WWII in photos

[Bindair Dundat]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Thanks Military history does come in handy, I went to a U.S. university and decided to take some elective history courses. We had a professor that waxed poetically about the D Day invasion and the greatness of the American effort (which I can't argue with), so I asked some probing questions about the Canadian hand in D-Day to which the professor said it was fairly minimal, of course no insult intended.

So I fired back with a "While the you yanks were still on the beach pooping your pants and trying to figure out how to push forward, the Canadian's on Juno beach had already pushed in land securing key bridge heads and road intersection and how to get the beer trucks out of the sand. Yes Mr Professor, the Canadians pushed further and faster then any on the allied units, but thanks for not understanding D-Day."

Not to mention laying a serious beat-down (in conjunction with Brits on their flank) on the only armoured counterattack attempted by the Germans, on D-Day proper.

Yeah...minor role my *ss.

True, the US took a beating on Omaha. At Utah they basically walked ashore and sat on their butts. This, while the airborne (inland) took care of the artillery that was making life tough for them, and deflecting most of the German counter-offensive efforts in the sector.

Want to learn about D-Day and the Normandy Breakout?

Read "Normandy:1944" by Nicklas Zetterling (Schiffer Military History; 2000)...

It's from the German perspective, but it shows you who did what, and why it went down the way it did.

Don't get me started...LOL

Ron

[Regulator75]

Bump* New pics added yesterday.

[Nage Waza]

/\ /\

It looks like Phaneuf in the second photo!

[Bill Bumface]

Absolutely horrific and disturbing photos of the Holocaust up now. I've never seen any so bad, and so graphic, but I really feel people should see these. Despite reading it in words in many different forms over the years, and even visiting a concentration camp, nothing showed me just how bad it was like these photos did.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by Bindair Dundat

Not to mention laying a serious beat-down (in conjunction with Brits on their flank) on the only armoured counterattack attempted by the Germans, on D-Day proper.

Yeah...minor role my *ss.

True, the US took a beating on Omaha. At Utah they basically walked ashore and sat on their butts. This, while the airborne (inland) took care of the artillery that was making life tough for them, and deflecting most of the German counter-offensive efforts in the sector.

Want to learn about D-Day and the Normandy Breakout?

Read "Normandy:1944" by Nicklas Zetterling (Schiffer Military History; 2000)...

It's from the German perspective, but it shows you who did what, and why it went down the way it did.

Don't get me started...LOL

Ron

Don't get your panties in a wad... Good lord, Canadian's played a role and a big role in WWII but lets not try to act that their role was no where near the effort that the yanks put in. While the Brits were scared to bomb during daylight it was the Yanks that did daylight bombing raids.

[Superfraggle]

Originally Posted by PIMking

Don't get your panties in a wad... Good lord, Canadian's played a role and a big role in WWII but lets not try to act that their role was no where near the effort that the yanks put in. While the Brits were scared to bomb during daylight it was the Yanks that did daylight bombing raids.

Spoken like a true American.

Canada declared war on Germany September 10, 1939.

The US didn't join until December 1941.

Don't buy in to the propaganda that the US won the war for all the other pansy countries. We fought and fought hard for over two years before the US finally got flushed out of their hidey-hole by the attack on Pearl Harbour. It is condescending, insulting, and just plain ignorant to say our role was nowhere near the effort the US put in. Canada was not the military nothing it is today. Canada was a huge part of the success at Dieppe, Normandy, and countless other venues. Do some research and actually find out what other countries did in the war, because the US did not win things by itself, and was not even close to the dominant saviour it pretends itself to be.

[sa226]

Originally Posted by PIMking

Don't get your panties in a wad... Good lord, Canadian's played a role and a big role in WWII but lets not try to act that their role was no where near the effort that the yanks put in. While the Brits were scared to bomb during daylight it was the Yanks that did daylight bombing raids.

Although as a Canadian I am biased, I think we have every right to get our panties in a wad over the largely ignored efforts by Canada in 20th century war history.

You can't directly compare Canada to the US in war effort, that is ridiculous considering the size of each respective population.

We get our panties in a wad because Canada has repeatedly punched way above its weight class, and has done so admirably, and we get no damn respect for it.

I have been to Normandy, I have done a tour of Juno beach. Stories as told by Canadians at the Juno beach center, Canadian tourists and local tour guides suggest that there is an alarming number of Americans that didn't even know Canada took part in WWII let alone played a large part in DDay and the breakout.

Canadians were thrown into an impossible scenario in Dieppe and fought bravely.

The Canadians pushed farther inland than any other on DDay. We got our asses handed to us later on but regrouped and played a major role in closing the Falaise gap in the months after DDay.

Canadians were given the task of taking Antwerp a vital shipping port but also a strategic nightmare because of the estuary of the Scheldt. The battle was unecessarily brutal, but the 1st army did it.

And countless other feats, all for a country of 11 million.

In Afghanistan, Canada had been doing much of the heavy lifting with a beleaguered armed forces of a country of 30 million. While other NATO members like France, Germany, Italy all twiddle their thumbs (well they are there but in a much smaller and less dangerous capacity)

Outside of Canada how many people do you think know this? I bet you would be surprised.

This post is not directed at you, more so to help you understand why we tend to get our backs up when it comes to these sorts of discussions.

As a Canadian I can take the jokes about lumberjacks, maple syrup, we all live in Igloos etc, etc.....But when the ignorance turns to disrespecting the sacrifice Canadians have made throughout history and are still making today, then I too get my panties in a wad

[CaptainCrunch]

Nobody begrudges the credit that the American's get for their contributions to the European theatre. Their manpower, equipment pure manufacturing weight and logistical expertise bought the war to an earlier end.

But lets be honest, by the time the American's entered the war, Germany's defeat was pretty much a given, it was a matter of time before they exhausted themselves, the major battles for the American's were in the Pacific where they truly showed their military might.

But if you look at Canada's contributions in WW2

Canada's contribution to getting food to the allies and helping to break the submarine blocade were paramount, without that Britain would have probably been starved out. the creation of the unique and very Canadian Corvette allowed a massive increase in the amount of supplies getting through in concert with Britains anti submarine efforts.

50,000 pilots trained at the Commowealth training program and a great many Canadians participated in the BOB as pilots.

The Dieppe raid was a bloody awful campaign for Canada, but the lesson's learned from that raid lead to many of the successful inovations that contributed to D-Day's success.

Canada was crucial to the success in Italy, and our troops were crucial in breaking the vaunted Htiler line.

We've talked about the successes of the Canadian D Day invasion.

The battle of the Scheldt was a major victory for Canada and the Allies

Canada liberated the Netherlands.

Lets look at another key contribution from Canada and that was the creation with the American's of the First Special Services Brigade which created the concept of dedicated special forces Commando units, the lessons learned lead to the professionalization of training and lead to groups like the Green Berets.

Canada gained a lot of its reputation in Korea especially in the battle of Kapyong that saw Canadian's moving into the battle while other troops were moving away.

Canadian Forces fighter pilots served in the USAF as part of an exchange program during Korea as well.

In every engagement that Canada has been in the underlying sense is that we're a nation that goes in does a professional job, punches far above its weight and goes home, yet we continually hear that we're wimps that we're terrible, we get little credit on the international stage.

Even today, Canada's Navy performs admirably with the american's in war zones.

In Maple Flag Canada's fighter pilots outperform any of their allied counterparts.

It wasn't that long ago that during an Excercies a Canadian sub slipped into an American carrier group and simulated torpedo runs on a super carrier.

We should be incredibly proud of our history, we shouldn't be taking a back seat to anyone in terms of our history, and it should get our backs up when its suggested that we don't contribute on a high scale for a small country.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by Superfraggle

Spoken like a true American.

Canada declared war on Germany September 10, 1939.

The US didn't join until December 1941.

Don't buy in to the propaganda that the US won the war for all the other pansy countries. We fought and fought hard for over two years before the US finally got flushed out of their hidey-hole by the attack on Pearl Harbour. It is condescending, insulting, and just plain ignorant to say our role was nowhere near the effort the US put in. Canada was not the military nothing it is today. Canada was a huge part of the success at Dieppe, Normandy, and countless other venues. Do some research and actually find out what other countries did in the war, because the US did not win things by itself, and was not even close to the dominant saviour it pretends itself to be.

Funny thing is that I'm not an American. Two, I find it funny that you have Napoleon complex going on with you here. I didn't say that the Canadian's didn't do anything, I just said that he's getting his panties in a wad over nothing just like you. But go ahead and continue to flame away.

[PIMking]

CC,

How was the German army all but beaten before the Yanks joined the war? (this is an honest question) Do you think the Normandy invasion would of been successful or even happened if the yanks weren't in the war?

at that point the German army had a firm grip of western europe, I think they would of eventually lost with Russians advancing causing less German troops on the western front.

I can say it honestly doesn't matter whether you're canadian, American, Dutch,French, English, or scottish. These brave people all paid the ultimate price to rid the world of the evil that was the nazi regime. I'm so grateful that those who fought, the world is a better place because of them.

[MarchHare]

How was the German army all but beaten before the Yanks joined the war?

Germany was beaten the moment Hitler broke the non-aggression pact with the Soviet Union. More than 3/4 of German casualties during the war were on the Eastern Front. The Germans would have been defeated even without American involvement in the war.

What the Americans did accomplish, though, is hasten the Allied victory by several years and ensure that Western Europe did not fall under the Soviet sphere of influence after the Germans were defeated.

Would D-Day have happened without the US? Almost certainly yes, but not as early as 1944. Probably in 1945 or 1946, though, when the Western Front would have been significantly less defended as Germany would have been forced to move units to the East.

In any case, the US made a huge sacrifice during WWII, as did all nations who fought against the Nazis. Arguing over whose country did the most heavy lifting is pointless nationalistic dick-waving, especially since it's a demonstrable fact that the Soviet Union played -- by far -- the biggest role in defeating Hitler.

[GoinAllTheWay]

Pretty sure I've read somewhere that no Canadian army has ever surrendered to anyone, anywhere. If true, I REALLY like that stat.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Germany was beaten the moment Hitler broke the non-aggression pact with the Soviet Union. More than 3/4 of German casualties during the war were on the Eastern Front. The Germans would have been defeated even without American involvement in the war.

What the Americans did accomplish, though, is hasten the Allied victory by several years and ensure that Western Europe did not fall under the Soviet sphere of influence after the Germans were defeated.

Would D-Day have happened without the US? Almost certainly yes, but not as early as 1944. Probably in 1945 or 1946, though, when the Western Front would have been significantly less defended as Germany would have been forced to move units to the East.

In any case, the US made a huge sacrifice during WWII, as did all nations who fought against the Nazis. Arguing over whose country did the most heavy lifting is pointless nationalistic dick-waving, especially since it's a demonstrable fact that the Soviet Union played -- by far -- the biggest role in defeating Hitler.

Can't be stated enough that it was the eastern front and Russia that are responsible for the victory in Europe for the Allies.

Here are some pictures from my own collection:



I am quite fond of this one. Hitler looks impatient.




Notice Hitler's well manicured nails worn long.


This last one has been my desktop for a long, long time.

[burn_this_city]

Is that the Bismarck?

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Is that the Bismarck?

Yes it is. Edit: it's from astern.

Here is the Bismarck as it exists today:

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by PIMking

CC,

How was the German army all but beaten before the Yanks joined the war? (this is an honest question) Do you think the Normandy invasion would of been successful or even happened if the yanks weren't in the war?

at that point the German army had a firm grip of western europe, I think they would of eventually lost with Russians advancing causing less German troops on the western front.

I can say it honestly doesn't matter whether you're canadian, American, Dutch,French, English, or scottish. These brave people all paid the ultimate price to rid the world of the evil that was the nazi regime. I'm so grateful that those who fought, the world is a better place because of them.

Germany severely over reached itself after its initial successes in the war.

I can agree that they had a fairly firm grimp on the Western European front, but they were bled out by the Russians, not only in terms of manpower, but most of their most experienced armor and frontal aviation got tied up there, and it was a matter of time til the Russian's hit Berlin because of their massive abilitiy to counter punch with men and machinary.

Germany also made the mistake of trying to rescue Italy first in the Desert, then in Italy, and the Italian campaign gave Hitler a new worry as a D-Day invasion might only be a distraction to the real attempt by the allies to gut Germany through a soft underbelly.

Most military strategist will tell you that you will always lose a war on two fronts especially against a numerically superior foe, a three front war was insanity by Hitler.

But Germany's defeat was at that point measurable. They were beaten in Germany and in Italy.

If the Allies would have appeassed the Russians, they would have launched their final invasion through Italy and up without the American's help,, but decided to wait which caused the cooling of Stalin's relation with the allies.


But I think that Hitler was also very dissapointed that the Japanese didn't do more to pull American Troops into the pacific.


Hitler was truly surprised by D-Day thanks in large part to things like Operation Mincemeat, and through the assigning of Patton to a false army. He was so surprised and the high command was so surprised that they refused to release a massive armoured Panzer SS to assist in the defense of the beaches.

I have no doubt that if the German's had taken D-Day seriously and released an elite armoured division that D-Day would have been a lot bloodier or possibly thrown back into the water.

[Superfraggle]

Originally Posted by PIMking

Funny thing is that I'm not an American. Two, I find it funny that you have Napoleon complex going on with you here. I didn't say that the Canadian's didn't do anything, I just said that he's getting his panties in a wad over nothing just like you. But go ahead and continue to flame away.

You did say " lets not try to act that their role was no where near the effort that the yanks put in", which is what I was reacting to. And here you have continued to post in a condescending manner. Call it a Napoleon complex if you like, but I don't feel bad about standing up to this type of ignorant comment.

[the-rasta-masta]

One thing about the Germans is their army and uniforms looked way more badass than anybody elses. Those uniforms are sleek. I always get a chill whenever I see their troops marching/goose stepping. Intimidating war machine to say the least.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by the-rasta-masta

One thing about the Germans is their army and uniforms looked way more badass than anybody elses. Those uniforms are sleek. I always get a chill whenever I see their troops marching/goose stepping. Intimidating war machine to say the least.

The German Army tends to get a really bad reputation because of the actions of the SS.

The German Army in WW2 were not the same kind of fanatics, but they were extremely well trained and decidicated and tough. They were the modern day definition of a professional army populated by professional soldiers.

I don't think that they even panicked when the Russians were rumbling into Berlin.

Thier armoured core was ahead of the game in terms of tactics and training, but they fell behind in terms of competant tank designs.

[the-rasta-masta]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

The German Army tends to get a really bad reputation because of the actions of the SS.

The German Army in WW2 were not the same kind of fanatics, but they were extremely well trained and decidicated and tough. They were the modern day definition of a professional army populated by professional soldiers.

I don't think that they even panicked when the Russians were rumbling into Berlin.

Thier armoured core was ahead of the game in terms of tactics and training, but they fell behind in terms of competant tank designs.

I always thought the German Tiger was one of the most feared?