Well, sure it is, since assists are quite varied. That’s why people talk about primary and secondary assists. Just watch them play if you want to see which guy has more offensive skill. And if you want more, look at their junior careers (Dvorak being a few years closer to his as well).
Over the last 5 years Dvorak has 79 assists, 51 of them primary assists for 64.5%.
Over the last 5 years Danault has 138 assists, 82 of them primary for 59.4%.
While Dvorak's got the higher primary%, Danault has almost 1.74 times the assists of Dvorak.
Yes, Dvorak is a good offensive player, and yes he has a better shot that Danault. To this point in his career he has not had "way better offense" than Danault at the NHL level.
Again, not suggesting I'd take Danault over Dvorak. Nor am I suggesting that Dvorak won't join a new team and pop offensively. I'm just simply pointing out that to this point in his career, Dvorak has not shown at the NHL level that he has "way better offense" than Danault.
I live in Phoenix. I watch the Cryotes all the time because of the freaking blackouts they enforce and I get a lot of tickets thrown my way. I know this team and its players quite well thank you.
I also live in Arizona and have watched Garland play when I can, and you are dead wrong on him.
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Over the last 5 years Dvorak has 79 assists, 51 of them primary assists for 64.5%.
Over the last 5 years Danault has 138 assists, 82 of them primary for 59.4%.
While Dvorak's got the higher primary%, he also has slight more than 1/2 the assists that Danault has.
Yes, Dvorak is a good offensive player, and yes he has a better shot that Danault, to this point in his career he has not had "way better offense" than Danault.
Again, not suggesting I'd take Danault over Dvorak. Nor am I suggesting that Dvorak won't join a new team and pop offensively. I'm just simply pointing out that to this point in his career, Dvorak has not shown at the NHL level that he has "way better offense" than Danault.
I have watched them play and I really like both players.
But I also really like Backlund and that's probably unpopular around here.
Honestly I think Danault is incredibly under rated. He's a very good play maker and he constantly plays against other teams top players and comes out on the positive end more often than not. He's not a sexy player or a true #1 but he's a shutdown guy with an underrated offensive game.
I also live in Arizona and have watched Garland play when I can, and you are dead wrong on him.
Here's exactly what I said about him. "Garland is a decent player. He reminds me of Derek Ryan out there, except he doesn't go to the dirty areas as often. As a goal scorer, he's a garbage man. This past season he got a ton of breaks that resulted in goals, otherwise he would have been held to single digits for goals. What's worse, he's a perimeter player and does most of his best work behind the goal line or off the half wall. He's a good passer, but you need a finisher with him, which we sorely lack."
If there was only a way to prove this?
So what do we see a lot of in his highlights from the year? Scoring garbage goals where he catches a lucky break or has the gaping net in front of him after someone else's work. Where is he mostly driving his offense from? Off the half wall, down low on or beneath the goal line. He makes some good passes, but they are from the perimeter or in areas where he isn't a threat. But then again, the video is probably dead wrong. Probably doctored to make him look bad.
I still dont understand how people can think Dvorak is better than Monahan.
You guys are going to be severely disappointed, I cant think of one area of the game where Christian is better.... and I know how much people have turned on Monahan here.
Now some are saying Monahan + Rasmus for Dvorak and OEL... Jesus Christ we're in trouble.
I know people want change, I do too but lets hold the fort for a second and think about what were asking for here.
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Monahan’s future really depends on the surgery wild card. 100% or close to it, yeah, he’s better. The mobility and finish issues of this year - nope. And I like Monahan.
Monahan’s future really depends on the surgery wild card. 100% or close to it, yeah, he’s better. The mobility and finish issues of this year - nope. And I like Monahan.
I'd rather take the risk myself and see how Monahan plays when he comes back, as opposed to selling low and paying someone else to take the risk. I'm not opposed in principle to trading the guy, but right now the timing would be awful.
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I'd rather take the risk myself and see how Monahan plays when he comes back, as opposed to selling low and paying someone else to take the risk. I'm not opposed in principle to trading the guy, but right now the timing would be awful.
Was it last year or the year before that we were in the exact same position with him. Revealed he was playing hurt, give him another go...
Sunrise, sunset.
Was it last year or the year before that we were in the exact same position with him. Revealed he was playing hurt, give him another go...
Sunrise, sunset.
So what's your solution? Get rid of him for a 3rd-line forward? Because that's the calibre of trade suggestions I've been seeing lately.
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Here's exactly what I said about him. "Garland is a decent player. He reminds me of Derek Ryan out there, except he doesn't go to the dirty areas as often. As a goal scorer, he's a garbage man. This past season he got a ton of breaks that resulted in goals, otherwise he would have been held to single digits for goals. What's worse, he's a perimeter player and does most of his best work behind the goal line or off the half wall. He's a good passer, but you need a finisher with him, which we sorely lack."
If there was only a way to prove this?
So what do we see a lot of in his highlights from the year? Scoring garbage goals where he catches a lucky break or has the gaping net in front of him after someone else's work. Where is he mostly driving his offense from? Off the half wall, down low on or beneath the goal line. He makes some good passes, but they are from the perimeter or in areas where he isn't a threat. But then again, the video is probably dead wrong. Probably doctored to make him look bad.
I think you’re not 100% wrong but you’re kind of downplaying his strengths here.
Garland is player that’s not an elite finisher, he’s not going to beat with his shot from far out…that’s true. But he’s able to score those “garbage goals” because he does go to the dirty areas when the puck isn’t on his stick, and is good at finding that soft spot in the goal scoring areas to get those tap ins. That’s a skill.
When the puck is on his stick he does tend to stick to the areas you’re talking about. He will play more on the half wall and beneath the goal line but that’s where most playmakers play when they have the puck on their stick. He’s not afraid to take the puck to the net when he has a seem to do so though.
To me he’s similar to Mangiapane a lot in these ways.
Not the biggest guy but not afraid to go to the dirty areas. Not the best finishers so need to generate a high volume of chances to get their goals. Have some puck skills with the puck on their stick as playmakers on the half wall and behind the net but maybe not their biggest skill. Both can tend to fall down a lot.
Last edited by SuperMatt18; 07-22-2021 at 12:09 AM.
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I still dont understand how people can think Dvorak is better than Monahan.
You guys are going to be severely disappointed, I cant think of one area of the game where Christian is better.... and I know how much people have turned on Monahan here.
Now some are saying Monahan + Rasmus for Dvorak and OEL... Jesus Christ we're in trouble.
I know people want change, I do too but lets hold the fort for a second and think about what were asking for here.
People turn on all our guys if they have rough stretches.
Popular ones now are Tkachuk, Monahan, Andersson, Dube and Valimaki.
Others that have since gotten back into the good graces but were also being forced out of town at one point are Gaudreau and Hanifin.
I can’t say what I really want to say but I will say it is quite frustrating to continually read as a more levelheaded fan.
I should pay attention more to the culprits because maybe it’s not as bad as I think and it’s just a faction of the fan base that are the most vocal…
I’m just glad I’m not alone in thinking we need to be smart about the changes we make. I’m mad at the results too but I don’t want to make trades that will just set us even further back.
Reactionary fans aren’t the GM, thank goodness…
Bringing up the GM might set some off so I better end things there haha.
I still dont understand how people can think Dvorak is better than Monahan.
You guys are going to be severely disappointed, I cant think of one area of the game where Christian is better.... and I know how much people have turned on Monahan here.
Now some are saying Monahan + Rasmus for Dvorak and OEL... Jesus Christ we're in trouble.
I know people want change, I do too but lets hold the fort for a second and think about what were asking for here.
I am a big Dvorak fan since I am also a huge London Knights fan. The chemistry he had with Tkachuk was simply magic. I really believe there is more to Dvorak than what he has shown in the desert. Is he better than Monahan at scoring goals? No. I think he is better though in every other area. Also, he is healthy and not broken. Monahan for Dvorak...I do that every day and twice on Sunday.
I am a big Dvorak fan since I am also a huge London Knights fan. The chemistry he had with Tkachuk was simply magic. I really believe there is more to Dvorak than what he has shown in the desert. Is he better than Monahan at scoring goals? No. I think he is better though in every other area. Also, he is healthy and not broken. Monahan for Dvorak...I do that every day and twice on Sunday.
I dont have the stats in front of me, but I remember reading them on here before some time ago. In almost all cases of "former linemates in junior" the chemistry almost never translates at all so I don't value that at all.
Would be a terrible trade no matter how you look at it.
Downgrade in almost every aspect.
I dont have the stats in front of me, but I remember reading them on here before some time ago. In almost all cases of "former linemates in junior" the chemistry almost never translates at all so I don't value that at all.
Would be a terrible trade no matter how you look at it. Downgrade in almost every aspect.
How so? Goalscoring I will give you. You tell me what Monahan does better than Dvorak besides scoring goals.
How so? Goalscoring I will give you. You tell me what Monahan does better than Dvorak besides scoring goals.
Passing, penalty killing ability, skating (as sad as that sounds), points per game, points in the playoffs. His overall ability to create scoring chances is significantly higher, along with his net front presence being more successful.
His offensive upside is miles ahead of Dvorak, removing what Sean has brought to the Flames and replacing it with anyone less offensively skilled is a downgrade no matter how you look at it.
Were talking a guy who scores almost 30g a year minimum and an avg of 55 pts a season being traded for a guy whos never hit 20g and puts up an avg of 29 pts a year.
Sean is double the offensive threat of a Dvorak and the Flames would be absolutely worse if the trade was 1 for 1
