Israel declares war on Hamas

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Honest question.....what choice do they have?

I mean, watch the videos of all those rockets that were launched last night.

Its clear they are coming from heavily populated areas.

When answering an attack, they need to neutralize the weaponry that is killing their citizens.....Hamas hides all that among the population.

So as gross as it is going to be as far as the human toll goes, there very little else Israel can do at this point.

I don't know...Israel has every right to stop the killing of their people and it has to start with wiping out where the threat is coming from....no?

Look at the Jenin incursion.

Israel does not have the right to kill innocent people, nor do they have the right to incur however many civilian deaths they deem fit. They have a responsibility as the occupier to protect civilians even in extreme circumstances, even in acts of war.

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by Regorium

I actually can't believe there are people doing the both sides many sides thing on this forum for this situation.

Literally everything that happened in the past no longer matters as of today.

The videos are vile. They show no remorse. Worse, they show malicious intent and celebration. I just watched a kidnapped 6 year old Israeli boy crying for his mother while getting hit and beaten by Palestinians. He's probably dead by now.

If that was my country, I would expect a disproportionate response from the government to avenge my countrymen.

No matter how many citizens they kill Israel will always have people willing to defend all the atrocities they commit. Yes it is pretty disgusting but not unexpected.

[Beninho]

Originally Posted by Spurs

No matter how many citizens they kill Israel will always have people willing to defend all the atrocities they commit. Yes it is pretty disgusting but not unexpected.

Ya Israel mutualizes citizens, parades them around in the streets, and abducts women, children elderly. Innocent Women are being raped in Gaza currently, does the IDF do this? One could only imagine what these animals would do with an actual state. Oh wait we can, look at syria. Scum of the earth society. The only country in the region with any sense of decency is Israel.

One side has morals, the others does not. Clear as day to see

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Regorium

I actually can't believe there are people doing the both sides many sides thing on this forum for this situation.

Literally everything that happened in the past no longer matters as of today.

The videos are vile. They show no remorse. Worse, they show malicious intent and celebration. I just watched a kidnapped 6 year old Israeli boy crying for his mother while getting hit and beaten by Palestinians. He's probably dead by now.

If that was my country, I would expect a disproportionate response from the government to avenge my countrymen.

Because they're not.

Its far, far more nuanced than that. And no...'the past no longer matters as of today?'

Are you serious? These are literally 'Age Old Enemies.' They are each others' Nemesis. They have been at each other's throats for millennia!

Its not 'both sides many sides' you can distinguish an antagonist in any particular situation but that doesnt make the other party your defacto protagonist.

Frankly, this situation between them is so old and complex I dont even know what to think other than: "Stop killing each other."

Israelis and Palestinians hating each other is a tale as old as time...of course 'the past' matters.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Look at the Jenin incursion.

Israel does not have the right to kill innocent people, nor do they have the right to incur however many civilian deaths they deem fit. They have a responsibility as the occupier to protect civilians even in extreme circumstances, even in acts of war.

Originally Posted by Spurs

No matter how many citizens they kill Israel will always have people willing to defend all the atrocities they commit. Yes it is pretty disgusting but not unexpected.

All you're trying to do is deflect the conversation. It's more important for you to justify the atrocities that just happened. I wish you two were there and got to experience the events as they happened first hand.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Can someone explain to me how restricting water and dehousing people isn't targeting civilians?

Do Hamas try to restrict water to Israeli civilians and dehouse them? Or do they try to kill them dead?

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by Beninho

Ya Israel mutualizes citizens, parades them around in the streets, and abducts women, children elderly. Innocent Women are being raped in Gaza currently, does the IDF do this? One could only imagine what these animals would do with an actual state. Oh wait we can, look at syria. Scum of the earth society. The only country in the region with any sense of decency is Israel.

One side has morals, the others does not. Clear as day to see

I wouldn’t say Hamas or Hezbollah have morals but we know for sure the Israelis do not.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

All you're trying to do is deflect the conversation. It's more important for you to justify the atrocities that just happened. I wish you two were there and got to experience the events as they happened first hand.

Cool? I wish you were there, too?

It’s not to justify anything Get over yourself.

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

All you're trying to do is deflect the conversation. It's more important for you to justify the atrocities that just happened. I wish you two were there and got to experience the events as they happened first hand.

I’m not deflecting anything what Hamas did was disgusting. Criticizing one side doesn’t give the other side a pass, it’s only the Pro-Israel side that wants to ignore what is happening.

[Beninho]

Originally Posted by Spurs

I wouldn’t say Hamas or Hezbollah have morals but we know for sure the Israelis do not.

Ah ya, lets talk about the Palestinians. A society that permits rape, child soldiers, human shields, no women rights, and indoctrination to kill jews from the moment they are born have morals? Should we talk about the rampant sex slave trade in the arab world? Shall I go on. What an idiotic statement

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

But they’re not the terrorists. And they don’t target civilians, so they’re good to just keep doing what they’re doing until Palestinians are wiped out (which is likely now what’s going to happen).

Are you that intellectually challenged that you can’t engage with what people actually say? Why do you resort again and again and again to take jeering shots at absurd strawmen of your own invention?

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by Spurs

I wouldn’t say Hamas or Hezbollah have morals but we know for sure the Israelis do not.

I still have an Israeli passport, please tell me about my morals.

If Israelis didn't care about civilians they would've eradicated Hamas a long time ago. Israel doesn't want a war. That's why Israel gave up territories they conquered for peace treaties with Egypt, and Jordan. Seems like it would require morals to sign those, and hold yourself accountable to them as well.

All people in Israel want is long term peace and quiet. That said, now people think that there needs to be an overwhelming response so that the quiet will last for more than a couple of weeks/months.

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by Beninho

Ah ya, lets talk about the Palestinians. A society that permits rape, child soldiers, human shields, no women rights, and indoctrination to kill jews from the moment they are born have morals? Should we talk about the rampant sex slave trade in the arab world? Shall I go on. What an idiotic statement

Do whatever you like since you seem to only read what you want not what was said.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Look at the Jenin incursion.

Israel does not have the right to kill innocent people, nor do they have the right to incur however many civilian deaths they deem fit. They have a responsibility as the occupier to protect civilians even in extreme circumstances, even in acts of war.

Cool.

Now, care to answer the question?

Literally thousands of rockets have been targeted at your civilians, hundreds dead and thousands injured.

You know where they were launched from and where they will be launched from again.

You are responsible for the safety of those still there....what do you do to make sure that happens?

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

I still have an Israeli passport, please tell me about my morals.

If Israelis didn't care about civilians they would've eradicated Hamas a long time ago. Israel doesn't want a war. That's why Israel gave up territories they conquered for peace treaties with Egypt, and Jordan. Seems like it would require morals to sign those, and hold yourself accountable to them as well.

All people in Israel want is long term peace and quiet. That said, now people think that there needs to be an overwhelming response so that the quiet will last for more than a couple of weeks/months.

LOL only want peace?

Come on. I know you have a connection to the country obviously but you can’t be this naive.

Edit: I know you are not this naive because you have talked about the problems earlier in the thread.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

Israel has coexisted just fine with Egypt and Jordan. That's why I had hope for a peaceful solution for the longest time. It doesn't seem possible now because both sides are set on making it into an existential war.

Coexisted just fine with Egypt? What is your timeframe for believing that? This attack occurred just 50 years after the Yom Kippur war which was Israel vs the Arab world led by Egypt. Israel lost the Sinai Peninsula to Egypt in that war. Sure they have a peace accord now but that is a fairly new occurrence in history.

[Beninho]

Originally Posted by Spurs

Do whatever you like since you seem to only read what you want not what was said.

You are so dense, i read exactly what you wrote. Israelis have no morals and are equal to hamas in your eyes. Nothing else to see here, go cheer for your loser soccer team.

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by Beninho

You are so dense, i read exactly what you wrote. Israelis have no morals and are equal to hamas in your eyes. Nothing else to see here, go cheer for your loser soccer team.

Actually no you didn’t read what I wrote based in your response but laughable that you go to supposed soccer smack because you can’t read.

[Beninho]

Originally Posted by Spurs

Actually no you didn’t read what I wrote based in your response but laughable that you go to supposed soccer smack because you can’t read.

Israel could kill 10’s of thousands of Palestinians a day but they don’t. If the roles were reversed what would happen? Ya, the morals of both sides are equal here tho in your eyes. I’ll see you back in here in two weeks when Gaza is ruble complaining about Israeli actions after Hamas un provoked decided to start this war.

[Manhattanboy]

Originally Posted by Azure

Took till page 2 for this to show up.

What did the people of Palestine think would happen? What do people think Israel should do here?

Whoever posted it earlier is 100% correct. If you believe in an independent Palestine as a state, then this is state action, and therefore Israel is justified to take ruthless action against Palestine the state and its governing bodies that support and sanction these actions.

Will be a sad time coming up watching this unfold.

Unfortunately the people of Palestine, who will suffer most, had no choice. Hamas rules over them with an iron fist.

I bet the vast majority of citizens of Gaza and the West Bank are fed up with Hamas and no doubt are scared to death about what's going to happen next. The Israelis too.

Hamas, which of course has no regard for Jewish/Israeli lives, could care less about Palestinian lives as well. They are scum.