[Trade] Hanifin (salary retained) to Vegas for Miromanov + 2026 1st + cond 3rd

[delayedreflex]

Originally Posted by bluejays

My view now that things have simmered down a bit is that any GM can’t just mysteriously pluck an extra 1st or blue chip project out of nowhere. It really comes down to market conditions. This year seems to have swung in favour of the buyer which really sucks. Particular GMs probably had a thing for particular players such as Winnipeg and Monahan and paying the price there but it is what it is. All I can say is over and over again we can’t let it get to this point again for our pending UFAs. Deal them before they get to this state. The market winds blew unexpectedly but can’t do anything about it. Would have been nice if Conroy was able to squeeze out a little more or better conditions but it could be growing pains.

Yes if anything people should be very thankful that Conroy pulled off the Lindholm deal when he did. It’s not always the case that prices rise towards the trade deadline.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Duffalufagus

It’s a terrible trade. He basically got the same thing Mtl did for Monahan. We just turned our top d pairing into lottery tickets next year. Not a single decent prospect. It’s objectively pretty bad.

Lindholm is a very close comparable and he was traded for a 1st, two seconds, and filler. He then extended immediately with the Bruins. The issue is that the Flames weren’t proactive and traded him at the deadline.

Hopefully they do better with the next set of players they trade.

[SuperMatt18]

I'm more annoyed by the condition on the 2nd / 3rd than the condition on the 1st.

Should have been the conditional 1st and then a guaranteed 2nd. No need for that pick to have the win a round condition.

That feels like the veteran GM squeezing the rookie GM a bit to me.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by flamesgod

I don’t think he has a bad eye for talent at all. I think it’s a rookie GM, and he panicked and pulled the trigger too early. Love the Conman, but he got worked on this one.

Last year Chycrun who is younger, had term, and profiles as a better overall player, went for a 1st-round pick in 2023 NHL Draft, a 2nd-round pick in the 2024 NHL Draft and a 2nd-round pick in the 2026 NHL Draft.

How is this deal any different? As a rental are you suggesting Hanifin should have fetched more than Chycrun? If you look at that deal alone, Conroy did better to land a player that is said to be a 4/5 potential now in Miromanov than whatever value another pick may have had. The only factor would be kicking the draft picks down the road somewhat more, but that is a bit of a plus anyway as this draft is not exactly looking stout and the Flames already have a lot of picks this year.

[devo22]

it still blows my mind that a defenseman like Noah didn't have more value, even as a pure rental. Thanks Pat Brisson, I guess.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Bonded

Lindholm is a very close comparable and he was traded for a 1st, two seconds, and filler. He then extended immediately with the Bruins. The issue is that the Flames weren’t proactive and traded him at the deadline.

Hopefully they do better with the next set of players they trade.

Hronek is a more recent comparable and he returned:

Hronek (38 points in 60 games at the time of the trade)
4th round pick

For

Conditional 1st (worse of the Canucks 2 firsts)
2nd round Pick

So it's kind of in line with that...with the big issue being the 2nd is conditional and could be a 3rd instead of a guaranteed first.

So in the end it feels like it should have landed somewhere between a 1st and a 2nd (Hronek) and a 1st and 2 2nds (Lindholm/Chychrun)...so it's the 2nd being conditional that causes the trade to be underwhelming IMO

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by dirk diggler

didnt Ottawa get an additional pick once Karlson resigned in SJ?

The CBA was reworked after the 2019-2020 season I think, and those types of conditions around adding picks if a player resigns were eliminated.

For this deal, I almost prefer Vegas trades that 2025 pick in the next two days and exposes the 2026 pick. That's frankly the best chance to have something go bad and have that pick become more valuable. Look how badly Flames fans are now sweating out the conditions on that Monahan pick.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by devo22

it still blows my mind that a defenseman like Noah didn't have more value, even as a pure rental. Thanks Pat Brisson, I guess.

I cannot remember who it was now but a poster on here was a flight with a Columbus pro scout and he said they didn’t like how Hanifin played and wouldn’t want to sign him. I think it was his playstyle. Maybe that sentiment was common in the league.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by RedHot25

Ryan Leslie on the Fan just now: Tampa. It was just Tampa, in terms of the only team he would sign an extension with.

So, in terms of trading, this likely needs to be looked as trading a rental.

I’m not surprised . The sign and trade looks good on paper but it really doesn’t happen where a team trading said player gets value back with an extension in place. These players have the right to dictate who they will sign and play for for the next 7-8 years .

Think it’s time for conroy to implement a new strategy when trading players like hanifin. Trade him at least the summer before. If not , I would tell player playing last year of his contract out that you will be traded to a team as a rental. I would tell all teams that he is up for grabs as a rental and they can’t talk to agent or player about extension until after the trade is complete . You have to think some teams shied away thinking Tampa was going to get him no matter what. Just spitballing.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by RedHot25

Ryan Leslie on the Fan just now: Tampa. It was just Tampa, in terms of the only team he would sign an extension with.

So, in terms of trading, this likely needs to be looked as trading a rental.

So maybe Conroy got a little petty and traded him to a different team for a deferred pick when Tampa didn’t step up their offer. Burn a year for Hanifin

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

You would hope CP will learn a lesson from this UFA sell-off. That 95 per cent of rumoured deals are wildly unrealistic speculation. The NHL market is clinical and calculating, and GMs can’t use bargaining skillz to extract more assets from other teams. And top prospects are almost never traded anymore unless it’s for another top prospect.

But who are we kidding. It will happen against next season. Fans will speculate about turning Mangiapane into a 1st and one of a team’s better prospects. That speculation will transform into a rumoured deal. Posters who suggest realistic returns will be ridiculed and dogpiled. And when Mangiapane ends up returning a 2nd and a 4th, people will complain that Conroy should have traded harder.

Pretty much nailed it.

People are working themselves over a lather over this and the funny part is that it has nothing to do with how Conroy is performing and everything to do with them struggling to cope with the gap between how they believe things should be and how things actually are.

The conditions are fine. Anyone complaining about the conditions at this point is outing themselves as someone who doesn’t have a clue. They’re incredibly simple, and only serve to benefit the Flames as time goes on.

The return otherwise? It is what it is. If you believe it’s underwhelming, you read too much CP and worked yourselves up over fever dreams of top prospects and multiple 1sts (I did too, nothing wrong with that, but you just have to accept that it sucks when it turns out your expectations were unreasonable instead of crying about it being someone else’s fault). As multiple posters have shared already, when you actually compare this trade to others of a similar situation (top 3 D, UFA, etc) it’s impossible to complain about.

The reason people are upset is because they convinced themselves this would somehow be different than every other trade like this, and it wasn’t. Cliff’s right, it should be a lesson on measured expectations, but the same people are going to get worked up over fantasy trades next time, too.

[SuperMatt18]

Hmm would love to know what the Tampa offer was in that case.

Seems really weird that Hanifin wouldn't have had other teams like Boston or Florida on his list...he seems to have no real connection to Tampa either

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Think it’s time for conroy to implement a new strategy when trading players like hanifin. Trade him at least the summer before. If not , I would tell player playing last year of his contract out that you will be traded to a team as a rental. I would tell all teams that he is up for grabs as a rental and they can’t talk to agent or player about extension until after the trade is complete . You have to think some teams shied away thinking Tampa was going to get him no matter what. Just spitballing.

To your point, wasn't there a deal with Pittsburgh at the draft last year for Hanifin? Seemed like a poor one then, but he probably should have taken it, assuming it was legit.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

I really don't see how anyone could consider this anything but a terrible return and a young GM being worked over.

This is such a silly take. GM’s don’t negotiate one to one. There’s a whole team on each side crunching numbers and making valuations. The fact Conroy is new to the role had no bearing on what he was offered.

Any team that thought Hanifin was worth more than the Vegas offer could have had Hanifin. The fact no team offered more means no team valued him higher. It would be idiotic of a team to pass on a player they liked at the cost they were willing to part with because they were playing games with the opposing GM.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Bonded

So maybe Conroy got a little petty and traded him to a different team for a deferred pick when Tampa didn’t step up their offer. Burn a year for Hanifin

……..???

I’m sure he took the best offer.

[flamesgod]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

Last year Chycrun who is younger, had term, and profiles as a better overall player, went for a 1st-round pick in 2023 NHL Draft, a 2nd-round pick in the 2024 NHL Draft and a 2nd-round pick in the 2026 NHL Draft.

How is this deal any different? As a rental are you suggesting Hanifin should have fetched more than Chycrun? If you look at that deal alone, Conroy did better to land a player that is said to be a 4/5 potential now in Miromanov than whatever value another pick may have had. The only factor would be kicking the draft picks down the road somewhat more, but that is a bit of a plus anyway as this draft is not exactly looking stout and the Flames already have a lot of picks this year.

Wasn’t the first round pick like 12th overall? A lot of it has to do with the conditions for me. I’m not a fan of them. I’m willing to acknowledge they could work in our favour. But it could just as easily be a pick you wait to make in the 26 draft thats in the 25-32 range. Not a fan of that.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Hronek is a more recent comparable and he returned:

Hronek (38 points in 60 games at the time of the trade)
4th round pick

For

Conditional 1st (worse of the Canucks 2 firsts)
2nd round Pick

So it's kind of in line with that...with the big issue being the 2nd is conditional and could be a 3rd instead of a guaranteed first.

So in the end it feels like it should have landed somewhere between a 1st and a 2nd (Hronek) and a 1st and 2 2nds (Lindholm/Chychrun)...so it's the 2nd being conditional that causes the trade to be underwhelming IMO

But Hronek again, like the Chycrun deal, had term, is younger and profiles as a better offensive player. Hanifin is having a good year, but he's not a top producer historically and is a rental that sounds like he's going to be a big problem to try and sign.

Nothing wrong with this deal for the Flames. They now have 10 picks (including 4 firsts and 3 seconds) in the first three rounds of the next two drafts. They are stacking the deck to have a huge influx of young players and possibly have assets to flip in their own trades.

From that angle alone, you can see it's smart to not put all your eggs in the 2024 draft, which is not exactly the deepest.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

……..???

I’m sure he took the best offer.

As in Tampa offered basically the same and instead of being nice and getting Hanifin the extra year, he opted to send him to Vegas.

[devo22]

Hanifin/Brisson make it clear he'd only re-sign in Tampa -> Tampa knows this and lowballs Calgary -> Calgary looks at teams that view him as a rental and takes the best deal instead of gifting him to Tampa

makes sense, no?

[traptor]

Conroy got worked pretty hard here. The conditions are abit demeaning.
Monahan got a comparable return...

I would feel alot better if it was a 2024 1st or 2025 1st + 2nd


Oh well it was still better then re-signing him.

I hope this team is very honest with themselves and what they are over the next few years.