How is everyone dealing with their finances in this economy?

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by cam_calderon

This discussion is starting to go down a philosophical path, though. Haven't you already bought cars for your kids? You've already given them so many advantages in life. To what point do you mouthfeed your young'uns before they have to go and hunt for their own food?

Yes, I have. I basically have the polar opposite approach of what I was raised with. Started working at 12 for my dad's landscaping company. No summer vacations, no spring vacations...school ended on a Thursday and I was at work 7am on Friday, six days a week, 12-14 hours per day. Did that into my early 20s. It was madness - and - super illegal, apparently. Bought all my own stuff and my own cars, but WGAF? I don't see a point in making kids work so hard while they make basically minimum wage. I've let my kids put their energy into school, social activities, snowboarding, fun, etc. I've still made them get jobs, but I limit how many hours they can work.

It's nonsense to think they won't succeed because they're well supported. At my age, it seems my peers who were well supported as teens are the ones generally doing the best in life now. The guys that were raised by sink-or-swim parents? Meh, I truly believe they have a lower rate of success by most measures. I think of it as giving them a launch pad or runway from which they can take off versus just kicking them out of the nest.

If I could write a cheque to my younger self for all that money I would have made in a summer of working my nuts off so he could enjoy his time as a kid right now I'd do it in a heartbeat. I could probably make a summer's worth of money in two days. It makes no sense to make a young person work so hard for so little when they'll catch up those funds once they're an adult like it's nothing. They have an entire life to make money...let them put in the long hours when it's more lucrative to do so.

I will say grade 11 and grade 12 is a touch soon to make them hunt for their own food lol. They have the time to work on their grades to get into university right now. They have 80s and 90s, which is required to get into the programs they want. It would be moronic to make them work a bunch of hours at McDonald's right now and jeopardize their grades. Plus, my daughter is in track and my son is in rugby. That's rad. I'm way happier watching them be part of a team and get fit instead of working like I did.

One other thing on cars...I wouldn't want my kids in a POS Chevette like I drove as my first car. Cheap cars are generally unsafe. They wouldn't be able to afford better, but I can so I put them in cars with airbags, etc. to keep them safe. They're the most important thing to me; why TF would I not want to invest in their safety by getting them into vehicles no child could afford on their own? I could put that money into my own selfish fun/material goods, but for me setting them up to increase the probability of them doing well and enjoying life is its own reward.

[8sPOT]

Man I encourage my parents to spend their money and enjoy their lives, because 2 of my siblings are essentially leaches, and my parents are too nice not to always be there to help them. Heck my 39 year old brother still lives at home, doesn't work, doesn't pay rent and he's not even one of the 'leaches'!

I have an RESP for my son, so he wont have to worry about paying for school. But beyond that I just dont have anymore to give, and I only have one kid.

[cam_calderon]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Yes, I have. I basically have the polar opposite approach of what I was raised with. Started working at 12 for my dad's landscaping company. No summer vacations, no spring vacations...school ended on a Thursday and I was at work 7am on Friday, six days a week, 12-14 hours per day. Did that into my early 20s. It was madness - and - super illegal, apparently. Bought all my own stuff and my own cars, but WGAF? I don't see a point in making kids work so hard while they make basically minimum wage. I've let my kids put their energy into school, social activities, snowboarding, fun, etc. I've still made them get jobs, but I limit how many hours they can work.

It's nonsense to think they won't succeed because they're well supported. At my age, it seems my peers who were well supported as teens are the ones generally doing the best in life now. The guys that were raised by sink-or-swim parents? Meh, I truly believe they have a lower rate of success by most measures. I think of it as giving them a launch pad or runway from which they can take off versus just kicking them out of the nest.

If I could write a cheque to my younger self for all that money I would have made in a summer of working my nuts off so he could enjoy his time as a kid right now I'd do it in a heartbeat. I could probably make a summer's worth of money in two days. It makes no sense to make a young person work so hard for so little when they'll catch up those funds once they're an adult like it's nothing. They have an entire life to make money...let them put in the long hours when it's more lucrative to do so.

I will say grade 11 and grade 12 is a touch soon to make them hunt for their own food lol. They have the time to work on their grades to get into university right now. They have 80s and 90s, which is required to get into the programs they want. It would be moronic to make them work a bunch of hours at McDonald's right now and jeopardize their grades. Plus, my daughter is in track and my son is in rugby. That's rad. I'm way happier watching them be part of a team and get fit instead of working like I did.

One other thing on cars...I wouldn't want my kids in a POS Chevette like I drove as my first car. Cheap cars are generally unsafe. They wouldn't be able to afford better, but I can so I put them in cars with airbags, etc. to keep them safe. They're the most important thing to me; why TF would I not want to invest in their safety by getting them into vehicles no child could afford on their own? I could put that money into my own selfish fun/material goods, but for me setting them up to increase the probability of them doing well and enjoying life is its own reward.

I didn't mean to imply they wouldn't succeed. It's just interesting to discover your perspective and approach to helping your children financially. I'd wager you are on the right side of the bell curve in terms of philosophy and expenditure.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

I disagree, I have told my parents to spend all their money (what little they have).

Do not want them going without to save for me or my kids.

They have done their time saving money and going without.

I think levels sort of matter here - from what you've said about your upbringing it doesn't sound like your parents were at the "buy a fun car and a vacation property in Canmore" type of income bracket. For people who have struggled their whole life to make their retirement more comfortable is one thing.

For those who are already well off and living comfortably to blow every last dollar is something different. Although personally I think inheritance are too late in many cases. I'm likely to be in 60s when the second of my parents die, the die is financially cast by then. Personally, I'm planning to spend more money on my kids when they're younger (eg pay for post-secondary, help with downpayment) when I think that really gets leveraged vs holding the money and giving it to them as part of my estate. That's obviously personally riskier (could run out in retirement) but I think with good planning the risk is worth it.

[cam_calderon]

Originally Posted by 8sPOT

Man I encourage my parents to spend their money and enjoy their lives, because 2 of my siblings are essentially leaches, and my parents are too nice not to always be there to help them. Heck my 39 year old brother still lives at home, doesn't work, doesn't pay rent and he's not even one of the 'leaches'!

I have an RESP for my son, so he wont have to worry about paying for school. But beyond that I just dont have anymore to give, and I only have one kid.

Is your brother an invalid? How does he get away with that?

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by cam_calderon

I didn't mean to imply they wouldn't succeed. It's just interesting to discover your perspective and approach to helping your children financially. I'd wager you are on the right side of the bell curve in terms of philosophy and expenditure.

hah, yeah, this is pretty much my favourite topic (financial and generational planning) so I have a lot of strong opinions. My tone probably sounds like I'm butt-hurt, but I just kind of give'r when talking about it. Definitely not taking any offense here.

I will say we have super strong expectations for my kids. A crappy/lazy spouse, poor spending habits, addictive habits (gambling, etc.), etc. could completely alter how we incorporate them into our financial planning. In that case I'd be Porsche shopping. If they stay awesome, I'm here to help.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

I think levels sort of matter here - from what you've said about your upbringing it doesn't sound like your parents were at the "buy a fun car and a vacation property in Canmore" type of income bracket. For people who have struggled their whole life to make their retirement more comfortable is one thing.

For those who are already well off and living comfortably to blow every last dollar is something different. Although personally I think inheritance are too late in many cases. I'm likely to be in 60s when the second of my parents die, the die is financially cast by then. Personally, I'm planning to spend more money on my kids when they're younger (eg pay for post-secondary, help with downpayment) when I think that really gets leveraged vs holding the money and giving it to them as part of my estate. That's obviously personally riskier (could run out in retirement) but I think with good planning the risk is worth it.

fair comments

[surferguy]

A suggestion if I may Sliver:

I recommend a yearly meeting with your children to address their level of awesome. Perhaps at Christmas dinner or maybe another event for festivus? Regardless of when, it needs to happen and it needs to be very transparent.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by surferguy

A suggestion if I may Sliver:

I recommend a yearly meeting with your children to address their level of awesome. Perhaps at Christmas dinner or maybe another event for festivus? Regardless of when, it needs to happen and it needs to be very transparent.

and he needs to live stream it on his YouTubes account

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by surferguy

A suggestion if I may Sliver:

I recommend a yearly meeting with your children to address their level of awesome. Perhaps at Christmas dinner or maybe another event for festivus? Regardless of when, it needs to happen and it needs to be very transparent.

lol I'll send my daughter over to your house again. I don't think she was done hanging with your boys when we left haha. Now those are some polite and cool kids. Eye contact, hand shakes, friendly and fun. You guys are killing it. I'll take your tips on raising kids any day.

[8sPOT]

Originally Posted by cam_calderon

Is your brother an invalid? How does he get away with that?

He cant work because he's depressed essentially. Dropped out after 1 year of University, had a breakdown and, well, its been like a decade now. I meant to say he's 28, not 38, but point still stands.

[cam_calderon]

Originally Posted by 8sPOT

He cant work because he's depressed essentially. Dropped out after 1 year of University, had a breakdown and, well, its been like a decade now. I meant to say he's 28, not 38, but point still stands.

I'm sorry to hear. I'm sure it's tough on everyone.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by blankall

Coffee shops, bars, restaurants, and, most importantly, avocado didn't exist either. If university education workers would stop spending $200-400 per month on all these extra luxuries, they'd be able to afford to save several hundred thousand dollars for a down payment. Pretty simple.

Not just the adults, it's the teenagers. Ever go to the mall or the food court, teenagers are buying lattes at starbucks.

Do you remember buying anything regularly at age 15?

Or university students are spending so much they've built University District.

If you need lunch or a study break, University District is the perfect destination! The community boasts over 25 retailers
including popular spots like The Canadian Brewhouse, Village Ice Cream, Monogram Coffee and more.

When we went to university, we could afford nothing. The odd lunch in Mac Hall or the odd drink at The Den. A lunch or study break meant maybe a trip to a vending machine for Skittles.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Not just the adults, it's the teenagers. Ever go to the mall or the food court, teenagers are buying lattes at starbucks.

Do you remember buying anything regularly at age 15?

Or university students are spending so much they've built University District.

When we went to university, we could afford nothing. The odd lunch in Mac Hall or the odd drink at The Den. A lunch or study break meant maybe a trip to a vending machine for Skittles.

Agree completely other than the Den. When did you go? I was there 96-2000. Pitchers were $5. Even I could afford those.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

So parents in the 2020's only have children if they can afford all sorts of extracurricular activities.

Got it.

So eventually the working poor will breed themselves into extinction.

Fertility rates are declining steeply in Canada. And fertility rates correlate with income. So like marriage, having children is becoming a marker of class.

Poorer Canadian women have much lower expectations of children in the near future. This points to a vitally important reality: childbearing in Canada is becoming more associated with wealth than it is in other countries, and than it was in Canada in the past, as poorer women face difficulties manifesting their family desires. Poorer Canadian women don’t want, don’t intend, and aren’t having as many children. This is reminiscent of the growing inequality in marriage. Lower-income Canadians are less likely to marry than are higher-income Canadians. These points may be related insofar as marriage is correlated with higher fertility.

https://www.cardus.ca/research/famil...having-a-baby/

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Agree completely other than the Den. When did you go? I was there 96-2000. Pitchers were $5. Even I could afford those.

About the same, 97-01.

[Bigtime]

University District may be capturing students on their breaks, but it was not built because of their pent up demand to spend money. None of the residential going up there comes even close to catering to a student demographic at the price points (which I think was dumb, could have had a great mix for the community).

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Overall fertility rates are declining steeply. And in Canada today, fertility rates correlate with income. So like marriage, having children is becoming a marker of class.

I don't doubt you, based on your posting history.

But can you send me the source please?

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

I don't doubt you, based on your posting history.

But can you send me the source please?

https://www.cardus.ca/research/famil...having-a-baby/

[surferguy]

Originally Posted by Sliver

lol I'll send my daughter over to your house again. I don't think she was done hanging with your boys when we left haha. Now those are some polite and cool kids. Eye contact, hand shakes, friendly and fun. You guys are killing it. I'll take your tips on raising kids any day.

Haha! My wife and I wearing laughing about how the boys accosted your daughter and made her take shots on them while in goal. The best part, she was completely unfazed by it:

“Oh? You want me to rip some clappers on you in the kitchen? Hell yeah, Gimmie that mini stick!”

lol it was awesome.

I appreciate your comment more than you realize and I’m going to reciprocate - your daughter was super kind and I thought it was pretty cool that she didn’t mind popping into the house to be there with you while you picked up the table.

Please consider that afternoon while conducting her awesome review later this year.