What would you recommend for this guy?

[KevanGuy]

Originally posted by Frank the Tank@Jul 6 2005, 02:08 PM
I think skinning him alive is a suitable punishment. How long could you live without skin? Lets find out!

Weird, thats what I was thinking too. Cut squares of flesh off him and let infection set in.

[Mike F]

If anyone wants a peek into this guys mind, here's the blog which he was keeping for a while.

Some weird stuff there.

"To be more specific, I am scared, alone, and confused, and my reaction is to strike out toward the perceived source of my misery, society. My intent is to harm society as much as I can, then die"

[KevanGuy]

Wow, thanks for posting that Mike. Incredibly interesting to read how the tone of his entries changed over the past year and a half.


"I've decided to start this blog as a sort of check and balance of where I am. This is for my own safety. I figure it is just a matter of time before I am falsely accused of some crime or another."

He goes from that to this...

"As far as letting God take care of the Demons, too late. They've locked up the "Happy Joe" person in the same dungeon that "Happy Joe" kept them in for so many years. Now they are loose and I am very afraid. From now on I may refer to "Happy Joe" as "Jet" (me) and the demons as "The Bogeyman."

[KevanGuy]

What a crazy son of a bitch. This is his entry a month before he went on his spree....

"So, I've been accused of molesting a little boy. Those close to me know I didn't do it of course, how could I, I'm not even a pedophile. Well, I'm not a psychopath either, I feel the full force and pain of everyone I have ever hurt, but that doesn't stop me from doing what I need to do. Ultimately my feelings don't matter, I learned that in prison. I have to carry out my orders or a lot worse than just me dying could happen."


It's sickening to think of how many other people are in this world who think (and potentially act) like Joseph Duncan.


Absolutely chilling...

"these demons are stronger than even I gave them credit for, and now they are taking my best blows and not even staggering. I’m afraid, very afraid. If they win then a lot of people will be badly hurt, and they’ve had their way before, so I know what they can do."

[Flames_Gimp]

tortured, castorated (genitals fed to a dog) and THEN death penalty!

[transplant99]

Haven't read the article.

But yes, that's what I'm suggesting.

Odd. Didnt read it, but suggests he should be spared.....for some reason or other..

As far as I'm concerned, the system has failed in allowing this guy to be on the streets. Period. Evil people belong in prison. That's what they're for.

Blame the sytem? OK.

How about criminals belong in prison...eveil MF's like this guy deserve to die? Why must it be one or the other? This crime and this guys actions are so far beyond the realm of your "average murder/rape", why should he be treated as such?

Don't people think it's a little odd for the US to be grouped with China, Congo, and Iran in making up 86% of the world's executions?

Dont you think its "odd" that you are lumping in American criminal executions in the same group as folks who get executed for speaking against their government?

Holy apples and oranges Batman, and a spin attempt worthy of a Liberal contract.

Well done.

Do these country's have it right, and all the others wrong? Those seem to me to be _very_ strange bedfellows indeed

If all executions were for the same crimes under the same circumstanes...you would be right.

But...your not.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by transplant99@Jul 6 2005, 09:41 PM

Dont you think its "odd" that you are lumping in American criminal executions in the same group as folks who get executed for speaking against their government?

I know I know, this wasn't directed at me but I just feel like I have to say that I think it's "odd" that you know the circumstances of all those executions in China, Iran and the Congo. Do people get executed int those places for anything other than speaking out against the government? I'm pretty sure they do, so it's strange bedfellows indeed.

The OT board is so often dedicated to government incompetence/ignorance/corruption/scandal/lies/deception/stupidity but most of us seem quite willing to let the incompetent/ignorant/corrupt/scandalous/lying/deceptive/stupid government have the right to kill a citizen. Seems odd to me.

[Cheese]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos+Jul 7 2005, 12:00 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (RougeUnderoos @ Jul 7 2005, 12:00 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-transplant99@Jul 6 2005, 09:41 PM

Dont you think its "odd" that you are lumping in American criminal executions in the same group as folks who get executed for speaking against their government?

I know I know, this wasn't directed at me but I just feel like I have to say that I think it's "odd" that you know the circumstances of all those executions in China, Iran and the Congo. Do people get executed int those places for anything other than speaking out against the government? I'm pretty sure they do, so it's strange bedfellows indeed.

The OT board is so often dedicated to government incompetence/ignorance/corruption/scandal/lies/deception/stupidity but most of us seem quite willing to let the incompetent/ignorant/corrupt/scandalous/lying/deceptive/stupid government have the right to kill a citizen. Seems odd to me. [/b][/quote]
well....thats a connundrum Mr Underpants.

In our ever lasting search for perfection we continually fall short. What does that really have to do with ridding the planet of idiots like this? Seriously? Where is the line in the sand drawn? Its quite apparent that this guy is looney tunes and IF he ever got out again he would damage the lives of other families...not to mention the problems he has already created.
Special cases deserve special consideration...I think this is one of them thar thangs.

[transplant99]

The OT board is so often dedicated to government incompetence/ignorance/corruption/scandal/lies/deception/stupidity but most of us seem quite willing to let the incompetent/ignorant/corrupt/scandalous/lying/deceptive/stupid government have the right to kill a citizen. Seems odd to me.

But the government isnt who decides who gets executed or not. The prosecution can bring a death sentence charge against someone, but its the jury who decides. A group of fellow citizens who usually run the gamut of social/political/gender/and age considerations.

Whats that got to do with incompetant, ignorant, corrupted, scandalous, lying, deceptive, stupid, elected representatives.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by transplant99@Jul 7 2005, 07:17 AM

But the government isnt who decides who gets executed or not. The prosecution can bring a death sentence charge against someone, but its the jury who decides. A group of fellow citizens who usually run the gamut of social/political/gender/and age considerations.

Whats that got to do with incompetant, ignorant, corrupted, scandalous, lying, deceptive, stupid, elected representatives.

The police, the prosecutors and the judge are all employees of the government so it's still the government putting the guy on trial and it'll be the government that makes up the applicable laws.

I don't care about this guy and I'm not defending him or wishing him a pleasant tomorrow, I just don't trust the government or even a jury to sentence someone to die. They make mistakes all the time. We know they make mistakes.

It doesn't make sense to me either. "You killed someone and thats the worst thing you can do so we are going to kill you for it"?

It's also just plain old revenge. I'm no lawyer or philosopher, but I'm quite sure that revenge isn't the guiding principle of our legal system.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

The issue you should be looking at with execution rates isn't only why the individuals were executed in the other nations, but in the case of countries such as the Congo and China, whether those rates are anywhere close to being accurate. Lets face it China is not a human rights friendly country to say the least and it wouldn't be shocking at all to find out that the rates reported are much lower than the actual execution rates.

[transplant99]

The police, the prosecutors and the judge are all employees of the government so it's still the government putting the guy on trial and it'll be the government that makes up the applicable laws.

Ok...and?

I just don't trust the government or even a jury to sentence someone to die. They make mistakes all the time. We know they make mistakes.

Who do you trust then?

Of course mistakes are made...i never said any different. In fact i will say its a million times worse that an innocent man go to jail than a guilty man go free.

To apply that "no death sentence ever be applied because mistakes are made" would mean that everyone convicted of special circumstances murders, are mistakes. It doesnt have to be one way or the other....there are cases when a death sentence is almost too lenient.

It's also just plain old revenge. I'm no lawyer or philosopher, but I'm quite sure that revenge isn't the guiding principle of our legal system.

Revenge? How so? If it was the surviving family members bringing the death sentance down, then I could agree.

This guy looks to have murdered 4 family members, raping two of them (both children) kidnapping two kids and keeping them his playtoys for weeks.

All this AFTER being convicted once for molesting a child at gunpoint, and facing yet another molestation charge before this latest act.

Sorry man...this is one guy that should never be able to share the same air as you and I if he is convicted on these charges.

Whats the point of keeping him in jail until the day he dies? Other than allowing him to stay alive, when he clearly didnt give the same consideration to others. He will cost taxpayers over $100,000 a year if kept in solitary, where this kind of offender does go. He is 42 years old...so say he lives to 75. Thats 3.2 million bucks he takes out of other government agencies...maybe even ones that help good honest hardworking people.

I have all kinds of reasons why he should die...anyone come up with one why shouldnt? (Assuming of course he is tried and convicted on these charges)

[Agamemnon]

I'm surprised there's much point debating this. Arguing whether or not the death penalty is morally appropriate or not is up to each individual, and is a hugely contentious issue that won't be solved by a CalPuck thread (as proven by our multiple previous death penalty threads). I think anyone who takes a human life is wrong (exception necessary self defense). Other's think that snuffing out bad guys is a good thing.

To each their own. I'm just glad we live in a place that doesn't endorse state-sanctioned killings (that I know of).

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by transplant99@Jul 7 2005, 11:35 AM

Ok...and?

Who do you trust then?

Of course mistakes are made...i never said any different. In fact i will say its a million times worse that an innocent man go to jail than a guilty man go free.

To apply that "no death sentence ever be applied because mistakes are made" would mean that everyone convicted of special circumstances murders, are mistakes. It doesnt have to be one way or the other....there are cases when a death sentence is almost too lenient.

Revenge? How so? If it was the surviving family members bringing the death sentance down, then I could agree.

This guy looks to have murdered 4 family members, raping two of them (both children) kidnapping two kids and keeping them his playtoys for weeks.

All this AFTER being convicted once for molesting a child at gunpoint, and facing yet another molestation charge before this latest act.

Sorry man...this is one guy that should never be able to share the same air as you and I if he is convicted on these charges.

Whats the point of keeping him in jail until the day he dies? Other than allowing him to stay alive, when he clearly didnt give the same consideration to others. He will cost taxpayers over $100,000 a year if kept in solitary, where this kind of offender does go. He is 42 years old...so say he lives to 75. Thats 3.2 million bucks he takes out of other government agencies...maybe even ones that help good honest hardworking people.

I have all kinds of reasons why he should die...anyone come up with one why shouldnt? (Assuming of course he is tried and convicted on these charges)

Ok...and?

You said it wouldn't be the government but a jury of his peers sentencing him to death. I was simply pointing out that it wasn't the case.

To apply that "no death sentence ever be applied because mistakes are made" would mean that everyone convicted of special circumstances murders, are mistakes.

What do you mean by special circumstances? I don't follow the rest of it.

I can't make a case for the guy to live other than he's a human person and regardless of what he's done, murdering him isn't something the state should be involved in.

It'll cost more to execute him than it would to keep him in a cell for 30 years. Of course we could always do away with pesky appeals and lawyers and even a trial I suppose and then it would be quite cheap.

[Agamemnon]

Interesting stats here about the failings of the death penalty in the United States from the Death Penalty Information Centre.

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/FactSheet.pdf

[transplant99]

You said it wouldn't be the government but a jury of his peers sentencing him to death. I was simply pointing out that it wasn't the case.

What?

The jury IS who decides sentence in capital punishment cases.

No idea what you are getting at.

What do you mean by special circumstances? I don't follow the rest of it.

There are provisions in the majority of states with the death penalty, that allow prosecution to attach special circumstances as part of the charge. These generally are in such cases as the one we are talking about here. Multiple felonies all attached to one incident. Also for repeat offenders.

I can't make a case for the guy to live other than he's a human person and regardless of what he's done, murdering him isn't something the state should be involved in.

Your opinion. Thats cool.

It'll cost more to execute him than it would to keep him in a cell for 30 years.

Gonna have to prove that one...no idea how you are coming up with that.

Of course we could always do away with pesky appeals and lawyers and even a trial I suppose and then it would be quite cheap

Yeah thats what is being suggested. Weak.

[jam26]

Originally posted by notoepik@Jul 6 2005, 05:33 PM
If the remains that were found do turn out to be the boy, he was killed in Montana. Tried and convicted here, he could be hanged. That is clearly too good for this monster.

You still hang people there??

[transplant99]

Interesting facts here on how the death penalty is a deterrent.

http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/DP.html

This was interesting...

Imposition of the death penalty is extraordinarily rare. Since 1967, there has been one execution for every 1600 murders, or 0.06%. There have been approximately 560,000 murders and 358 executions from 1967-1996 FBI's Uniform Crime Report (UCR) & Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS).

[Frank the Tank]

Originally posted by transplant99@Jul 7 2005, 01:40 PM
Interesting facts here on how the death penalty is a deterrent.

http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/DP.html

This was interesting...

Imposition of the death penalty is extraordinarily rare. Since 1967, there has been one execution for every 1600 murders, or 0.06%. There have been approximately 560,000 murders and 358 executions from 1967-1996 FBI's Uniform Crime Report (UCR) & Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS).

But Tranny, the death penalty is wrong...I mean its an eye for an eye and thats revenge and your stats clearly show that...oh wait a second...........

Murderers, rapists, pedophiles....burn 'em all.

[transplant99]

And this one is interesting as well...

Obviously, those executed can’t murder again. "Of the roughly 52,000 state prison inmates serving time for murder in 1984, an estimated 810 had previously been convicted of murder and had killed 821 persons following their previous murder convictions. Executing each of these inmates would have saved 821 lives." (41, 1 Stanford Law Review, 11/88, pg. 153) Using a 75% murder clearance rate, it is most probable that the actual number of lives saved would have been 1026, or fifty times the number legally executed that year. This suggests that some 10,000 persons have been murdered, since 1971, by those who had previously committed additional murders (JFA). See B.5.

Yeah, no reason to sentence these guys to death...i mean whats 10,000 more dead?

Again, Im not a pro-death penalty guy per se. When its a repeat offender or a multiple murder case tho? One has to look at it pretty closely. It is an appropriate punishment for not only what was done, but what will happen in the future should these convicted get released.