I Baptize Dead People

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

No, you didn't say it was all false, but Rathji said as much.

The part about the hat is that he looked into a hat with the rocks in the hat as he was translating the gold tablets while another guy wrote down what he was saying. I don't know if it's true or not.

What I said was basicly you need to understand the source and realize that the information will all be biased to the point that it cannot be considered an acurate source. I said it was akin to asking Palin about Obama being the best President, clearly not the best person to be asking if you want a factual answer.

I did not mean to imply that all the information there was false. What I meant to say, and probably should have, was that you could find out alot more factual information from going directly to the source.

There is no secret how Joseph Smith translated the Book of Mormon, it is written in pretty much every copy and in the Joseph Smith History. I am sure there are links to it online, but I am dealing with sick baby so hopefully if you are interested you could search 'Joseph Smith History' on http://www.lds.org and you would come up with many relevant links.

Edit: Direct Link to Jospeh Smith History

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Hat? Not sure, I suppose the story could have him wearing one...that wouldn't be odd.

But yeah, the origin was gold tablets and stones that translated them.

I didn't say it was all false.

So which parts would you suggest "might be"? If you believe some of it how do you choose which parts to believe? Sounds like Bible translation doesnt it?

[onetwo_threefour]

For those who defend this practice, wouldn't you be offended by the idea that your core beliefs could be so callously disregarded after your death? I'm an atheist.and live by that creed. I do not want some morbid missionary reciting superstitious drivel over my bones at some distant point in the future. It is disrespectful to the beliefs of the dead.

[driveway]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Some of the stuff you guys are saying is simply not true.

Which statements about Mormon doctrine that have been posted in this thread are not true, specifically?

It's hard to track down 'credible' sources without being certain which statements you're disagreeing with.

Also:

I'm an atheist.and live by that creed. I do not want some morbid missionary reciting superstitious drivel over my bones at some distant point in the future. It is disrespectful to the beliefs of the dead.

Then you're not a very devout atheist. What do you care if someone reads some drivel over your bones (nothing but a collection of calcium and other minerals) at some point in the future? Since there is no god and no afterlife there is no way it can impact you at all.

[ok, ok,....I get it]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

1. Mormons were hardly the first of last religion to practice polygamy and they abandoned it over a hundred years ago.

2. The whole issue with blacks? You'll have to explain that one. Have other religions always been 100% inclusive?

3. Have you? Utah is not dry. You KNOW this right? SLC is one of the wildest partying towns I have ever been in too.

1. So it's acceptable to say "they do it so can we".....
2. The issue has been touched on by other members...
3. Yes, St George....(the post said "small") and Zima is not a substitute for real BEER.......there was no hard booze at the bar.

Most of my understanding is from Mormons, like the guy I worked with that was more than happy to tell me about his special undies.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by ok, ok,....I get it

Most of my understanding is from Mormons, like the guy I worked with that was more than happy to tell me about his special undies.

It might not have been Mormonism he was interested in turning you onto...

[ok, ok,....I get it]

Originally Posted by jammies

It might not have been Mormonism he was interested in turning you onto...

nice....very nice......which was what I said the about the undies

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by driveway

Which statements about Mormon doctrine that have been posted in this thread are not true, specifically?

It's hard to track down 'credible' sources without being certain which statements you're disagreeing with.

The only online source you can be pretty much sure is credible is www.lds.org

There are many other sources, including the Book of Mormon and Missionaries.

As for responding to your specific claims, I will take some more time later when I am not trying to decide which end of me needs to be hanging over the toilet due to the flu. This post took well over an hour to type.

[flip]

I think I have a solution to this debate.

Mormons are pretty wacky but we can all agree that Scientologists are bat s**t crazy like no other "religion".

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by Rathji

The only online source you can be pretty much sure is credible is www.lds.org

There are many other sources, including the Book of Mormon and Missionaries.

As for responding to your specific claims, I will take some more time later when I am not trying to decide which end of me needs to be hanging over the toilet due to the flu. This post took well over an hour to type.

LOL...so the ONLY facts are the facts that the LDS themselves provide?

Facts

More Facts

and yet MORE Facts

Of course the LDS will deny any and all of this as they would never lie about anything.

[Burninator]

Originally Posted by Rathji

The only online source you can be pretty much sure is credible is www.lds.org

There are many other sources, including the Book of Mormon and Missionaries.

Ha! Maybe if you're a Mormon it is. Clearly the church is a very bias source of information about itself.

[flip]

Originally Posted by Cheese

LOL...so the ONLY facts are the facts that the LDS themselves provide?

Facts

More Facts

and yet MORE Facts

Of course the LDS will deny any and all of this as they would never lie about anything.

Please. SOME of that is true but those links are just as biased as the official Mormons are. Most of the crap on those sites is no different than someone making a site about Christians that says all Christians think non-believers are going to hell. It may be true to SOME fundamentalists but I'd bet 90% of Christians don't believe that all of us non believers are going to burn in hell for eternity.

Your arguments lost a lot of weight when they are just as uninformed and biased as the ones you are trying to disprove.

And strangely enough I'm on your side. I think Joseph Smith was a quack and a shyster, Mormons have basically all been brainwashed into believing a whole bunch of crap that isn't true. They do have some strange dogma and such but that certainly doesn't extend to all members of Mormonism nor does it mean that they aren't good, hardworking Canadians and Americans.

Most Mormons I know are a benefit to their community not a burden. One of the few religions that I can truly say that about. Sure they may have some archaic practises, especially among the "hardcores" but last I checked they aren't pulling Jihads, forming terrorist groups or flying planes into buildings. Instead they are...going door to door spreading faith... OOOHHH the evil Mormons are out to get us.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by flip

Please. SOME of that is true but those links are just as biased as the official Mormons are. Most of the crap on those sites is no different than someone making a site about Christians that says all Christians think non-believers are going to hell. It may be true to SOME fundamentalists but I'd bet 90% of Christians don't believe that all of us non believers are going to burn in hell for eternity.

Your arguments lost a lot of weight when they are just as uninformed and biased as the ones you are trying to disprove.

Again...which links and what information? There is all kinds of info out there so I would like to ensure I get the right stuff just for you.
I dont think anyone has said that besides their dumbfark religion that some people arent decent hard workin folk have they?
That has NUTHIN to do with Mormonism.

[ok, ok,....I get it]

Originally Posted by flip

Please. SOME of that is true but those links are just as biased as the official Mormons are. Most of the crap on those sites is no different than someone making a site about Christians that says all Christians think non-believers are going to hell. It may be true to SOME fundamentalists but I'd bet 90% of Christians don't believe that all of us non believers are going to burn in hell for eternity.

Your arguments lost a lot of weight when they are just as uninformed and biased as the ones you are trying to disprove.

You sure.........this is the problem I have with religion, most claim to this that or the other thing.....but when push comes to shove they don't follow through, like the guy with the jesus fish on his car that gave me the finger........

[flip]

Originally Posted by Cheese

Again...which links and what information? There is all kinds of info out there so I would like to ensure I get the right stuff just for you.

Wow. Stop being so incredibly and intentionally obtuse. If you are as informed as you claim to be you should be smart enough to know that there is a lot of crap out there.

I love the condescending attitude whenever someone questions the "facts" that you've presented then you link to random INTERNET sites. The biggest haven for idiots to post any sort of garbage and present it as truth.

I don't pretend to be an expert on Mormon facts and myths, but neither are you, and neither are those sites.

Originally Posted by ok, ok,....I get it

You sure.........this is the problem I have with religion, most claim to this that or the other thing.....but when push comes to shove they don't follow through, like the guy with the jesus fish on his car that gave me the finger........

Hey I'm not trying to say all Christians are perfect. Like I said I'm on your side, I think most religious people are out to lunch with the stuff they believe and practice. But lets not just turn into the exact same judgmental, stereotyping bunch of jerks that we are trying to bash here.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by flip

Wow. Stop being so incredibly and intentionally obtuse. If you are as informed as you claim to be you should be smart enough to know that there is a lot of crap out there.

I love the condescending attitude whenever someone questions the "facts" that you've presented then you link to random INTERNET sites. The biggest haven for idiots to post any sort of garbage and present it as truth.

I don't pretend to be an expert on Mormon facts and myths, but neither are you, and neither are those sites.

I know more than you...and if youd rather I go off the top of my head I can...obtuse or not.
Its simply easier to send you to sites created by many different folks...Christians, Atheists and other. I left it up to you to either read them or bash me.

[flip]

Originally Posted by Cheese

I know more than you...and if youd rather I go off the top of my head I can...obtuse or not.
Its simply easier to send you to sites created by many different folks...Christians, Atheists and other. I left it up to you to either read them or bash me.

WOW. . Nuff said.

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

I don't see how Mormons baptising dead folks could be a a danger to Jews or any other Religion. It is unlikely that the Mormon records would survive while all others were destroyed. Also, you would think that seeing a baptism date that was sixty some years after the date of the persons death would give any historian pause.

I think the Jewish lobby should be careful not to use the anti-Semitic card too quickly on none issues. It weakens their voice against the real threats Jews face.

I can't believe this is tough for some people to understand. If you can convert someone once they are murdered, then why bother trying to deal with them alive? Simply torch the village then convert them all to your religion.
As for this 'Jewish Lobby', what are you reffering to? You might have read a few too many pages out of some flier you got in a parking lot (from a guy with red shoelaces). They should be careful not to play that card too quickly? Just when is too quickly? It weakens their voice against the real threats they face? How does this all add up in your head?
You know, I have no doubts that you are concerned about the jewish conspiracy. It all makes sense.

[arloiginla]

Originally Posted by ok, ok,....I get it

You sure.........this is the problem I have with religion, most claim to this that or the other thing.....but when push comes to shove they don't follow through, like the guy with the jesus fish on his car that gave me the finger........

Sad that some have to ruin it for the rest of us.

Maybe he just had the fish put on so that cops would never suspect that he stole the car.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Cheese

So which parts would you suggest "might be"? If you believe some of it how do you choose which parts to believe? Sounds like Bible translation doesnt it?

Whoa.....believe?

I never said I believe anything. All I said is that not everything that is said about Mormonism is true. Big difference.