Alberta as a Country

[MarchHare]

colour (color if Quebec would leave).

Huh? Don't we spell the word with a 'u' because it's the proper British spelling? I'm pretty sure it has nothing to do with Quebec/French.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Slava

I guess when times are good here some people want to separate, but when times were tough here we were all happy to be along for the ride?

No way that this ever gets more than 20% serious support in my lifetime...and I'm happy to say that!

Not really, no. Support for western separation reached its highest point during the NEP, which was hardly times being good.

[Barnes]

Originally Posted by moon

Thankful I have not been to all the Maritimes, but I have been to Ontario, Quebec and Nova Scotia and feel that I have spent plenty of time there to make a judgement.

And I wouldn't be kicking them out of Canada, I would imagine they would keep that name. I just wouldn't be keeping them in the wonderful land of New Alberta (and parts of BC and why not the North since I have nothing against them.)

I have something against Lethbridge and I have spent plenty of time there. It smells like the south end of a north bound cow so you don't get to join New Alberta.

[Berger_4_]

Originally Posted by troutman

WTF?

Again with the racist remarks! Cool it or I'll have to take you to court! (Who was that on the board...I remember reading the thread but can't for the life of me remember who it was)

Separation, while looking good in the short term, would be the dumbest thing you could possibly do long term. Why would you want to separate from what really is the greatest country on earth? Sure we bitch about the East (damn liberals) and BC (friggin hippies) but really that's what makes Canada so great. So no to separation. However, I would be in support of a retooling of the voting system. There's far to much power in the East I think.

And foo...good example man. I couldn't decide whether I was a Canadian or Albertan first until you came up with the military thing. Proud to say I'm a Canadian.

[MarchHare]

However, I would be in support of a retooling of the voting system. There's far to much power in the East I think.

You are aware that Alberta has more MPs per capita than Ontario, right?

[Barnes]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Huh? Don't we spell the word with a 'u' because it's the proper British spelling? I'm pretty sure it has nothing to do with Quebec/French.

We do but, the British spellings come from French influences from long ago.

[moon]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Ok, you've got to just be purposely trolling at this point.

You dislike the Martimes because you think they're leeches who don't contribute enough to the rest of Canada, but you like the North, the biggest leeches of all?

Their leeching doesn't bother me that much. It is their woe is me attitude and stupid left wing, Liberal Party supporting attitudes that I don't like.

Plus the North is like a cute little brother that you can't help but love no matter how many times they come back to you asking for another loan.


How could I get rid of them?

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by Barnes

We do but, the British spellings come from French influences from long ago.

True enough, but even if Canada was a monolingual, English-only country, we'd still spell colour with a 'u'. Quebec isn't the reason that we didn't adopt Americanized spelling.

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I'd prefer if we no longer had to listen to self-absorbed Albertans who think they're better than everyone else.

It's impolite to move in with a neighbour and then insult them.

[Cowboy89]

I think efforts for our cause would better be served at lobbying for Federal observance of Constitutionally enshrined Provincial powers that the feds have horned in on. Another issue is the Rep by pop issue, We get the absolute shaft when it comes to senators compared to our population. Also our federal ridings are horrifically Gerrymandered historically populationwise to give Atlantic Canada, the territories, and Quebec many more MPs than their population would dictate.

Fixing these issues would go a long way towards keeping Albertans more than happy within confederation and I don't see any reason to seperate at that point.

[JoseCuervo]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

You are aware that Alberta has more MPs per capita than Ontario, right?

Wrong... close bu not quitehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_House_of_Commons

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by Ford Prefect

It's impolite to move in with a neighbour and then insult them.

I'm not insulting all Albertans -- far from it. Just the small minority who think most other regions of Canada are inferior and Alberta would be better off without them.

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I'm not insulting all Albertans -- far from it. Just the small minority who think most other regions of Canada are inferior and Alberta would be better off without them.

I guess I misread your statement. In the context is was written it read like you were generalizing all Albertans as being that way ... "self-absorbed Albertans" means all of us.

[Gozer]

Originally Posted by fotze

colour (color if Quebec would leave).

I hope that was intended to be in green.

[Thunderball]

Realistically, Alberta would not be equipped to go it alone long term.

Alberta would either have to hitch its horse with the US, or convince at least BC and Saskatchewan to come along.

I think actually honoring the constitution and allowing for more provincial autonomy within the Canadian brand would solve all but the most crackpot complaints.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by JoseCuervo

Wrong... close bu not quitehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_House_of_Commons

That's only the case because the electoral map has not been redrawn over the last few years when Alberta was going through a population boom. The next time MPs are allocated, Alberta will likely receive one or two more to account for our rising population, restoring what has historically been the norm: Ontario having fewer MPs/person than other provinces, Alberta included.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by Ford Prefect

I guess I misread your statement. In the context is was written it read like you were generalizing all Albertans as being that way ... "self-absorbed Albertans" means all of us.

I can understand how you misread it, but I felt the intent of my original statment was clear; "self-absorbed Albertans who think they're better than everyone else" does not imply all Albertans, only those few that fit that description.

[brownie]

Maybe some Albertans have a bad attitude towards the Maritimes. Maybe there are some Maritimers who live in Alberta and still complain about it. But most Albertans don't have to move 3/4 of way across the country leaving behind their families. They never had to or probably never will have to. I know lots of guys working out here with there wife and kids still back there. It wouldn't be easy but they do it to provide for there families. I would say the Alberta oilsands wouldn't be where it is today without the people from the East coming out to work.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

No, we don't.

As for "supporting the Martimes", I assume you mean through the federal equalization program. I've ranted about this in the past, but I'll repeat my points here because the myth that Albertans are somehow harmed by equalization is still prevalent.

Equalization exists solely so that the provincial governments in every region can offer comparable levels of service to their citizens regardless of revenue-generating potential. This means that poorer provinces, such as PEI, can (in theory) deliver standards of healthcare and public education that are no worse than the richer provinces such as Alberta and Ontario.

So how does this benefit Alberta? Two ways:

1) If you, as an Albertan, are visiting another province for business or pleasure, and you suffer an accident that requires medical treatment, you can be assured that you'll receive professional healthcare service on par with what you would expect at home. Without equalization, poorer provinces would have third-world healthcare.

2) Hundreds of thousands of Canadians in "have not" provinces complete their education and then move elsewhere in the country. Many of them come to Alberta. Because of equalization, Albertan taxpayers would have foot the bill for a small portion of their education, but Alberta is now reaping the rewards of being able to attract Canadian citizens who speak English as their first language and have received an education comparable to an Alberta-born resident. With our current labour shortage, surely you can see the benefit in that.

To speak from a personal example (and my story is hardly unique), I moved to Alberta from New Brunswick at the age of 22 immediately after I graduated from university. The New Brunswick taxpayers contributed tens of thousands of dollars to provide me with an education, with taxpayers in Ontario and Alberta also covering a smaller portion of that cost through equalization payments. I have never paid income taxes in New Brunswick. On the other hand, since 2002 I've paid thousands of dollars in income taxes to the Alberta government as well as contributed to the Albertan economy though both my labour output and by spending money in this province. Because of equalization, Alberta was able to receive a skilled and educated citizen. Without equalization, this province would not have as large a pool of highly-educated Canadian workers to attract to help with our labour shortage.

My biggest gripe with supporting other provinces has nothing to do with equalization payments.

Its the indirect support to the Ontario economy via federal programs. It seems like virtually every federal program is run out of Ontario. Yes I understand they are our capital and this will happen somewhat, but it seems a little out of control.

The most glaring example is probably the arts, since I am reminded of that everytime I turn on the TV. Having lived in both BC and Ontario, BC is clearly teh centre for arts. Yet every bit of federal funding seems to go to Ontario. They have Chum City and its associates broadcasting a variety of shows made in Ontario. The whole thing is ridiculous.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by brownie

s. I would say the Alberta oilsands wouldn't be where it is today without the people from the East coming out to work.

That's 100% true. It wouldn't be where it is today without the hard work of many Easterners, Westerners, people from all over. I interact with a delightful Jamaican fella at work, it wouldn't be where it is without his hard work.

Just shut up about how much you miss home and how much you hate Alberta. The Oilsands wouldn't be where they are without their hardwork, but that house, toys, and food in the fridge wouldn't be there either without Alberta.