2023/2024 Trade Rumors and Speculation Thread

[Redrum]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Hanifin would be 35. That’s not late 30’s.

Cale Makar will be 29 when he’s up for a contract. Wonder which dumbass GM is going to sign him to an 8 year deal.

Did you read the post you quoted?

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Poor take.

You can’t build a winner around Anderson and Hanifin? Why? Weren’t the Flames contenders two years ago with largely the same D-core? Good players are good players. You don’t get rid of them unless it actually makes you better, or you’re forced to.

I don’t think these conclusions your jumping to are as simple as you like to think.

No they weren't. That team didn't go anywhere in the play-offs.

When was the last team to win a Cup that had its best defenseman at the level of Hanifin or Andersson? I guess we could try to break history and do it but unlikely that you are going to win a Cup with that level of defenseman, you would need to be pretty strong in the other areas to make up for it and we show no signs of doing that either.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Why would the Flames need to retain on Markstrom? A less proven Kuemper was traded for more than that package at a higher salary than Markstrom would be in that deal.

Just because something happened once doesn’t mean it will happen again.

Kuemper went for what one team was willing to pay at that moment. If Markstrom is traded it will be for what some other team is willing to pay at that moment.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Redrum

Did you read the post you quoted?

‘flames cannot continyto sign players that take them into their late 30’s’.

We’re talking about Hanifin, no?

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Spurs

No they weren't. That team didn't go anywhere in the play-offs.

When was the last team to win a Cup that had its best defenseman at the level of Hanifin or Andersson? I guess we could try to break history and do it but unlikely that you are going to win a Cup with that level of defenseman, you would need to be pretty strong in the other areas to make up for it and we show no signs of doing that either.

They weren’t contenders? To be clear if we dug up articles from 21/22 headed into the playoffs you wouldn’t find several reporters/analysts stating the Flames were not contenders? I don’t think so. They were widely considered contenders is what I think you would find.

Also, several, ie most, contenders lose in the playoffs.

Nor am I suggesting that just because the Flames have Hanifin and Anderson does that preclude them from acquiring a better D-man.


Some of you guys are pretty eager to leap to pretty flimsy conclusions.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by TOfan

They weren’t contenders? To be clear if we dug up articles from 21/22 headed into the playoffs you wouldn’t find several reporters/analysts stating the Flames were not contenders? I don’t think so. They were widely considered contenders is what I think you would find.

You're talking to Spurs. Spurs starts from the assumption that the Flames are never contenders, never have been, never will be; and then accepts or rejects all data based on how well they fit this predetermined narrative.

This is what Spurs calls ‘factual’. Actually taking all the data into account is ‘homerism’.

[Redrum]

Originally Posted by TOfan

‘flames cannot continyto sign players that take them into their late 30’s’.

We’re talking about Hanifin, no?

About the contention window. That's kind of the main thing. We don't have one now, nor do we know when we'll have one since we don't have much for high end prospects. Flames are kind of like a small business with no money OR stock right now. They can't even retool since that requires you to have at least something to latch on to desperately and build around.

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by TOfan

They weren’t contenders? To be clear if we dug up articles from 21/22 headed into the playoffs you wouldn’t find several reporters/analysts stating the Flames were not contenders? I don’t think so. They were widely considered contenders is what I think you would find.

Also, several, ie most, contenders lose in the playoffs.

Nor am I suggesting that just because the Flames have Hanifin and Anderson does that preclude them from acquiring a better D-man.


Some of you guys are pretty eager to leap to pretty flimsy conclusions.

No they weren't, look at the results on the ice not articles by hack journalists.

And the team didn't just lose in the play-offs, they lost fairly early, in a short series to a pretty mediocre team. They followed it up by missing the play-offs the following two years.

Noah Hanifin and Rasmus Andersson have been on the Flames together for 5 years, plus this one. In that time we have won 1 play-off series and missed the play-offs 3 times, likely 4 by the end of this year.

If you look at that and say that you have confidence that a team with those two as the top defensemen are likely to be a contender you are putting a lot of faith in the players around them.

There is nothing flimsy about looking at the teams that have won the Cup and the level of player they have and see that Hanifin and Andersson are not it, it is not flimsy to look at the results when those two have been on the team and see that hasn't been good enough and it isn't flimsy to look at the Flames situation in terms of current talent, prospects and ability to add players going forward and see that they will need a ton of luck (which is a terrible way to build a team) to build a team around them that can compete for the Cup.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Redrum

About the contention window. That's kind of the main thing. We don't have one now, nor do we know when we'll have one since we don't have much for high end prospects. Flames are kind of like a small business with no money OR stock right now. They can't even retool since that requires you to have at least something to latch on to desperately and build around.

I think you’re undervaluing what the flames have in terms of assets.

[Moneyhands23]

https://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eklu...zcast/1/124013


Guess markstrom isn't being moved.

[Shazam]

Good lord he's still around?

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Moneyhands23

https://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eklu...zcast/1/124013


Guess markstrom isn't being moved.

At least not to the Devils or Sabres (although those 2 teams definitely have some great assets) let’s hope this is one of those times that he throws crap at the wall and it sticks

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Spurs

No they weren't, look at the results on the ice not articles by hack journalists.

And the team didn't just lose in the play-offs, they lost fairly early, in a short series to a pretty mediocre team. They followed it up by missing the play-offs the following two years.

Noah Hanifin and Rasmus Andersson have been on the Flames together for 5 years, plus this one. In that time we have won 1 play-off series and missed the play-offs 3 times, likely 4 by the end of this year.

If you look at that and say that you have confidence that a team with those two as the top defensemen are likely to be a contender you are putting a lot of faith in the players around them.

There is nothing flimsy about looking at the teams that have won the Cup and the level of player they have and see that Hanifin and Andersson are not it, it is not flimsy to look at the results when those two have been on the team and see that hasn't been good enough and it isn't flimsy to look at the Flames situation in terms of current talent, prospects and ability to add players going forward and see that they will need a ton of luck (which is a terrible way to build a team) to build a team around them that can compete for the Cup.

Again, I’m not saying that if the Flames keep both Hanifin and Anderson that they would be the best two defence men on the team for the duration of their contracts. Fact is, they are both good D-men.

Would you consider the Panthers as a contender? Who’s their ‘elite D’? Ekblad? Montour?

[Flames1217]

Originally Posted by Spurs

No they weren't. That team didn't go anywhere in the play-offs.

Come on man....

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Something to consider with all of these projected trades is the potential for retention. Does anyone know how many trade the Flames have retained salary on? ONE. When they traded Rittich to the Leafs they retained $1.35M in cap hit, which is around $400K in real money. That's it. If retention is used, and that is a big if at this point, they are going to use it with minimal impact in real money. I find it very hard to believe they would retain on Markstrom as he has multiple years left on his contract and Edwards would not be happy paying a guy to play for an other team. It just isn't who he is. If retention is used it will be on expiring contracts where the real money is minimal and helps get a player under the other team's cap for the remainder of this season. That will be it. That is consistent with the business practices of the club and until they retain significant amount in any deal, even that seems unlikely. Retention is a great thing to think about, but to date, this team has not been willing to use the mechanism. I expect they will take back equal contracts rather than flat out retain. It's what they have done in the past and is their expected behavior.

You could certainly be right on Markstrom and other contracts with additional years.

But don't agree on the UFAs.

You don't walk out saving a retention spot on the Zadorov deal if it's not a serious conversation internally. Plus we heard rumblings of Edwards oking retention if the return is better.

So I think they retain if they have to, but clearly won't if they don't.

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Again, I’m not saying that if the Flames keep both Hanifin and Anderson that they would be the best two defence men on the team for the duration of their contracts. Fact is, they are both good D-men.

Would you consider the Panthers as a contender? Who’s their ‘elite D’? Ekblad? Montour?

No I don't consider the Panthers a contender.

How do you think we would bring in a better defenseman without luck considering the players we have on the roster, the players we have in our system and the likely draft picks and trade pieces we have going forward?

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by Flames1217

Come on man....

What play-off success did they have?

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Spurs

No I don't consider the Panthers a contender.

How do you think we would bring in a better defenseman without luck considering the players we have on the roster, the players we have in our system and the likely draft picks and trade pieces we have going forward?

Don’t know. I don’t have a crystal ball and it seems like a futile exercise to try and project where the Flames might be in two months from now let alone two-three-four-eight years from now.

You seem more than willing to pretend like you do know where the Flames will be.

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Don’t know. I don’t have a crystal ball and it seems like a futile exercise to try and project where the Flames might be in two months from now let alone two-three-four-eight years from now.

You seem more than willing to pretend like you do know where the Flames will be.

I don't think there is much pretending when you look at what the Flames current talent is on the team and in prospects. You then look at where elite talent comes from and then look at where the Flames are likely to do be drafting especially if they are keeping certainly players and see that the chances we are adding a defenseman better than either of those guys without drafting high is unlikely and that is would rely on luck in getting one late, which I will always say is a bad way to build a team.

I also don't think it is futile at all to project where the team is going, fans in every sport for every team do it all the time. It is what every team in the world does with their own team.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Don’t know. I don’t have a crystal ball and it seems like a futile exercise to try and project where the Flames might be in two months from now let alone two-three-four-eight years from now.

You seem more than willing to pretend like you do know where the Flames will be.

This is literally Conroy's job