The Derek Chauvin trial is underway..GUILTY on all charges

[troutman]

990 people have been shot and killed by police in the past year
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph...ings-database/

In 2015, The Washington Post began to log every fatal shooting by an on-duty police officer in the United States. In that time there have been more than 5,000 such shootings recorded by The Post.

Although half of the people shot and killed by police are White, Black Americans are shot at a disproportionate rate. They account for less than 13 percent of the U.S. population, but are killed by police at more than twice the rate of White Americans. Hispanic Americans are also killed by police at a disproportionate rate.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

And the police are supposed to know they will be shot at? Cops aren't all top titties alpha squad gunmen capable of reading a situation perfectly every time. Why should they have to put their lives to chance so you can feel good about yourself while you have no skin in this game?

Because that's what they are paid to do

[underGRADFlame]

Originally Posted by Coach

Why should this matter? Police should be getting shot at before they fire back. It's why they wear bullet proof vests. It's part of their job. The same way firefighters run into fires. It's dangerous. If you're not prepared for this then don't be a cop.

Are you f'n serious! No cop signed up to get shot at and to say they did is completely disrespectful to the hundreds of thousand officers that do the job without ending up on CNN.

Go tell Andy Harrnet's widow that it's what he signed up for!

[PepsiFree]

Usual suspects more upset and doing more moralising at the idea of changing the way cops rely on guns than they are about an unarmed 13-year old boy getting shot.

These threads are always good for that, at least.

*Cop kills unarmed child*
“...”
*Someone said cops should fire when fired upon*
“THIS IS WRONG!!”

Truly the heroes of our time.

[PaperBagger'14]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Usual suspects more upset and doing more moralising at the idea of changing the way cops rely on guns than they are about an unarmed 13-year old boy getting shot.

These threads are always good for that, at least.

*Cop kills unarmed child*
“...”
*Someone said cops should fire when fired upon*
“THIS IS WRONG!!”

Truly the heroes of our time.

Did the usual suspects say an unarmed kid should be killed by police? No, they didn't. No one said that. Thanks for the implication though, boy.

Did the usual suspects dump on someone for having a horrible idea that police must be in a position to die before they can defend themselves?

Yeah, we did.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Usual suspects more upset and doing more moralising at the idea of changing the way cops rely on guns than they are about an unarmed 13-year old boy getting shot.

These threads are always good for that, at least.

*Cop kills unarmed child*
“...”
*Someone said cops should fire when fired upon*
“THIS IS WRONG!!”

Truly the heroes of our time.

Can you provide everyone with this list?

[Coach]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

And the police are supposed to know they will be shot at? Cops aren't all top titties alpha squad gunmen capable of reading a situation perfectly every time. Why should they have to put their lives to chance so you can feel good about yourself while you have no skin in this game?

Originally Posted by underGRADFlame

Are you f'n serious! No cop signed up to get shot at and to say they did is completely disrespectful to the hundreds of thousand officers that do the job without ending up on CNN.

Go tell Andy Harrnet's widow that it's what he signed up for!

It's not signing up to be killed, but it's a potential hazard of the job. Is this news? Fire fighters put themselves on the line every time they step into a fire. Do fires happen every day? No. Do they expect to die, or even be hurt, even if they do have to fight a fire? No thats what they train for. But of course it's a possibility.

I'm pretty frightened by the amount of people that think "Maybe had a gun" is case for capital punishment before trial. People crying about the due process for the police officers. Everyone should have due process, including anyone being apprehended by the police.

"I thought he had a gun" "I thought my taser was the gun". It's just not acceptable. We're okay with these people having firearms at their job? Not only that, giving them the okay to kill people suspected of crimes.

There are more guns than people in the US. If you're a police officer, chances are you're going to encounter them.

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Usual suspects more upset and doing more moralising at the idea of changing the way cops rely on guns than they are about an unarmed 13-year old boy getting shot.

These threads are always good for that, at least.

*Cop kills unarmed child*
“...”
*Someone said cops should fire when fired upon*
“THIS IS WRONG!!”

Truly the heroes of our time.

Not to pick fly $hit out of pepper, but he WAS armed literally milliseconds prior to him being shot. I’m not condoning what happened but let’s stick to the facts and not fabrications.

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by Coach

It's not signing up to be killed, but it's a potential hazard of the job. Is this news? Fire fighters put themselves on the line every time they step into a fire. Do fires happen every day?No. Do they expect to die, or even be hurt, even if they do have to fight a fire? No thats what they train for. But of course it's a possibility.

I'm pretty frightened by the amount of people that think "Maybe had a gun" is case for capital punishment before trial. People crying about the due process for the police officers. Everyone should have due process, including anyone being apprehended by the police.

"I thought he had a gun" "I thought my taser was the gun". It's just not acceptable. We're okay with these people having firearms at their job? Not only that, giving them the okay to kill people suspected of crimes.

There are more guns than people in the US. If you're a police officer, chances are you're going to encounter them.

So to the first bold point, to answer your question yes it is a possibility for this to happen to police and that is even without the ridiculous suggestion that police be fired upon before shooting back.

To your second point you’re confusing court process with an interaction between police and a suspect. “Due process” is absolutely afforded to suspects when the situation is safe and calm and able to be administered.

[8 Ball]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

Not to pick fly $hit out of pepper, but he WAS armed literally milliseconds prior to him being shot. I’m not condoning what happened but let’s stick to the facts and not fabrications.

Which means he wasn’t armed...

[Coach]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

So to the first bold point, to answer your question yes it is a possibility for this to happen to police and that is even without the ridiculous suggestion that police be fired upon before shooting back.

To your second point you’re confusing court process with an interaction between police and a suspect. “Due process” is absolutely afforded to suspects when the situation is safe and calm and able to be administered.

Someone running away who has stop and is complying with your instructions?

Maybe my comment was blunt, but I've yet to be given a reason why a police officer should ever feel the need to fire a gun at a citizen unless they have been shot at first. Is having a gun a reason to be shot at? Even as an adult man? Even if I'm running from the illegal drug deal I just made? Or the store I just robbed? Even If I'm on PCP and am waving a gun around like a crazy person, is shooting me the right course of action?

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by Coach

Maybe my comment was blunt, but I've yet to be given a reason why a police officer should ever feel the need to fire a gun at a citizen unless they have been shot at first.

https://globalnews.ca/news/2947650/c...lborough-mall/

[Coach]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

https://globalnews.ca/news/2947650/c...lborough-mall/

Okay, I assumed people could understand that being "shot at" could be reasonably conflated to "attacked/is a attacking the public with a deadly weapon in general" with a little bit of critical thought.

Either way, I would still argue that shooting this person is a tragedy that should be the absolute final resort, which it sounds like it was here. I hope that officer pulls through.

This is so far from firing on a teenager who tossed their weapon away, or who is getting back into their car, or kneeling on a mans neck for 9 min for that matter, that I'm not sure why I responded to it actually.

[PaperBagger'14]

Originally Posted by Coach

It's not signing up to be killed, but it's a potential hazard of the job. Is this news? Fire fighters put themselves on the line every time they step into a fire. Do fires happen every day? No. Do they expect to die, or even be hurt, even if they do have to fight a fire? No thats what they train for. But of course it's a possibility.

I'm pretty frightened by the amount of people that think "Maybe had a gun" is case for capital punishment before trial. People crying about the due process for the police officers. Everyone should have due process, including anyone being apprehended by the police.

"I thought he had a gun" "I thought my taser was the gun". It's just not acceptable. We're okay with these people having firearms at their job? Not only that, giving them the okay to kill people suspected of crimes.

There are more guns than people in the US. If you're a police officer, chances are you're going to encounter them.

The hierarchy for hazard control in the workplace in Alberta (and a good chunk of the modernized world) starts with:

1) Remove the hazard

I'd be interested to hear why police don't fall under the most basic OH&S rules. Police do need to be held to a high standard, above the average person, but that standard shouldn't involve anticipating death.

I truthfully don't care about what happens in the US, because they have their own issues.

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by Coach

Someone running away who has stop and is complying with your instructions?

Maybe my comment was blunt, but I've yet to be given a reason why a police officer should ever feel the need to fire a gun at a citizen unless they have been shot at first. Is having a gun a reason to be shot at? Even as an adult man? Even if I'm running from the illegal drug deal I just made? Or the store I just robbed? Even If I'm on PCP and am waving a gun around like a crazy person, is shooting me the right course of action?

I really don’t wanna detract from the issue at hand which is a 13 year old boy is dead and it doesn’t look good. But for some reason I feel compelled to answer your questions. Yes, depending on the circumstances you CAN be shot in the back while running away.

You’re telling me if someone pointed a gun at you, you’ll wait til they shoot to shoot back? I call bs.

And yeah, if you rob a store and are waving a gun around or are high on pcp waving a gun around you’re probably gonna get shot.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Because that's what they are paid to do

The police culture in the U.S. is clearly messed up. But being a cop is a much more dangerous job in the U.S. than in countries like the UK.

Between 2000 and 2014, 25 police officers were killed in the line of duty in the UK. In that period 2445 were killed in the U.S. Adjusted for the number of police in each country, it’s literally ten times more dangerous to be a cop in the U.S. than in the UK. And the pay is pretty much the same ($53k vs 38k GBP).

[PaperBagger'14]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Because that's what they are paid to do

Do you honestly think this? I'd like to think someone who could be as kind as you are being a foster parent wouldn't be that callous.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

I really don’t wanna detract from the issue at hand which is a 13 year old boy is dead and it doesn’t look good. But for some reason I feel compelled to answer your questions. Yes, depending on the circumstances you CAN be shot in the back while running away.

What are these circumstances? Like, triple homicide? Maybe? Even then, isn't the best course of action to just continue to chase and apprehend so they can stand trial? As best you can? Certainly not a non-violent crime like a drug deal or a theft... right? Seriously I struggle with thinking of any good reason to fire on someone running away unless they are proven to be the Zodiac or something.

You’re telling me if someone pointed a gun at you, you’ll wait til they shoot to shoot back? I call bs.

I'm not a police officer! I don't have a gun at work. I'm far too much of a coward for that.

And yeah, if you rob a store and are waving a gun around or are high on pcp waving a gun around you’re probably gonna get shot.

So taking PCP and having a gun is a reasonable state to expect being shot at, but being a police officer who deals with anything from that person with the PCP and the gun to gang wars, is not?

[zamler]

Originally Posted by Coach

I'm not a police officer!

If you were and ever encountered an active shooter you'd likely be dead. But hey, since you're not a police officer who cares if they have to get shot at before they are allowed to shoot back.

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by Coach

What are these circumstances? Like, triple homicide? Maybe? Even then, isn't the best course of action to just continue to chase and apprehend so they can stand trial? As best you can? Certainly not a non-violent crime like a drug deal or a theft... right? Seriously I struggle with thinking of any good reason to fire on someone running away unless they are proven to be the Zodiac or something.

Had just shot multiple people, grounds to believe they will kill someone ie: domestic situation where suspect vocalizes he will kill their significant other and goes to enter the residence while armed. There are a lot if different scenarios.

I'm not a police officer! I don't have a gun at work. I'm far too much of a coward for that.



So taking PCP and having a gun is a reasonable state to expect being shot at, but being a police officer who deals with anything from that person with the PCP and the gun to gang wars, is not?one person is trying to keep the peace, the other is actively committing crime. Do I really need to spell that out for you?

See bolded