Congresswoman and 17 others shot in Arizona

[Flame Of Liberty]

Originally Posted by T@T

Are you suggesting the United states would be like Mexico if they banned handguns and assault rifles? Mexico is what it is because of years of corrupt government and police.

How about use Britain, Sweden, France, Canada and many many more instead using a country under basically a civil war as your example.

There is ZERO reason why a citizen should possess a handgun or assault rifle..period.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_pol...in_Switzerland

Swiss males grow up expecting to undergo basic military training, usually at age 20 in the Rekrutenschule (German for "recruit school"), the initial boot camp, after which Swiss men remain part of the "militia" in reserve capacity until age 30 (age 34 for officers). Each such individual is required to keep his army-issued personal weapon (the 5.56x45mm Sig 550 rifle for enlisted personnel and/or the 9mm SIG-Sauer P220 semi-automatic pistol for officers, medical and postal personnel) at home with a specified personal retention quantity of government-issued personal ammunition (50 rounds 5.56 mm / 48 rounds 9mm)

Imagine this in the US. How come young white swiss males don't go on killing sprees when they have rifles and ammo right under their beds? Perhaps there's more into the issue than simple "solutions" like "ban guns"?

[Gozer]

Originally Posted by peter12

Then why make it?

Broadening the argument would likely lead to some pedantic tangent instead of addressing the thrust of my argument.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Gozer

Broadening the argument would likely lead to some pedantic tangent instead of addressing the thrust of my argument.

Fair enough, but I just want to know exactly what makes the Dems such angels this time around. They are trying to push through some of the most dramatic economic policies in the largest expansion of government in American history. That's not just benign.

[Calgaryborn]

Well according to a classmate the shooter was left wing and quite liberal:
http://www.businessinsider.com/woman...#ixzz1AUP3tpq2

[Weiser Wonder]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

Well according to a classmate the shooter was left wing and quite liberal:
http://www.businessinsider.com/woman...#ixzz1AUP3tpq2

He was also obsessed with the 2012 prophecy, which means he's not a critical thinker. With those people their political ideology lies in their emotions, making them extremely likely to radically switch political ideologies.

Not that this guy was right wing. I honestly hope he's not. I want this to be a crazy guy, not a sign of a growing environment of political violence in the States.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

Well according to a classmate the shooter was left wing and quite liberal:
http://www.businessinsider.com/woman...#ixzz1AUP3tpq2

Surprise surprise.

A left-wing, Mein Kampf-reading atheist into English grammar, the gold standard, Doomsday prophecies, gun rights, Jim Morrison, sign language and binge drinking.

Typical.

[Gozer]

Originally Posted by peter12

Fair enough, but I just want to know exactly what makes the Dems such angels this time around. They are trying to push through some of the most dramatic economic policies in the largest expansion of government in American history. That's not just benign.

Dens aren't angels, I think they're going to abandon Obama - heck they already have. Democrats were campaigning agains Obama halfway through his first term. They know the score and know Obama is most likely going to be among the most hated Presidents of all time right around 2012. (Neck and neck with the only other President since the proliferation of the Internet)

The anti-spending Republicans that campaigned sheepishly on "we've learned our lesson" just passed a budget that permits no new spending or taxes, except for their own pet projects. It's a do-nothing commitment being followed through all over the place.
John McCain pitifully chasing any possible impediment to repealing don't-ask-don't-tell, republicans shouting down health care hearings, steadfastly refusing to pass anything until unpaid-for tax cuts are approved - their actions lend credence to the hateful - tragedies like today are not borne of luck.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

Well I understand this fellow was an atheist, so I guess it might be hard for the atheists here to blame religion for this one.

Just a question, what was the point in this post?

It's like you're having an imaginary debate with yourself, and now you're all smiles that you won it.

[pepper24]

Post 25

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

It might be prudent to find out what motivated this young man before laying the blame squarely at the feet of the republican right.

Well said.

Post 42

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

The Congresswomen was calling for a crackdown on illegal immigration. Perhaps someone thought she was betraying her party.

It might be prudent to find out what motivated this young man before laying the blame squarely at the feet of someone from the democratic left.

[Stumptown]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

Well according to a classmate the shooter was left wing and quite liberal:
http://www.businessinsider.com/woman...#ixzz1AUP3tpq2

When I read her statement earlier today I was struck by the thought that she (as well as many people) may be confusing "liberal" with "libertarian." Much of what I've managed to glean out of the shooters ramblings on YouTube is pretty much down the path of the radical libertatians. Not many liberals going on about the gold standard, but it's a pretty common theme among libertarians. People do change, though, and this guy was obviously unbalanced and susceptible to some pretty crazy ideas.

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by Flabbibulin

I guess everyone is eager to assume things, but we shouldn't overlook the possibility that this was simply a crazy on a shooting spree

That doesn't change anything regarding the hatred spewing from the right. There really is no false equivalence on the left, though you'll see that meme pushed a lot by talk radio and the rightwing bloggers.

[Flame Of Liberty]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

Surprise surprise.

A left-wing, Mein Kampf-reading atheist into English grammar, the gold standard, Doomsday prophecies, gun rights, Jim Morrison, sign language and binge drinking.

Typical.

Did you just put the gold standard in the same sentence with Mein Kampf and doomsday prophecies? You do realize the US currency was backed by gold until 40 years ago? Bat-#### crazy huh?

/offtopic

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Because there is a large number of Canadians, especially young Canadians, who have a very warped sense of the American reality.

And a large number of us, not so young anymore, who have lived here for quite a few years. The current state of politics here has everything to do with this shooting.

[Calgaryborn]

Originally Posted by Weiser Wonder

He was also obsessed with the 2012 prophecy, which means he's not a critical thinker. With those people their political ideology lies in their emotions, making them extremely likely to radically switch political ideologies.

Not that this guy was right wing. I honestly hope he's not. I want this to be a crazy guy, not a sign of a growing environment of political violence in the States.

Your actually believe that. Come on! The guy is a left wing loon. He also is obviously crazy. People with psychotic conditions often gravitate towards drug/alcohol abuse which he did.

[Stumptown]

"When you look at unbalanced people, how they respond to the vitriol that comes out of certain mouths about tearing down the government. The anger, the hatred, the bigotry that goes on in this country is getting to be outrageous," the sheriff said. "And unfortunately, Arizona I think has become the capital. We have become the mecca for prejudice and bigotry."

This comes from Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik. He knows what's going on in his county.

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

Your actually believe that. Come on! The guy is a left wing loon. He also is obviously crazy. People with psychotic conditions often gravitate towards drug/alcohol abuse which he did.

Is he?

[Calgaryborn]

[QUOTE=pepper24;2881626]Post 25


Well said.

Post 42


It might be prudent to find out what motivated this young man before laying the blame squarely at the feet of someone from the democratic left.[/QUOTE

LOL. But I've maintained from the start that he is crazy. The evidence that he is liberal or an atheist doesn't discount that probability. What it does do though is refute all those posts who have tried to blame right wing personalities or the tea party.

[Calgaryborn]

Originally Posted by Stumptown

When I read her statement earlier today I was struck by the thought that she (as well as many people) may be confusing "liberal" with "libertarian." Much of what I've managed to glean out of the shooters ramblings on YouTube is pretty much down the path of the radical libertatians. Not many liberals going on about the gold standard, but it's a pretty common theme among libertarians. People do change, though, and this guy was obviously unbalanced and susceptible to some pretty crazy ideas.

Yah maybe but, his classmate said left wing and liberal. People don't usually confuse libertarian thinking people with left wingers.

[Calgaryborn]

Originally Posted by the2bears

Is he?

From the information presented so far it appears that he is a loon for sure and probably liberal.

[Stimpy]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

LOL. But I've maintained from the start that he is crazy. The evidence that he is liberal or an atheist doesn't dioscount that probability. What it does do though is refute all those posts who have tried to blame right wing personalities or the tea party.

What indications are there he was a liberal? Law enforcement in the state seems to think otherwise, and law enforcement is extremely conservative. They are also looking for a second party, so it doesn't look like the shooter acted alone.