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Old 02-21-2010, 11:43 AM   #81
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If I was Iginla and Canada selected me to play on the 4th line. I would respectfully decline and stay home. Give my spot to a kid.
Exactly! They named him an alternate captain for a reason...
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Old 02-21-2010, 11:52 AM   #82
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If I was Iginla and Canada selected me to play on the 4th line. I would respectfully decline and stay home. Give my spot to a kid.
The thing is they didn't. Nash Crosby Iginla were the #1 line the entire time at Team Canada Orientation. I would not be suprised if Babcock pulled this crap on Iginla before the first game.
Isn't Detriot and the Flames in a battle to get into that last playoff spot. Isn't common knowledge around the NHL that a confident Iginla is hard to stop? But Iggy lacking confidence is a shaky competitor.
Iginla Being bumped from the top line to the 4th for no reason would be a mindfrack to Iginla. All the while Canada has enough depth to overcome that ridiculous Babcock decision. I just think Babcock, Yzerman, Holland have other possibly other motives. Food for thought anyways.
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Old 02-21-2010, 11:54 AM   #83
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I don't know if this has been mentioned before but it seemed to me that Babcock was almost disappointed that Iglina scored a hattrick in this Norway game. It made it much more difficult for him to justify utilizing the player as the extra forward.

Unless Iginla is injured I do not understand the coaches mindset whatsoever. Are they continuing to stick to their 'masterplan' at all costs? Surely not, given the level of experience and expertise involved here.
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Old 02-21-2010, 11:55 AM   #84
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I don't know about anyone else, but these Olympics are starting to leave a real sour taste in my mouth. I know Iggy wouldn't agree, but I would rather just not even have him there at all then to see him get disrespected like this.
I hope Iggy and the Flames aren't as big of a whiner as you and some of the other posters.

This and the Babcock thread seriously make me question some of you guys. People saying they hate Babcock, that he's a crappy coach, that you won't cheer for Canada, that you now hate the Olympics.

I hate to break it to you guys but Iggy is just one superstar on a team of superstars.

Do you think all the Toews and Richards fans were whining like babies because their guy got started on the 4th line?

I know we all have a soft spot for Iggy but some of this is really pathetic. People blaming Babcock for losing us gold after 2 games? Saying Iggy on the top line is the only way to gold?

These two threads have honestly made me lose faith a lot of posters ability to objectively judge anything. Some of you guys sound like Canuck trolls that roll through these parts. No logic or reason, only whining and complaining.

Post Iggy's stats all you want but he's on a struggling Flames team and other than November has pretty much been a non-factor all year long. I really do wish he'd play every game like he did against NORWAY but lets not forget it was friggin' NORWAY that he played well against.

If he deserves a spot on the top line, Iggy will get it. No amount of whining about the horrible plight of Jarome will change that, no matter how funny it is when I read it.

Edit: How appropriate that right as I post this someone posts a conspiracy post that Babcock was mad that Iggy did well against Norway.

Oh, no! Someone call Transplant99, maybe he can enlighten us on how this is actually a Kevin Lowe conspiracy and how Babcock is being blackmailed by Lowe to make sure Iggy doesn't get good ice time!

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Old 02-21-2010, 12:02 PM   #85
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I hope Iggy and the Flames aren't as big of a whiner as you and some of the other posters.

This and the Babcock thread seriously make me question some of you guys. People saying they hate Babcock, that he's a crappy coach, that you won't cheer for Canada, that you now hate the Olympics.

I hate to break it to you guys but Iggy is just one superstar on a team of superstars.

Do you think all the Toews and Richards fans were whining like babies because their guy got started on the 4th line?

I know we all have a soft spot for Iggy but some of this is really pathetic. People blaming Babcock for losing us gold after 2 games? Saying Iggy on the top line is the only way to gold?

These two threads have honestly made me lose faith a lot of posters ability to objectively judge anything. Some of you guys sound like Canuck trolls that roll through these parts. No logic or reason, only whining and complaining.

Post Iggy's stats all you want but he's on a struggling Flames team and other than November has pretty much been a non-factor all year long. I really do wish he'd play every game like he did against NORWAY but lets not forget it was friggin' NORWAY that he played well against.

If he deserves a spot on the top line, Iggy will get it. No amount of whining about the horrible plight of Jarome will change that, no matter how funny it is when I read it.

Edit: How appropriate that right as I post this someone posts a conspiracy post that Babcock was mad that Iggy did well against Norway.

Oh, no! Someone call Transplant99, maybe he can enlighten us on how this is actually a Kevin Lowe conspiracy and how Babcock is being blackmailed by Lowe to make sure Iggy doesn't get good ice time!
I find posts like this far more annoying than anything else in this thread.
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:09 PM   #86
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I find posts like this far more annoying than anything else in this thread.

Good for you. If you don't agree with me then feel free to not read it.


Am I annoying because I actually think Babcock is a decent coach? Or is it because despite my love for Iggy, I don't think he's the greatest player in the history of hockey? Or maybe it is because I recognize that there are other players on this team that have incredible skill? Or maybe it is because I realize that Iggy can just as easily be back on the 1st line? Or maybe it is because I didn't just complain about team Canada for a whole page and tried to use some logic and reason as to why Iggy isn't on the 1st line?

If defending the coaching staff and not just making Iggy out to be a martyr is annoying then I guess I'm annoying.

Some posters have made some very valid points about the setup of this team (Vlad had a nice breakdown in one of these threads). Agree or disagree it is better than just saying Babcock pissed away gold and that you won't be cheering for Canada anymore because Iggy isn't the centerpiece of this team.

I like Iginla as much as the next guy and I think Babcock has some kinks to work out with his line up but I'm not such a kool aid drinking, blinders on fan that I just blindly proclaim the team a failure because Iggy isn't on the 1st line. It just sounds like sour grapes. "well OUR guy isn't the #1 RW so I guess the coach is an idiot and has it out for him". Riiiiiiiiiight.
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:13 PM   #87
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If Hockey Canada wanted a player to bang and crash on the 4th line, Rene Bourque would have been the much better choice. That is simply not Iggys game.

Were these guys not on the road for the better part of a year picking this team?? Simply baffling.
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:14 PM   #88
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How do you disagree with someone without reading what they say?
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:15 PM   #89
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Hey Flip last time a Team Canada player scored a hat trick against ANY Country was 22 years ago in 1988.
Regardless what you think about Iginla he accomplished another piece of Iggy lore and history.
Utilizing who is statistically right now the 4th best RW in the entire NHL as a checker is ######ed.
Maybe Iginla should have brought his gold medal for inspiration to this group of forwards who want and then in private said to Babcock is this what your staff wants and walk out. But we all know Iggy is all class, which is why Babcock is pulling this sh#t with him because Iggy will be graceful take the high road and be a team player.
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:32 PM   #90
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Hey Flip last time a Team Canada player scored a hat trick against ANY Country was 22 years ago in 1988.
Regardless what you think about Iginla he accomplished another piece of Iggy lore and history.
Utilizing who is statistically right now the 4th best RW in the entire NHL as a checker is ######ed.
Maybe Iginla should have brought his gold medal for inspiration to this group of forwards who want and then in private said to Babcock is this what your staff wants and walk out. But we all know Iggy is all class, which is why Babcock is pulling this sh#t with him because Iggy will be graceful take the high road and be a team player.
See, your reasoning is hilarious.

Iggy got a hat trick. No one has done that in 22 years.

ZOMG I guess that means Iggy is the greatest player in history! Why do we even need anyone else just put out Iggy and 2 Dmen and we'll win.

Babcock is doing EXACTLY what we all wanted after Turin.

In Turin we left off a bunch of skilled guys and brought a true checking line (Draper/Maltby etc). Then we realized that even though they can check, they were useless elsewhere and couldn't score.

Now, Yzerman and co. have learned from that mistake and do the WJHC route of Team Canada and bring the best 20 skaters. However, if we do that then we MUST use some of our amazing skilled guys in modified roles.

No matter what you guys think Babcock didn't tell Iggy "Jarome you are just a checker now, DON'T you dare score". You know why? Because that would be ######ed.

Team Canada is utilizing very skilled players in roles that they aren't 100% acustomed to. But that is the cost of making the team. Plus, we learned in 06 that using crappy players who are good checkers doesn't work. We need guys who have skill and can play a good 2 way game. They need to be good at both ends of the ice.

One thing that gave me a good laugh are the comments about Iggy being on the 4th line and how he can't be good on the 4th line and (some posters) have even suggested he should have declined or just stayed home. Or as you suggest that he'll just suck it up and play it classy.

Ok, well then you name me 4 guys on this team (the 4th line plus a 13th forward) who play a similar role to that on their NHL team?

Oh, what's that, you can't name ANY! What a shock! I guess that is because EVERY single player on this team is a 1st line player.

No matter who we put on the 4th line/13th forward they will be underutilized. Babcock obviously recognizes that Iggy has the ability to be a physical player (not sure what game he was watching this year of Iggy but that is a different discussion) and as such put him in a checking role.

When we look at the team though, Iggy is probably one of the best guys to put in a checking role.

Heatley/Thornton/Marleau - Nope they are probably the 1st line until Crosby gets his shiznat together because they already have chemistry

Crosby/Nash/Getzlaf/Perry - Well Crosby is a decent 2 way guy but no way in hell he's going to be on a checking line. Nash, he's a big physical presence but he's got WAY better hands than Iggy so not utilizing him with a Crosby type player would be a waste. Getzlaf and Perry are decent 2 way guys but them and Staal aren't as physical.

Morrow/Richards/Bergeron - ok these guys are all checking line types. Not regular checkers, but they fit the profile. They have grit, they can kill penalties, they can score, they are good defensively. Realistically this should be that "grinder" type line who is good both ways and can add some offence and grit and wear down the opposition.

I agree Iggy shouldn't be on that line. However, since Staal is already with Getzlaf and Perry (and Iggy doesn't play LW), he's either on the 1st line or he's the 13th forward. And that actually sounds about right to me.

So, we're all up in arms why? Because Iggy had a hat trick and no one has done that in 22 years? Really?

Is the backbone of your argument seriously that a)Iggy has a gold medal (so do Blake, Nolan and Fleury but we didn't bring them) and b) that Iggy got a hat trick, which is awesome, but hardly cements him in as the 1st line RW forever.

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Old 02-21-2010, 12:38 PM   #91
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How do you disagree with someone without reading what they say?

Ok, read it then ignore it. Or if it gives you bad vibes just skip ahead to the next post. Aren't I supposed to be on your ignore list?
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:47 PM   #92
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Crosby/Nash/Getzlaf/Perry - Well Crosby is a decent 2 way guy but no way in hell he's going to be on a checking line. Nash, he's a big physical presence but he's got WAY better hands than Iggy so not utilizing him with a Crosby type player would be a waste.
So because Nash has better hands than Iginla he should be locked into the first line?

Only one player has scored a goal while playing on Canada's first line so far in this tournament, I have no idea how he did it with suck weak hands!
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:49 PM   #93
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FfvB - vBulletin is such a wonderful addon for firefox not only does one not have to read flip's post but you also don't have to read his post when they are quoted a bunch of times.

Anyways I personally never really cared much about this tournament and with them continuing Iggy's poor treatment I've completely stopped caring. I'm very happy Iggy did so well the first game and made those around him look so much better than they were playing like he has been doing his whole career. Feel bad for Iggy saying this but don't really care where Canada finishes, being that I have interest in other teams as well wouldn't be too sad to see them upset again.

Go Finland!
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:52 PM   #94
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So because Nash has better hands than Iginla he should be locked into the first line?

Only one player has scored a goal while playing on Canada's first line so far in this tournament, I have no idea how he did it with suck weak hands!
Nash isn't really competing with a spot with Iggy. He is playing LW and Iggy doesn't. It is more like Richards and Toews are competing for spots with Iggy on the 1st line.

By good hands I mean that Nash is more than just a shooter like Iggy. I don't think Iggy brings a whole lot to the table in comparison with these other guys when it comes to on ice skill.

Iggy has great leadership but he can do that from the bench.

Nash/Toews/Richards all have a wider range of offensive (and for Toews and Richards better defensive) weapons.

Iggy can shoot. That is about all. He's an ok set up guy as we learned last year with Cammy but I think Toews, Richards and Nash all have a wider range of weapons, even if they maybe aren't as good at pure goal scoring. All of them can gain the zone, make beautiful moves, score 1 on 1 (something Iggy is REALLY lacking), and make wonderful passes.

That isn't to say Iggy can't play 1st line RW, he just isn't the only one who can and maybe isn't even the best choice. Saying some guys are more suited to certain positions is like choosing between a Ferrari and a Lambo. None of them are bad. Some of them are very slightly better in some ways.

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Old 02-21-2010, 01:02 PM   #95
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Nash isn't really competing with a spot with Iggy. He is playing LW and Iggy doesn't. It is more like Richards and Toews are competing for spots with Iggy on the 1st line.

By good hands I mean that Nash is more than just a shooter like Iggy. I don't think Iggy brings a whole lot to the table in comparison with these other guys when it comes to on ice skill.

Iggy has great leadership but he can do that from the bench.

Nash/Toews/Richards all have a wider range of offensive (and for Toews and Richards better defensive) weapons.

Iggy can shoot. That is about all. He's an ok set up guy as we learned last year with Cammy but I think Toews, Richards and Nash all have a wider range of weapons, even if they maybe aren't as good at pure goal scoring. All of them can gain the zone, make beautiful moves, score 1 on 1 (something Iggy is REALLY lacking), and make wonderful passes.

That isn't to say Iggy can't play 1st line RW, he just isn't the only one who can and maybe isn't even the best choice.
Actually Nash IS competing with Iginla.

Bob McKenzie had this on his Twitter yesterday.

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Key for me is Rick Nash needs to play right side, which pushes Iginla off that line. Chemistry with Crosby-Nash is greater than Sid-Iggy.
Nash and Crosby can continue to try and impress the crowd with their showboating and backhand passes while not putting the puck in the net though.

As for Nash bringing more to the table, I am not sure what that is exactly, his career high in assists is 39. Not exactly impressive. He has just as many points as Iginla this year, and Iginla has struggled for the majority of the season. I really don't get all the Rick Nash hype, and what makes him a lock for Canada's first line.

Nash may be better at certain aspects of the game than Iginla, but I wouldn't say either of those things are putting the puck in the net, or helping other people put the puck in the net.
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Old 02-21-2010, 01:04 PM   #96
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...So, we're all up in arms why? Because Iggy had a hat trick and no one has done that in 22 years? Really?
I don't think this is the whole story, though. Most people are outraged that the team's leading goal scorer, the top-scoring Canadian in Olympic tournament play, and the team's ONLY Olympic gold-medal winning forward has been placed on the fourth line prematurely. People are upset because Iginla seems to have been singled out for a problem that is not his alone.
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Old 02-21-2010, 01:05 PM   #97
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Why does Nash need to play the right side? He's played LW basically his whole career and he won his Richard trophy playing the LW.
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Old 02-21-2010, 01:06 PM   #98
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...Nash and Crosby can continue to try and impress the crowd with their showboating and backhand passes while not putting the puck in the net though.

As for Nash bringing more to the table, I am not sure what that is exactly, his career high in assists is 39. Not exactly impressive. He has just as many points as Iginla this year, and Iginla has struggled for the majority of the season. I really don't get all the Rick Nash hype, and what makes him a lock for Canada's first line.

Nash may be better at certain aspects of the game than Iginla, but I wouldn't say either of those things are putting the puck in the net, or helping other people put the puck in the net.
Nash is fast. That is the only thing I can think of, but for my money, the "chemistry" argument does not apply. Iginla has looked at least as comfortable with Crosby as Nash in my opinion.
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Old 02-21-2010, 01:06 PM   #99
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I thought right wing was Nash's usual spot. ?? Maybe I'm wrong.
Never mind....
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Old 02-21-2010, 01:10 PM   #100
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Exactly! They named him an alternate captain for a reason...
Thanfully Iginla has more class when compared to Babcock.
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