Poker site caught cheating

[ericschand]

http://www.poker-king.com/poker-king...hp?article=282

Looks like Absolute Poker has been caught cheating.

Nasty nasty case.

I've always wondered what would stop some employee of a
poker site from doing that. You need beer money for the weekend,
start up a $50 tourney, and win $250!

ers

[Rathji]

Wow, thats some pretty damning evidence

[CrusaderPi]

Originally Posted by Rathji

Wow, thats some pretty damning evidence

X2

Very interesting read.

[metallicat]

My dad is fairly big into this online poker, and I asked him if he figured bots were playing in the tournaments he enters. He thinks they probably do. I wonder to what extend, cheating happens. How many actual human players play, as opposed to bots or supercomputers or whatever.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by CrusaderPi

X2

Very interesting read.

x3.

And they're done.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Have seen a few things recently that have me suspicious of a site I use. Although, it's basically free so I guess I can't complain since I've taken about $900 off of it in the last 10 months or so for an investement of about $150.

[arsenal]

Interesting. I think AP is could be done in the next few months. I am sure they have enough of a bank roll so they can last for a little bit. But they will need to come back better than ever in order to get anyone to trust them ever again.
There could be some huge bonus's coming for users..

[Locke]

Originally Posted by arsenal

Interesting. I think AP is could be done in the next few months. I am sure they have enough of a bank roll so they can last for a little bit. But they will need to come back better than ever in order to get anyone to trust them ever again.
There could be some huge bonus's coming for users..

Not a chance.

They will disappear and re-brand themselves as something else.

[albertGQ]

My buddy has lost with four aces a couple to times to a straight flush and a royal flush. That is damning evidence to me. I just go to the casinos and play at the tables

[metallicat]

Originally Posted by albertGQ

My buddy has lost with four aces a couple to times to a straight flush and a royal flush. That is damning evidence to me. I just go to the casinos and play at the tables

Talk about a bad beat.

Simply with the rake from these games/tournaments, these poker sites have got to be making a killing. It's a shame that this stuff has to happen. If this one site is doing it, who's to say they all aren't?

[arsenal]

I don't think it is the "site" per say. I could definitely see an employee taking advantage of this though. While it is the same thing in the eyes of the public.

As far as the sites making money. You can do a quick calculation (based only on Sit and Go tourny's).
In any given hour, say there are 100 $3 + $0.30 sit and go tourney's that run. For the sake of argument, let's say they are 10 person tourney's.
So $0.30 for the site (entry fee) X 10 people at the table = $3.00 / table.
$3.00 x 100 tables / hour = $300 / hour. Just on the entry fees of one type of sit and go tourney alone. And I am just thinking of Texas Holdem. A lot of sites have Omaha, Razz, Hi Lo, etc as well. Mind you those are not as popular.

[albertGQ]

Originally Posted by oilers_fan

Talk about a bad beat.

Simply with the rake from these games/tournaments, these poker sites have got to be making a killing. It's a shame that this stuff has to happen. If this one site is doing it, who's to say they all aren't?

He's also flopped the nut straight, turned the nut flush, only to lose to a full house on the river. I know that can happen at a house game or a casino, but its always one peculiar hand here, and another peculiar hand there

[Thor]

Originally Posted by albertGQ

He's also flopped the nut straight, turned the nut flush, only to lose to a full house on the river. I know that can happen at a house game or a casino, but its always one peculiar hand here, and another peculiar hand there

But those bad beats happen at casino's as well. I think most often people are weary of online play and instead of thinking "bad beat" they start thinking there must be some cheating at play.

[arsenal]

I have always wondered about some of the hands that you get on on-line casinos. These poker sites need to have members, and retain members in order to make money. And there are always bad beats, or people chasing with huge odds against them, only to catch runner runner, and end up winning with a monster.

I also seem to see more monsters playing on-line than I have in playing home games or at the casino. i wonder of sites change the odds a bit for people to hit monster hands more often, to keep them playing.

[ericschand]

Originally Posted by albertGQ

He's also flopped the nut straight, turned the nut flush, only to lose to a full house on the river. I know that can happen at a house game or a casino, but its always one peculiar hand here, and another peculiar hand there

Online you see many many more hands than at a casino or house game.

Thus, the number of bad beats you see will also increase.

However, I think most sites are rigged. Not an advantage to the house per se,
they get their money anyways, rather rigged on trying to keep people around
and drive the rake up.

Something along the lines of how long you have been a customer, plus your
skill level, plus your playing history, the amount you deposit, etc. And some
times if you are plus plus plus on all those, you win. Other times you lose.
The pendulum swings all over the place, changing every so often. The
formula on who wins may change given all sorts of conditions.

Make sure the poor players can win enough to stick around, but also
make sure the good players also win every so often to keep them around.

Can the games be audited and determined fair? Sure, not too difficult
to make sure of that too, after all if you pre-determine the outcome,
you can pre-determine 1 billion hands too. It just matters on who
gets what hands and when.

So, considering I feel the sites are all rigged, why do I play? Why not?
It's entertainment. I've withdrawn all my money and mostly play freerolls
and micro-tables with the freeroll money I make [ie. no more $200+
tourneys].

I just don't trust any of the sites to do anything for me in their current
legal situation.

Worst beat I took? Got AA , called a large raise.
AhAxKh is out. Flopped the quads! He bets, I move all-in,
he calls. He's got QhQx. [not sure why, considering the flop?]

Next two cards? Jh followed by 10h.

Unfortunately it was not one of those jackpot tables...momentary
excitement until we all realized this. heh

ers

[arsenal]

here is one bad beat i took:
First hand of a multi table tourney, $10 entry fee.
Hole Cards = KK (nice cowboys). I make a $300 dollar raise, everyone folds but one person. He calls my raise.
Flop comes 3 5 7 rainbow. He goes all in, i call, because I am thinking who calls a $300 raise unless you have pockets, or AK to A10. He is holding 6-4 suited. Flopped the nuts, and I am out.

[Dan02]

Originally Posted by arsenal

here is one bad beat i took:
First hand of a multi table tourney, $10 entry fee.
Hole Cards = KK (nice cowboys). I make a $300 dollar raise, everyone folds but one person. He calls my raise.
Flop comes 3 5 7 rainbow. He goes all in, i call, because I am thinking who calls a $300 raise unless you have pockets, or AK to A10. He is holding 6-4 suited. Flopped the nuts, and I am out.

If you actually think thats at all odd then you haven't been playing enough low limit online poker.

Its not such a bad way to play either, with that hand you call a raise knowing you either hit big or fold on the flop, if you hit big you quite often win a big pot.

[arsenal]

Originally Posted by Dan02

If you actually think thats at all odd then you haven't been playing enough low limit online poker.

Its not such a bad way to play either, with that hand you call a raise knowing you either hit big or fold on the flop, if you hit big you quite often win a big pot.

I know he was hoping for a couple of hearts on the flop. Still, calling such a raise pre-flop is just silly. Mind you, I could have raised more.

Oh i know.. people on lower limit poker are crazy. Need to start playing higher limit... Just have to get my bank roll back up.

[evman150]

*yawn*

This quickly turned into a bad beat donk fest of a thread.

Bad beats happen. If they didn't I'd be out of a job.

Seriously, anybody who complains about bad beats and sites being "rigged" is not good at poker.

The sites aren't rigged. This is an isolated incident. And it happened in a tournament. Who cares. Show me this happening with regularity in the no limit cash games then I'll care.

I love how this whole mess is becoming a "see! i was right, it is rigged!". Guys talking about AAAA losing to a straight flush and saying it's because it's rigged. Holy non-sequitur batman.

If you want to read some real commentary on this issue from real poker players, visit:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...gonew=1#UNREAD

edit: important update: The Potripper account belongs to AJ Green, former Director of Operations at AP and Scott Tom's best friend. AJ Green is currently VP of operations at nine.com.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Rgging a poker site would be nearly impossible. There is too much human decision involved in each hand for it to even work.

I wouldn't be surprised to hear about some bots though. For instance, last night I saw someone go all in preflop with 7-8 off (big stack) and flopped a boat. You gotta wonder about that.

Go ahead evman...tell me how much I suck at poker though.