The DUNE PART 2 Full Movie and Book Spoilers Thread

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary

its super challenging as there is so much content to adapt.

Villenueve and Nolan are the best directors out there for big scale movies...but there's a ton of others like Fincher, PT Anderson, Scorcesse, Glazer, Lanthimos whose work I love too.

There were things in Dune 1+2 that I was hoping for, but were not filmed, or cut for run time...

the Conservatory and the Banquet scenes, the traitor storyline, the Mentats, Thurfir and Alia (as a child)...The Spacing Guild and their inability to use prescience to figure out to deal with Paul.

Since Paul's struggle in the book was mainly through internal monologues, I thouight the use of Chani to physically manifest those doubts was a clever strategy. Alia in vitro was cool as it provided Jessica an interesting arc.

Nothing really 'bothered' me... I thought maybe the throughline after Paul drank the Water of Life was lost a little bit as things accelerated a bit too quickly... as a Dune fan, I would have happily sat through another 15 - 30 min...but as seen in some of the reviews, there are some people who wouldn't have enjoyed it at all...

I know DV has already stated that there will be no director's cut, but I wish that he will change his mind at some point, even if it is as deleted scenes without being recut into the movie.

But WB is so cash strapped, having an Extended Dune cut would definitely get them additional sales imo...

As for Messiah, not sure how they deal with a teenage Alia, since ATJ is pretty much the same age as all the other young cast...

Either they do a HUGE time jump, or it's a smaller one and for some hand wavey reason she ages faster or something.

[photon]

Yeah the spice essence causing her to grow faster would work within her character arc.

Or maybe she never plays the character in real life, she replaces Jamis as Paul's djinn.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary

There were things in Dune 1+2 that I was hoping for, but were not filmed, or cut for run time...

the Conservatory and the Banquet scenes, the traitor storyline, the Mentats, Thurfir and Alia (as a child)...The Spacing Guild and their inability to use prescience to figure out to deal with Paul.
.

I was disappointed in the same omissions. Dune the novel is pretty much a political intrigue story in the vein of Game of Thrones. Loads of character development and political intrigue in the banquet scene when the Atreides take over Arrakis. Completely scrubbed from the script. The mentats are major characters in the book. Dramatically diminished roles in the movies.

In their place we got much more action and romance. Duncan Idaho was expanded from a periphery character to an action hero. Chani’s role was expanded, even if in the first movie it’s mostly in the form of silent visions walking through the desert.

The movies are slow-paced enough that they could have trimmed scenes to keep the intrigue and mentats without adding to the run time. But then you run into the issue of information overload, that Lynch awkwardly addressed by the liberal use of voice-overs.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Sr. Mints

I totally let out a massive groan when I read Travis Fimmel was in it.

Part of me is hoping he just acts out season 3 of Raised by Wolves. It would somewhat fit into Dune.

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

I was disappointed in the same omissions. Dune the novel is pretty much a political intrigue story in the vein of Game of Thrones. Loads of character development and political intrigue in the banquet scene when the Atreides take over Arrakis. Completely scrubbed from the script. The mentats are major characters in the book. Dramatically diminished roles in the movies.

In their place we got much more action and romance. Duncan Idaho was expanded from a periphery character to an action hero. Chani’s role was expanded, even if in the first movie it’s mostly in the form of silent visions walking through the desert.

The movies are slow-paced enough that they could have trimmed scenes to keep the intrigue and mentats without adding to the run time. But then you run into the issue of information overload, that Lynch awkwardly addressed by the liberal use of voice-overs.

Youtube has a number of different Dune sites that have identified deletes scenes through one or more of actor comments during interviews, still photographs of scenes, video of scenes or scenes mentioned in the shooting screenplay...

Its pretty clear that there was a banquet scene shot (jessica's red dress, video of Liet in formal wear, Duncan shaving his beard)...

in the shooting script, just before Leto pours out his flagon of water, the scripts says that he looks to the gathered crowd and defiantly says, "Here I am, and here I remain"....

when you add this context to the tooth scene, it just magnifies its impact, imo, so much...

I love Villeneuve's movies, and they are as good as they can be, imo, in a theatrical release. To do Dune justice requires a series... which ironically would have been fine as Herbert didn't actually go much into the big battle sequences at all in the books...I agree that the political machinations is the 'true' warfare in Dune.

Messiah, might have to focus on the politics, as that is really what the book is about...

[Yeah_Baby]

After not giving us a Balaset scene in Part 1, they had to give us the corny ass intro to Gurney with it in Part 2.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Not that I don’t understand some of the desires for a fleshed out story that people are pointing out but this reminds me of the lord of the rings discussions. If they put everything in the movie that you wanted they’d have to completely abandon the entire tone and artistic vision of the movie just so that they could hurriedly include a million different scenes and the movie would be 4 1/2 hours long.

We also saw this sort of thing with Game of Thrones. People with lament the additional romantic scenes with jon and ygritte while also complaining about the story lines and characters that were cut. At some point you have to make a decision to adapt for the screen and that involves having character development. Novels allow for so much more development that you don’t see on the screen and it’s hard to adapt.

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Not that I don’t understand some of the desires for a fleshed out story that people are pointing out but this reminds me of the lord of the rings discussions. If they put everything in the movie that you wanted they’d have to completely abandon the entire tone and artistic vision of the movie just so that they could hurriedly include a million different scenes and the movie would be 4 1/2 hours long.

We also saw this sort of thing with Game of Thrones. People with lament the additional romantic scenes with jon and ygritte while also complaining about the story lines and characters that were cut. At some point you have to make a decision to adapt for the screen and that involves having character development. Novels allow for so much more development that you don’t see on the screen and it’s hard to adapt.

totally fair comment.

I loved the LotR books and I loved the movies... There were lots of book fans that wanted, for example, more songs, or the scenes with the Eagles and also Tom Bombadil... in the end, you have to judge the movie that Jackson made, not the one you wanted made.

But as a book fan, it seems like lamenting it in a book thread is reasonable.

I loved the movies, but they weren't my version of perfection due to the choices that DV made...which is why I hope the deleted scenes are released - pacing be damned.

the reality is that 'this' version of Dune (Imax with 12 channels of sound) will never be seen again once it leaves the theaters...so does 'pacing' really mean anything anymore?

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

How is Paul portrayed in the books? Is his evolution similar to the films, or is he written as a more decidedly "good" character?

[accord1999]

Nm

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

How is Paul portrayed in the books? Is his evolution similar to the films, or is he written as a more decidedly "good" character?

No. But a lot of folks didn’t pick up on it so Herbert was more explicit about the whole space hitler thing.

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

How is Paul portrayed in the books? Is his evolution similar to the films, or is he written as a more decidedly "good" character?

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

No. But a lot of folks didn’t pick up on it so Herbert was more explicit about the whole space hitler thing.

Paul was, iirc, pretty cold... Like his relationship with his father was more 'formal', like a Father and Son and not as close knit family (like the scene in the family burial plot wasn't in the book).

agree that Paul wasn't shown as "good" in the book...but he did have more internal dialogue, which enabled people to be much more sympathetic with him...

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary

Paul was, iirc, pretty cold... Like his relationship with his father was more 'formal', like a Father and Son and not as close knit family (like the scene in the family burial plot wasn't in the book).

agree that Paul wasn't shown as "good" in the book...but he did have more internal dialogue, which enabled people to be much more sympathetic with him...

Yeah, exactly. Which is part of why I didn't like the compressed timeline, I think he needed those years to really make the turn towards using the Missionaria Protectiva

[Coach]

Just watched for the second time last night. Some things that stood out a bit more:

To me, it seems like even Jessica doesn't believe in Paul or the prophecy at all. Which makes sense because she knows it's a lie from the start. But it's played so well when Paul goes through his trials and she is unsure that he will, and then relieved and surprised when he does. Is that the way she is in the books?

I think there could have been a few more like 10 second scenes of battles to help expand the time more and the feeling of them trekking across this planet taking out battalions etc..

And, while I think have Jessica pregnant through the movie is a good device, it is what forces the condensed timeline. It would be good if they could have conceivably spent years with the Fremyn, but you can't have both when she's on a 9 month clock.