2023/2024 Trade Rumors and Speculation Thread

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Toast_Man

Wow, Seravalli on Barnburner today says Fitz and Connie had a deal but 'upper management' killed it over salary retention. He specifically mentions Maloney.

If true that is interesting, it would explain Markstrom's comments and potentially they are not directed at Conroy. That also explains why Markstrom and the team still came out solid against the Pens and not distracted. We can't assume anything as truth so there's that, but it is an interesting comment.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by getbak

I believe Flamesnation and Daily Faceoff are owned by the same parent company, so they probably don't have a choice.

That's correct.

The thing I can't figure out is why the Fan have him on weekly on two different shows.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Interesting if it was directed at those above Connie, but not Connie.

When jersey came back saying they would trade without retention, wouldn't it have got done then?

Or is it stalled again because terms were changed (jersey wanting to keep their 24 1st)?

The winning streak shouldn't hold this process up, as difficult as it would be to gut the team like that while on a heater, that's happening already with hanifin later this week.

[Jiggy]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

It's fine to put your foot down, but the 1st for Monahan is obviously a league-wide high water mark unlikely to be repeated.

That does jive with the earlier rumors of disagreement of retention. NJ might be using a league wide average for retention not including Monahan trade, where flames want similar value to what they paid. IF this is the case, it's sunk cost fallacy related. Need to get over the fact that our horrible former GM made one of the stupidest moves ever in league history.

I am confident that if this is still the major stumbling point it can be overcome.

Marleau with a 6.2 million dollar cap hit was traded with a first round pick to the Hurricanes before the Monahan deal. So a first round pick is the bar if someone is taking on 6 millionish.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by getbak

It's John Bean's fault?

Someone in upper management.., maybe it just wasn't approved!?

[Sec214]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

Interesting if it was directed at those above Connie, but not Connie.

When jersey came back saying they would trade without retention, wouldn't it have got done then?

Or is it stalled again because terms were changed (jersey wanting to keep their 24 1st)?

I've been told its a garbage offer of no premium assets, just offering you a Dion deal. Quantity over quality.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

I like hearing that the Hanifin offers are solid. Thank ####.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by Sec214

No Flames wanted an additional asset for the retention being 2.5 years... Someone paid a first to get rid of 6M Sean Monahan for 1 year....

It makes total sense because two full seasons of paying part of a useful players salary should be worth a lot.

To a casual fan it's not their money, they want a trade. But if you're paying like 4 million of your future budget to help a competitor be better, God damed right you should get a lot for it. It's not like both parties expect Markstrom to turn into Jack Campbell next week. They expect him to keep playing at a high level.

Seems like a lot here think this will happen. Hence the panic to trade Markstrom today.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

Interesting if it was directed at those above Connie, but not Connie.

When jersey came back saying they would trade without retention, wouldn't it have got done then?

Or is it stalled again because terms were changed (jersey wanting to keep their 24 1st)?

The winning streak shouldn't hold this process up, as difficult as it would be to gut the team like that while on a heater, that's happening already with hanifin later this week.

Maybe retention was just as an excuse. Look at New Jersey's offer now and they're still not doing anything.

Nm sec explained it.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

If people in the know are drawing comparisons to the Dion trade then just say no thanks.

At that point it's Mercer or bust if I'm Conroy.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

I'd say Mercer + 2nd + Vanecek for cap purposes, take it or leave it. Maybe we'll talk with you in the summer, maybe not. Deadline is Wednesday.

[Strange Brew]

I don't really love the idea of trading Mangiapane so that Pelletier or Coronato can play with Backlund and Coleman.

By the time this team contends again, Backlund and Coleman will be gone or at least not the players they are today. I get that they would be valuable mentors for a young player but how about Mangiapane becomes that guy?

[ComixZone]

It strikes me as extremely plausible that Don Maloney (acting on behalf of management) nixed the trade due to the cost for retention not meeting their criteria (even if Conroy thought it was good), and it also seems likely that one of the reasons they walked away from it was that they believed they could make the playoffs with Marky in place.

They tried like hell to retain Lindholm, Hanifin, and Tanev. This is not a well managed organization above the GM level. We know this owner meddles. We had Treliving walk away from a contract extension and then the organization try to save face by saying they both mutually agreed to part ways.

We know this problem exists with this team.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

It makes total sense because two full seasons of paying part of a useful players salary should be worth a lot.

To a casual fan it's not their money, they want a trade. But if you're paying like 4 million of your future budget to help a competitor be better, God damed right you should get a lot for it. It's not like both parties expect Markstrom to turn into Jack Campbell next week. They expect him to keep playing at a high level.

Seems like a lot here think this will happen. Hence the panic to trade Markstrom today.

IMO only, I don't think it happens, but if it does it will be when the next pressure point arrives and that is likely within 6 hours or so of the deadline (when the contenders and those within distance see/hear rumors of direct opponents getting stronger) and reactions start occurring.

So much pressure on some of the war rooms at that point. Would be an absolute blast to experience.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by Jiggy

Marleau with a 6.2 million dollar cap hit was traded with a first round pick to the Hurricanes before the Monahan deal. So a first round pick is the bar if someone is taking on 6 millionish.

Purely dead cap vs potentially useful and contributing player. They're not equivalent, proven by Montreal's ability to turn around and extract value out of Monahan a year later.

Markstrom is more similar to Monahan here, which is why we are asking for a lot. But IMO NJ don't see it the same way as they won't look to trade Markstrom just ride him out.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

It's fine to put your foot down, but the 1st for Monahan is obviously a league-wide high water mark unlikely to be repeated.

That does jive with the earlier rumors of disagreement of retention. NJ might be using a league wide average for retention not including Monahan trade, where flames want similar value to what they paid. IF this is the case, it's sunk cost fallacy related. Need to get over the fact that our horrible former GM made one of the stupidest moves ever in league history.

I am confident that if this is still the major stumbling point it can be overcome.

6.5 million cap hit for 1 year is big.

No one is just going to take a cap dump that large in a flat cap, rebuilding or not.

Yeah it sucks now, but at the time Monny was coming back from a 2nd hip surgery with limited mobility already.

[2ArmBands]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

It strikes me as extremely plausible that Don Maloney (acting on behalf of management) nixed the trade due to the cost for retention not meeting their criteria (even if Conroy thought it was good), and it also seems likely that one of the reasons they walked away from it was that they believed they could make the playoffs with Marky in place.

They tried like hell to retain Lindholm, Hanifin, and Tanev. This is not a well managed organization above the GM level. We know this owner meddles. We had Treliving walk away from a contract extension and then the organization try to save face by saying they both mutually agreed to part ways.

We know this problem exists with this team.

If the ownership group is still out there doing whatever it takes for a couple playoff games then I think they should be facing all the criticism. Getting sick of hearing how much they are involved in the hockey op decisions and spoiling multiple deals both externally and internally. Even hearing the stories of him calling Gaudreau personally and giving him an earful (not sure if fact or speculation?)

Either way getting tired of hearing just how involved these guys are at the most pivotal points.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Does anyone actually believe they think they have a shot at the playoffs after trading away Lindholm, Zadorov, Tanev and now Hanifin up next.

We literally will have gutted our defence and filled it out with AHL players and waiver pickups. Not to mention someone returning to hockey after 1.5 years away.

They even worked out a deal to trade Markstrom, do you actually think they would have entertained that trade if the playoffs are the goal?

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

6.5 million cap hit for 1 year is big.

No one is just going to take a cap dump that large in a flat cap, rebuilding or not.

Yeah it sucks now, but at the time Monny was coming back from a 2nd hip surgery with limited mobility already.

Also allowed Kadri to come here. He's the teams best forward this season outside of Coleman.

Guy is full marks right now and even a recovered Monahan the way he's playing now would be a step behind Kadri.

(And Monahan is my favorite former Flame, but this is easy to admit)

[traptor]

I get the vibe that there's alot of "managing up" that Conroy is having to do.