Van hits multiple pedestrians in Toronto

[EldrickOnIce]

The WHO says 1 in 4 people worldwide are affected by mental or neurological disorders in their lifetime. Canadian Mental health says 1 in 5.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by EldrickOnIce

The WHO says 1 in 4 people worldwide are affected by mental or neurological disorders in their lifetime. Canadian Mental health says 1 in 5.

Pfft. What would they know about it?

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Jesus Christ, what an ignorant post. There's a major difference between being shy and having crippling anxiety to the point of panic attacks when out in public. There's a difference between being a little sad and being depressed to the point of considering or attempting suicide. You're talking out of your ass.

You're not understanding a word, of course there's a difference, until you kill people, then your minor issue becomes the reason you went screwy.

We live in a world were every minor issue has a diagnoses and a drug to treat it, due in large part to the DSM manual which may or may not be a good thing but it also means in the light of hindsight every body that does something horrific gets diagnosed and the fact they did something horrific attached to what ever convenient label we slap on them.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

You're not understanding a word, of course there's a difference, until you kill people, then your minor issue becomes the reason you went screwy.

I'm understanding what you're trying to say but it's utterly ignorant garbage. Stuff like this:

We live in a world were every minor issue has a diagnoses and a drug to treat it, due in large part to the DSM manual

this...

t isn't diagnosed nor is social anxiety disorder (used to be called being shy)

and this..

I doubt there is a human being on God's sweet earth that isn't depressed, autistic, paranoid, dealing with addiction, oppositional conduct disorder, FASD, ADHD or ADD etc, etc, everybody is something, we are all broken,

Not only does everything you're saying display a complete misunderstanding and misrepresentation of the diagnostic process and the purpose of the DSM in general, it completely marginalizes and dismisses the lived experiences and challenges people with mental illness face.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Iggy City

That's called being prejudice though.

You'd be unfairly judging an entire group of people (whether it be race/religion/colour) based on the perceived actions of a few. Atleast that's what I get when people say stuff like "I bet I can guess this guy's religion".

Not really.

Someone who did [particular bad thing] has a good chance of being [identifiable group of people] is not at all the same as [identifiable group of people] are okay with [particular bad thing].

For example, most people who go on shooting sprees are men. Most of us assume that when we hear about someone going on a shooting spree, that it's a man. And yet we don't really think most men approve of murderous shooting sprees, do we?

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Not really.

Someone who did [particular bad thing] has a good chance of being [identifiable group of people] is not at all the same as [identifiable group of people] are okay with [particular bad thing].

For example, most people who go on shooting sprees are men. Most of us assume that when we hear about someone going on a shooting spree, that it's a man. And yet we don't really think most men approve of murderous shooting sprees, do we?

It might not be explicitly racist but it still falls under stereotyping.

[afc wimbledon]

think of the Vegas shooting, what stands out about it, that we don't have a clue why he did it, there isn't a convenient label to attach to the shooter, he had money, a partner, no apparent motive at all, we cant stand that, posters here were posting how weird it was and what was his motive.

We look for patterns, explanations, we will grasp anything that we can to explain these events, sometimes we are right, I suspect half the time we are completely off base but it comforts us to think we have a handle on why people explode.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by rubecube

I'm understanding what you're trying to say but it's utterly ignorant garbage. Stuff like this:



this...



and this..



Not only does everything you're saying display a complete misunderstanding and misrepresentation of the diagnostic process and the purpose of the DSM in general, it completely marginalizes and dismisses the lived experiences and challenges people with mental illness face.

Actually I'm doing the opposite, I'm trying to point out that parsing through the history of every person that commits a horrific act until we find some vaguely plausible behaviour we can call 'mental illness' based on some minor issue or behaviour that most all of us have experienced at some time or other in our lives, then conflating that into full blown mental illness does a huge disservice to those with mental illness.

[Looch City]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

think of the Vegas shooting, what stands out about it, that we don't have a clue why he did it, there isn't a convenient label to attach to the shooter, he had money, a partner, no apparent motive at all, we cant stand that, posters here were posting how weird it was and what was his motive.

We look for patterns, explanations, we will grasp anything that we can to explain these events, sometimes we are right, I suspect half the time we are completely off base but it comforts us to think we have a handle on why people explode.

While it might comfort you, it certainly makes an entire group of people rather uncomfortable.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Iggy City

While it might comfort you, it certainly makes an entire group of people rather uncomfortable.

that was my point, we, as a species want some sense of order, it's why we invented religion, the devil made him do it, they were all sinners etc, now we have abandoned religion we still want a sense of order in the universe, the idea any one of could randomly pop off at any time horrifies us, so we find sociatal or health explanations, at least we are closer to some kind of truth than the religious explanation but not by a hell of a lot mostly.

We want one easy to grasp explanation where as in truth there are thousands of reasons, precursors and triggering events that lead to these acts.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by PsYcNeT

#### youuuu dude.

As someone on the spectrum (shocker!), dealing with the 'tisms doesn't make you a goddamn sociopath. High-functioning folk have issues with facial/posture subtleties, picking up on social cues, and dealing with incidental triggers. This does not mean however that we lack a moral compass or can't learn to identify and handle these things with a lot of work and effort. Jesus christ, we're awkward, frequently make asses of ourselves, and often don't understand why people are mad/annoyed/frustrated with us, but Autism doesn't make you blind to why mowing down 23 people with a rental van is evil.

I wasn't saying anything remotely like that.

The term autism gets thrown around a lot and can mean a lot of things (you know more about this than I do). But some autistic people do have trouble discerning right from wrong. I wasn't making any comments about all autistic people at all.

My issue is with people exploiting a disability for political means.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

not if we're talking about how closed the minds are for both those groups of people.

on topic,
I still can't get over how awesome that cop was. talk about having a clear head under pressure.
after so many recent stories from the states about their cops shooting unarmed people within 30 seconds of an incident, his actions were so amazing to see.

Const. Ken Lam!!

https://news.vice.com/en_ca/article/...-a-single-shot

The officer’s de-escalation approach might seem counterintuitive, but former Toronto police detective sergeant John Muise tells VICE News, “It was textbook.”

retired Toronto Police officer, Fred Iannuccilli, said the officer followed procedure “as close as possible.”

“I thought it was excellent actually,” said Iannuccilli, who used to teach police use of force protocol. “He’s very calm and collected about what he’s doing.”

Muise said officers are trained to use a range of tactics, from talking to the suspect to deadly force, and this officer was using the less harmful range of those tactics.

“Calm, cool, collected,” Muise said of the Toronto police officer. “Canadians can be proud of what this officer did, be proud of the Toronto Police service that day.”

Yeah, he was extremely brave in the face of danger. A lot of people would have shot him dead the way he was behaving. No one would have blamed him either, but he was totally in control. Well done.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by EldrickOnIce

The WHO says 1 in 4 people worldwide are affected by mental or neurological disorders in their lifetime. Canadian Mental health says 1 in 5.

Who’s on first.

[Duruss]

Originally Posted by blankall

I wasn't saying anything remotely like that.

The term autism gets thrown around a lot and can mean a lot of things (you know more about this than I do). But some autistic people do have trouble discerning right from wrong. I wasn't making any comments about all autistic people at all.

My issue is with people exploiting a disability for political means.

Your issue is that you have a big mouth and can't admit you wrote something freakin' offensive.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Duruss

Your issue is that you have a big mouth and can't admit you wrote something freakin' offensive.

I apologise if what I said was taken the wrong way. If you actually read the article I linked, it specifically states that you cannot generalize the behavior of autistic people.

I don't think that people with autism are inherently dangerous, but Mannassian's specific issues did play a role in this tragedy, and that's not something that should be politicized.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by PsYcNeT

#### youuuu dude.

As someone on the spectrum (shocker!), dealing with the 'tisms doesn't make you a goddamn sociopath. High-functioning folk have issues with facial/posture subtleties, picking up on social cues, and dealing with incidental triggers. This does not mean however that we lack a moral compass or can't learn to identify and handle these things with a lot of work and effort. Jesus christ, we're awkward, frequently make asses of ourselves, and often don't understand why people are mad/annoyed/frustrated with us, but Autism doesn't make you blind to why mowing down 23 people with a rental van is evil.

I will admit that I was pretty ignorant about autism until my daughter went under assessments. In the end, they concluded that she isn't autistic, but I wouldn't have cared either way. Obviously everyone wants what is best for their children and autism can be a struggle for some, so it's important to be open about it. I hope the media doesn't play that angle as it would be really unfair. You rarely hear of people with autism doing violent things. I imagine it doesn't happen any more than it does in the population in general.

Thanks for sharing your perspective and experience.

[MoneyGuy]

It's awful that the discussion of an attack that took 10 lives has deteriorated into this nonsense.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Duruss

Your issue is that you have a big mouth and can't admit you wrote something freakin' offensive.

What is the purpose of this sort of reply? I seriously doubt that Blankall was being deliberately malicious or even careless. He just happens to be uninformed in this area, as a whole ton of people are. Moreover, those people are generally afraid to ask questions and learn more about an area that is extremely difficult to grasp if you've never dealt with it personally. FlamesAddiction is the norm - no one learns anything about this stuff until it affects someone close to them. As a result, ignorance perpetuates itself.

It seems like a much better policy to try to gently correct someone's erroneous impressions, which might lead them to ask for further information and educate themselves. "I know you probably didn't mean to come off this way, but I think you should know that..." If this was the atmosphere, it would also help people who live with these conditions to talk about them more, alleviating some of the stigma and general confusion surrounding mental illness and autism spectrum disorders.

Less self-righteous sanctimony, please.

[PepsiFree]

I think you’re confusing a purely emotional response with self-righteous sanctimony, and based on the misinterpretation of blankall’s post, I don’t think it’s hard to have the level of empathy required to see that.

Doesn’t mean it was the appropriate reaction, but let’s not miscategorize it from our own pedestal of unemotional logic, Corsi.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

I'd get that if it was a reaction to the original post, but it was in reply to the guy's further explanation about what he meant. I read that as a demand that Blankall prostrate himself and repent of his trangression. Either way, doesn't affect my first two paragraphs.