Alberta Politics & Government Thread 3.0

[darockwilder]

Originally Posted by Izzle

She made a comment about how the NDP - liberal coalition voted to triple the carbon tax. But here's the thing, the carbon tax currently is at $50 per tonne. It's set to increase by $15 every year till it reaches $170/tonne by year 2030. That tripling happens gradually over the next 8 years. But conservatives imply that it's going to triple next year. That's the kind of disingenuous politick-talk that she likes to go head first in. The sole reason to say that it's tripling is to keep the base angry.

Yeah, when she said that even though I have no knowledge of what is actually going on with the carbon tax I thought to myself "hmm, I wonder how true this is? Could it be misleading?". I guess it kind of was.

[Manhattanboy]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

Can a conservative tell me the appeal of Danielle Smith please.

(no snarky answers on conversatives behalf please, I want to know the answer, not left wingers venting angrily).

Her name is easy to pronounce?

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Izzle

She made a comment about how the NDP - liberal coalition voted to triple the carbon tax. But here's the thing, the carbon tax currently is at $50 per tonne. It's set to increase by $15 every year till it reaches $170/tonne by year 2030. That tripling happens gradually over the next 8 years. But conservatives imply that it's going to triple next year. That's the kind of disingenuous politick-talk that she likes to go head first in. The sole reason to say that it's tripling is to keep the base angry.

The problem isn’t what she says, it’s that people blindly believe it.

[Derek Sutton]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Yeah. I don’t understand that perspective. What changed negatively in your life when the NDP were in power?

Not much. Can’t think of anything really. And honestly, for that matter not much impacted me directly from UCP either for what it’s worth I guess, that i directly noticed in my life. Maybe the COVID stuff but I dunno, I’m not really super convinced the NDP would have nailed that either. It was kinda an unwinnable situation for any government.

Originally Posted by Fuzz

If people think it through, they'd recognize this wasn't the fault of the NDP. It was a global issue. It was also an inevitable fundamental shift in the Alberta oil industry, with consolidation and a refocusing on big players. This began after the previous oil crash, and was hastened by the collapse in prices.

But hey, easier to blame the NDP.

Who blamed the NDP? Read the question. “What changed negatively in your life when the NDP was in power”? 10’s of 1000’s of job loses occurred, I would say that’s pretty negative. Was it a result of the NDP running the province? We will never know, but timing wise the mass job loses are directly line up with the NDP in power.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Derek Sutton

Who blamed the NDP? Read the question. “What changed negatively in your life when the NDP was in power”? 10’s of 1000’s of job loses. Was it a result of the NDP? We will never know, but timing wise the mass job loses are directly linked to the NDP in power.

That's just a conclusion you draw on your own, not one based on facts. The PC's would have overseen the same conditions. Some things are out of control of the province.

[Derek Sutton]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

That's just a conclusion you draw on your own, not one based on facts. The PC's would have overseen the same conditions. Some things are out of control of the province.

Except times lines are facts…. There were mass lay offs while the NDP were in power. Now you can argue if it was because of their policy or not. But you cannot argue about the timing.

[Izzle]

Originally Posted by darockwilder

Yeah, when she said that even though I have no knowledge of what is actually going on with the carbon tax I thought to myself "hmm, I wonder how true this is? Could it be misleading?". I guess it kind of was.

Currently the carbon tax is $50/ tonne. According to the Fuel Charge Rates on the www.Canada.ca website this $50/tonne translates to $0.1105/litre for gasoline (I've used gasoline since that is immediately viewable for the consumer. The website also has other charge rates for other types of fuel).

With current gas prices at $1.70 per litre, cut 11 cents from it and it drops to $1.59 per liter. This 11 cent charge is the threshold for gas being affordable? Yay, fuel prices are cheap at $1.59?? What this means that, there are larger Macro economic factors at play for the current higher gas prices.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Derek Sutton

Except times lines are facts…. There were mass lay offs while the NDP were in power. Now you can argue if it was because of their policy or not. But you cannot argue about the timing.

So what point are you trying to make?

[KTrain]

Originally Posted by Derek Sutton

Except times lines are facts…. There were mass lay offs while the NDP were in power. Now you can argue if it was because of their policy or not. But you cannot argue about the timing.

There were mass layoffs the last couple years as well. While the UCP were in power. They should be punted for it.

You could argue whether it was because of the pandemic or not but you cannot argue about the timing.

[BlackArcher101]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

Can a conservative tell me the appeal of Danielle Smith please.

(no snarky answers on conversatives behalf please, I want to know the answer, not left wingers venting angrily).

I was recently at an event and politics came up (god I wish it wouldn't), and turned out there was quite a few Danielle and PP supporters there. I didn't really want to question them directly because I didn't wish to participate, but from hearing them talk about either person, they were two common themes. One was they are willing to speak out and do what needs to be done. The other is that they love how they are pushing the limits. The first I can understand if their viewpoint on individuality vs greater good, along with other topics aligns with theirs, but the second... it seemed they would get super excited anytime mentioned how much the "other side" hated Danielle or PP. Like there was some vindication in supporting that politician all because someone else disagreed. It actually seemed to strengthen their belief in that politician.
Never at any time did I hear anything about the future, plans or ideas either had, it was only how it pushed the buttons of others.

Disruption is the new thing that people will get behind. Same thing as the hardcore Musk followers.

[Izzle]

Originally Posted by Derek Sutton

Except times lines are facts…. There were mass lay offs while the NDP were in power. Now you can argue if it was because of their policy or not. But you cannot argue about the timing.

Horribly simplistic take on your part.

"I was born in 1972. Canada won the summit series. One can argue that Canada won because of me being born or not. But one cannot argue about the timing"

Get outta here with that disingenuous reasoning.

[TorqueDog]

Post hoc, ergo propter hoc.

[Ozy_Flame]

If the suggestion was that the NDP might have been the reason for oil crashing, that is just ludicrous.

Among other things that led to the 2014/2015 crash beyond just Alberta:

- Strengthening in the value of the U.S. dollar;
- OPEC retained production levels;
- Growing levels oil production and inventory
- The weakening global economy
- The removal of sanctions against Iran, which led them to start exporting oil again.


I mean I guess we could add the Alberta NDP to that list of calamities, but you'd have to provide proof the crash was done by a bunch of Canadian provincial socialists.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

If the suggestion was that the NDP might have been the reason for oil crashing, that is just ludicrous.

Among other things that led to the 2014/2015 crash beyond just Alberta:

- Strengthening in the value of the U.S. dollar;
- OPEC retained production levels;
- Growing levels oil production and inventory
- The weakening global economy
- The removal of sanctions against Iran, which led them to start exporting oil again.


I mean I guess we could add the Alberta NDP to that list of calamities, but you'd have to provide proof the crash was done by a bunch of Canadian provincial socialists.

Sure, there are global factors and I wouldn't ignore those. How about the idea of a royalty review thrown in for good measure? Or how about the appointment of Tzeporah Berman to the oilsands advisory committee?

I feel like the NDP gets a pass for the global issues, because they obviously can't control the OPEC output and things of that nature. I'm not convinced that those two decisions are a great response to that issue though.

And this thread is hilarious. I said that the WRP and NDP are polar opposites and the response is basically "they're closer than you think".

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by Slava

Sure, there are global factors and I wouldn't ignore those. How about the idea of a royalty review thrown in for good measure? Or how about the appointment of Tzeporah Berman to the oilsands advisory committee?

I feel like the NDP gets a pass for the global issues, because they obviously can't control the OPEC output and things of that nature. I'm not convinced that those two decisions are a great response to that issue though.

And this thread is hilarious. I said that the WRP and NDP are polar opposites and the response is basically "they're closer than you think".

You're telling on yourself for being totally clueless to policy and politics in Alberta if you're going to suggest that the NDP is as far left as the WRP is right. This is so detached from reality I have to wonder if you're just looking to argue with people instead of actually discuss politics.

[craigwd]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

Can a conservative tell me the appeal of Danielle Smith please.

(no snarky answers on conversatives behalf please, I want to know the answer, not left wingers venting angrily).

Way back in the day I supported DS for leadership of the "Wildrose Alliance" and that was because she was a fresh face among all of the dinosaurs around her vying to run the province.


I was also impressed with how open she was to inclusivity within the party and how she was pro 2SLGBTQQ+ and wanted Alberta to be the same........times change.



It's why I never say "I always vote........"

[Slava]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

You're telling on yourself for being totally clueless to policy and politics in Alberta if you're going to suggest that the NDP is as far left as the WRP is right. This is so detached from reality I have to wonder if you're just looking to argue with people instead of actually discuss politics.

Forget the left/right characterization for a second and just look at the policies and ideals. Where do you think they have some common ground? You can't use platitudes like "making Alberta a better place" or whatever. Seriously, they're pretty far-removed from each other.

[PsYcNeT]

They both engage in cronyism! So there's that.

[GranteedEV]

Outside of Notley's brief stint, I haven't like an Alberta Premier since Klein

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Outside of Notley's brief stint, I haven't like an Alberta Premier since Klein

Cool Story Bro, Klein, used to come into my rugby club's clubhouse after the bars closed to keep drinking when he was mayor.