Coronavirus All Purpose Thread: moving on?

[redforever]

I was in the Netherlands for 3 weeks, extremely rare to see a mask there. Only time I wore a mask was on the airplane going there and coming home.

[Ryan Coke]

Same here in London (England). Almost no mask wearing anywhere.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Nmm.

[b1crunch]

This is all anecdotal but thought I'd share. I had a kidney transplant and go for regular testing and appointments with my specialist. It also means I'm immunocompromised.

Talked to my nephrologist recently and she gave me some numbers regarding kidney transplant patients in Alberta.

Of all of the kidney transplant patients in Alberta that got covid, approximately 40% of them ended up in hospital due to Covid. Another 40% of those then ended up in the ICU. Of those that ended up in the ICU approximately 50% died from Covid.

She further said that they've done testing on those that have been hospitalized and it appears that about 40% of transplant patients show zero protection from the vaccines, even though we've all been given 4 shots. Its due to us being immunocompromised and our immune systems not having proper reactions to the vaccines. As such, she can't tell me with any certainty if I'm protected. I could have 0% protection, 20% or 90%. They have no idea, but tend to guess that we are all much lower than the general population. There's a blood test they can do to check, but she said the system is overwhelmed and they are only doing the tests on those that are hospitalized.

As a result she told me that while restriction have been mostly lifted I should continue to live as though restriction are still in place. I've been advised to avoid public gatherings and always wear a mask. All this is only for kidney transplant patients, as thats the program she oversees, but I'd assume other immunocompromised people are facing similar realities.

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by b1crunch

This is all anecdotal but thought I'd share. I had a kidney transplant and go for regular testing and appointments with my specialist. It also means I'm immunocompromised.

Talked to my nephrologist recently and she gave me some numbers regarding kidney transplant patients in Alberta.

Of all of the kidney transplant patients in Alberta that got covid, approximately 40% of them ended up in hospital due to Covid. Another 40% of those then ended up in the ICU. Of those that ended up in the ICU approximately 50% died from Covid.

She further said that they've done testing on those that have been hospitalized and it appears that about 40% of transplant patients show zero protection from the vaccines, even though we've all been given 4 shots. Its due to us being immunocompromised and our immune systems not having proper reactions to the vaccines. As such, she can't tell me with any certainty if I'm protected. I could have 0% protection, 20% or 90%. They have no idea, but tend to guess that we are all much lower than the general population. There's a blood test they can do to check, but she said the system is overwhelmed and they are only doing the tests on those that are hospitalized.

As a result she told me that while restriction have been mostly lifted I should continue to live as though restriction are still in place. I've been advised to avoid public gatherings and always wear a mask. All this is only for kidney transplant patients, as thats the program she oversees, but I'd assume other immunocompromised people are facing similar realities.

My father has a kidney condition and see's a nephrologist 2-3 times a year but hasn't had a kidney transplant thankgod. His nephrologist has kept me in the loop with all things Covid and has provided a lot more information as well. He spoke as someone dealing with patients on the dialysis front, chronic condition front and transplant front.

At the start of Covid, a huge portion of dialysis patients who got Covid were hospitalized and passed away but they have gotten a lot better at treatment since than.

He has been very encouraging of vaccination from a protection perspective but has also eluded to significant effects from vaccine side effects from the vaccination from a higher than expected amount of people. When asked if my father was vaxxed, I said yes, and he asked if any side effects, I said no. He indicated that was great but also not as rare as we may be lead to believe? He has worked the Covid wards as an internal medicine specialist for a while but it was interesting to see regardless.

Do take comfort in knowing that the vaccines can provide a lot of protection in a lot of cases and that there is a whole host of people and therapeutics working immune compromised people as well as they are important. Doctors have gotten a lot better at treatment and establishing protocols and the next generation of treatments and vaccines will be vastly improved.

Until than take care, get as healthy as you can and be careful but also live life.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by redforever

I was in the Netherlands for 3 weeks, extremely rare to see a mask there. Only time I wore a mask was on the airplane going there and coming home.

Were masks mandatory at Schiphol?

[looooob]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Were masks mandatory at Schiphol?

I was curious, so looked it up- this is what the website says- mandatory once the boarding pass has been scanned


https://www.schiphol.nl/en/blog/do-i...k-at-schiphol/

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by looooob

I was curious, so looked it up- this is what the website says- mandatory once the boarding pass has been scanned


https://www.schiphol.nl/en/blog/do-i...k-at-schiphol/

Lol. That's quite the "cut the baby in half" solution.

[redforever]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Were masks mandatory at Schiphol?

Yes and no. Most were not wearing a mask in the main concourse where you entered. However, once you got to security screening, some agents told you that a mask was mandatory.

Most wore them in the KLM area where I boarded and they were mandatory on the flight going there and back. That was the direct KLM flight to and from Calgary, not sure about other airlines.

[mikephoen]

Another 70 people died of Covid in Alberta this week and nobody seems to care.

[Fuzz]

Ya, but they were probably old or had per-existing conditions.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Ya, but they were probably old or had per-existing conditions.

The better question is at this point we’re there public health measures available that would make this number lower as this disease runs it’s course through the population.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by mikephoen

Another 70 people died of Covid in Alberta this week and nobody seems to care.

I think people care, but it's just not getting reported widely like it used to, so it slides under the radar.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by GGG

The better question is at this point we’re there public health measures available that would make this number lower as this disease runs it’s course through the population.

Bingo. For whatever quantity of those 70 people died that were vaccinated or legitimately unable to be (which is few and far between), my sympathies.


For whatever quantity of those 70 that died willfully refused the abundant and free vaccinations that would have given them a higher likelihood of survival... well, who gives a f-ck? Sorry, I can't burden myself with caring about these people who don't care enough about themselves or others to do the right thing. You wanna win a Herman Cain Award, go right ahead.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

Bingo. For whatever quantity of those 70 people died that were vaccinated or legitimately unable to be (which is few and far between), my sympathies.


For whatever quantity of those 70 that died willfully refused the abundant and free vaccinations that would have given them a higher likelihood of survival... well, who gives a f-ck? Sorry, I can't burden myself with caring about these people who don't care enough about themselves or others to do the right thing. You wanna win a Herman Cain Award, go right ahead.

~19 of those deaths would be an award recipient(assuming all unvaxed are willing). We've still got over 1200 in hospital with covid. I still think we would have been much better off waiting a month before we dropped most things, just to get that hospitalization down to 600-800. We'd be in a much better place, and probably saving a lot of money.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

~19 of those deaths would be an award recipient(assuming all unvaxed are willing). We've still got over 1200 in hospital with covid. I still think we would have been much better off waiting a month before we dropped most things, just to get that hospitalization down to 600-800. We'd be in a much better place, and probably saving a lot of money.

What does better place mean?

I agree that potentially we could have saved healthcare dollars by flattening the peak and lengthening the duration. Whether this would have been a good economic or social choice I have no idea

I think the question of would we have saved lives is an open one.

Do you save lives if you can reduce the number of times a person is infected with Covid over their lifetime and does flattening peaks with health measures accomplish this? How best to time boosters with outbreaks? Essentially how to we optimize the infection of the public with each wave of the disease.

[Fuzz]

"Better place" as in our healthcare system not so stressed, giving resources to catch up on backlogs of other health issues. If we had hospitalizations in the 800 range over the past 2 months, you free up 400 beds, which is a lot of staffing resources.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

~19 of those deaths would be an award recipient(assuming all unvaxed are willing).

Again, a vanishingly small portion of the eligible population are likely to fit into the "medically unable to be vaccinated" bucket to begin with.

Originally Posted by Fuzz

We've still got over 1200 in hospital with covid. I still think we would have been much better off waiting a month before we dropped most things, just to get that hospitalization down to 600-800. We'd be in a much better place, and probably saving a lot of money.

Well we didn't, so here we are. ICU continues to trend downward, which is positive.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by GGG

What does better place mean?

I agree that potentially we could have saved healthcare dollars by flattening the peak and lengthening the duration. Whether this would have been a good economic or social choice I have no idea

I think the question of would we have saved lives is an open one.

Do you save lives if you can reduce the number of times a person is infected with Covid over their lifetime and does flattening peaks with health measures accomplish this? How best to time boosters with outbreaks? Essentially how to we optimize the infection of the public with each wave of the disease.

We can clearly reduce the impact of covid in the population. But I think at this point, the cost/benefit scale is a lot different than pre-vaccine or even Omicron/later variants.

You can put in the same lockdown restrictions we had pre-vaccine but the benefits are going to be a lot less. And if you really want to contain something as contagious as these new variants - you'd need to go even stricter on the restrictions than previous and try the China like restrictions which just wouldn't fly here (and also are stupid).

[chemgear]

That's not going to go well.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1524938073682980864