cost $300 000 to build. Materials do not cost this much.

Now being that this is not the Occupy Calgary thread lets get back to the main discussion shall we. AFC took a part of my previous post and turned it solely into a homes discussion.

"Savings in particular have been stolen in the USA causing MASSIVE world economy collapses. It isn't some insignificant glitch, it was a calculated system wide money grab by financial corporations. What happens when a corporation fails? Well if your phone breaks, or your computer stops working you probably can't get the warranty work, but if a financial corporation fails by the deliberate actions of investors and employees does that money go back to the people? Nope, it stays with the thieves who took it because of corporate law. Now MILLIONS are out of savings and homes and they want to do something about it..."

So when an irresponsible financial corporation dies and all it's money has bled out to the owners pockets what happens? The people sure don't get it back. These owners don't go to jail. This is the main issue at occupy<insertcityhere>.

Anyway, I think most people are for reform in investing. It's just the "Bankers need to pay back what they took" that some of you have a problem with.
I guess law was manipulated enough over the years for you to believe what was done was okay?

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by To Be Quite Honest

The quality of builds is crap. I owned a suburban home built in 2002 and it was crap (tank god I don't have it anymore). Every house I visited on the block was crap. In fact most houses built after 1994 have been crap. I have a family member that was involved in house construction with his own business for 15 years and this was his opinion. The materials and training are subpar and yet we pay ridiculous amounts for these homes...

This was opinion. Homes should not cost $300 000 to build. Materials do not cost this much.

Now being that this is not the Occupy Calgary thread lets get back to the main discussion shall we. AFC took a part of my previous post and turned it solely into a homes discussion.

"Savings in particular have been stolen in the USA causing MASSIVE world economy collapses. It isn't some insignificant glitch, it was a calculated system wide money grab by financial corporations. What happens when a corporation fails? Well if your phone breaks, or your computer stops working you probably can't get the warranty work, but if a financial corporation fails by the deliberate actions of investors and employees does that money go back to the people? Nope, it stays with the thieves who took it because of corporate law. Now MILLIONS are out of savings and homes and they want to do something about it..."

So when an irresponsible financial corporation dies and all it's money has bled out to the owners pockets what happens? The people sure don't get it back. These owners don't go to jail. This is the main issue at occupy<insertcityhere>.

Anyway, I think most people are for reform in investing. It's just the "Bankers need to pay back what they took" that some of you have a problem with.
I guess law was manipulated enough over the years for you to believe what was done was okay?

I feel obligated to point out that most of the cost of a house is the land underneath it, materials and labour have nothing to do with it, and for most individuals owning land is the only true wealth they will ever have, if you undermine this you actually increase the disparity.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by To Be Quite Honest

The quality of builds is crap. I owned a suburban home built in 2002 and it was crap (tank god I don't have it anymore). Every house I visited on the block was crap. In fact most houses built after 1994 have been crap. I have a family member that was involved in house construction with his own business for 15 years and this was his opinion. The materials and training are subpar and yet we pay ridiculous amounts for these homes...

This was opinion. Homes should not cost $300 000 to build. Materials do not cost this much.

Now being that this is not the Occupy Calgary thread lets get back to the main discussion shall we. AFC took a part of my previous post and turned it solely into a homes discussion.

"Savings in particular have been stolen in the USA causing MASSIVE world economy collapses. It isn't some insignificant glitch, it was a calculated system wide money grab by financial corporations. What happens when a corporation fails? Well if your phone breaks, or your computer stops working you probably can't get the warranty work, but if a financial corporation fails by the deliberate actions of investors and employees does that money go back to the people? Nope, it stays with the thieves who took it because of corporate law. Now MILLIONS are out of savings and homes and they want to do something about it..."

So when an irresponsible financial corporation dies and all it's money has bled out to the owners pockets what happens? The people sure don't get it back. These owners don't go to jail. This is the main issue at occupy<insertcityhere>.

Anyway, I think most people are for reform in investing. It's just the "Bankers need to pay back what they took" that some of you have a problem with.
I guess law was manipulated enough over the years for you to believe what was done was okay?

I'm pretty confused on a number of points here.

First, the house cost issue. Not sure where your numbers are coming from, I assume they're just made up for the example, but there's much more to the cost of a home than the materials used to build it. There's land costs, labor costs etc. to factor in. Why would my apartment sell for over $3mil? It has nothing to do with the materials used and everything to do with the location (Manhattan) and the particular dynamics of the market.

Second, what happens to all the money when a corporation dies? Well if by dies you mean goes bankrupt it gets paid off to creditors. Where do you suggest it go?

Third, why would owners of a corporation (note, a reference to an owner of a corporation could mean a whole deal of things. Are you talking about the board? The CEO? The shareholders?) go to jail because that corporation goes bankrupt? If they did something illegal to cause the failure, then sure, make a case and send them to jail if they're found guilty. Otherwise I don't really see how you justify that.