Is it evil? I’m not involved in the religion, but someone correct me here:
Catholics who believe homosexuality is a sin aren’t hoping gays are damned. If, by some crazy setup I’ll never understand, they actually believe in damnation for sins, they’re not actually evil or malevolent for trying to convince others are they? I’d make the argument that a catholic who believes I’m going to hell, and tries to get me to repent or whatever the hell they call it, that’s not ‘evil’.
The thing that isn’t so clear to me, is who gets to decide whose morals are right or wrong? I think you are bat #### ####ing crazy if you believe or follow any of that, just as a religious person my think I’m eventually going to hell for that belief. I mean obviously the crimes of the church are a separate topic here, as there’s no way to let that #### slide.
But grandpa Joe and Betty Sue think my lifestyle is going to condemn me to hell? If somehow they’ve been indoctrinated to believe that, and only want to see me live a life of reconciliation with God to avoid eternal damnation? Sure, they might be ####ing looney-tunes but malicious? I don’t see it.
It's evil because the Catholic church is just making it up. It's evil to say gay people are going to hell. They're not. There isn't even any such thing as hell. These a-holes are just making #### up at the Vatican and then releasing statements saying god says it's a sin and sinners go to hell.
They are also preying on people they have indoctrinated to believe what they say has any value whatsoever when it doesn't. So you're areligious? What's missing from your life due to not having anyone releasing statements informing you what is or isn't wrong with eternal consequences? Nothing. They are just spreading lies with an authoritative tone and affecting millions/billion who are not actually benefiting from their asinine hot takes.
For your average congregant...are they evil? No, but some of them are being evil on this topic and others like it if they are capable of critical thought, but not exercising it. A thoughtful person is abdicating their responsibility to use reason if they read that statement and think, 'alright, guess gay people are going to hell.'
For your average uneducated sheep that was subjected to religious indoctrination, I think they're stuck with that ideology and it's up to people who can think outside of the constrains of indoctrination to speak up for them.
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It's evil because the Catholic church is just making it up. It's evil to say gay people are going to hell. They're not. There isn't even any such thing as hell. These a-holes are just making #### up at the Vatican and then releasing statements saying god says it's a sin and sinners go to hell.
You don’t think they genuinely believe in sin and the afterlife?
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Originally Posted by fotze
If this day gets you riled up, you obviously aren't numb to the disappointment yet to be a real fan.
A dissident band of Roman Catholic priests leading a disobedience campaign against the Vatican said on Tuesday they would carry on blessing same-sex couples in defiance of Church orders.
The Vatican said on Monday that priests cannot bless same-sex unions and that such blessings are not valid, in a ruling that disappointed gay Catholics who had hoped their Church was becoming more welcoming under Pope Francis.
In some countries, parishes and ministers have begun blessing same-sex unions in lieu of marriage, and there have been calls for bishops to institutionalise de facto such blessings. Conservatives in the 1.3 billion-member Roman Catholic Church have expressed alarm over such practices.
"We members of the Parish Priests Initiative are deeply appalled by the new Roman decree that seeks to prohibit the blessing of same-sex loving couples. This is a relapse into times that we had hoped to have overcome with Pope Francis," the Austrian-based group said in a statement.
"We will -- in solidarity with so many -- not reject any loving couple in the future who ask to celebrate God's blessing, which they experience every day, also in a worship service."
It's evil because the Catholic church is just making it up. It's evil to say gay people are going to hell. They're not. There isn't even any such thing as hell. These a-holes are just making #### up at the Vatican and then releasing statements saying god says it's a sin and sinners go to hell.
They are also preying on people they have indoctrinated to believe what they say has any value whatsoever when it doesn't. So you're areligious? What's missing from your life due to not having anyone releasing statements informing you what is or isn't wrong with eternal consequences? Nothing. They are just spreading lies with an authoritative tone and affecting millions/billion who are not actually benefiting from their asinine hot takes.
For your average congregant...are they evil? No, but some of them are being evil on this topic and others like it if they are capable of critical thought, but not exercising it. A thoughtful person is abdicating their responsibility to use reason if they read that statement and think, 'alright, guess gay people are going to hell.'
For your average uneducated sheep that was subjected to religious indoctrination, I think they're stuck with that ideology and it's up to people who can think outside of the constrains of indoctrination to speak up for them.
You don’t think they genuinely believe in sin and the afterlife?
Are we talking at the Vatican? I don't know. I suspect a lot don't. I don't see how you could study this stuff for a lifetime and conclude it's true. I don't see how you could be part of the decision-making apparatus of men and believe a statement that no doubt would have gone through multiple drafts was somehow divinely inspired. I'm sure some naïve ones do fully believe, but at the higher levels these guys have worked their way up to and given they know how the sausage is made, I just can't see them being full believers.
All of the above is a giant guess, though. Not sure how you'd know for sure, but it'd sure be nice to give them truth serum and ask some questions.
I'm sure some naïve ones do fully believe, but at the higher levels these guys have worked their way up to and given they know how the sausage is made, I just can't see them being full believers.
I definitely disagree with that. I think this is a major problem with respect to talking about religion - the people who don't believe in it don't believe that the people who do believe in it actually believe in it. As a non-believer, it's pretty hard to put yourself in the shoes of a believer, unless you were one previously and have been disabused of those notions.
__________________ "The great promise of the Internet was that more information would automatically yield better decisions. The great disappointment is that more information actually yields more possibilities to confirm what you already believed anyway." - Brian Eno
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Are we talking at the Vatican? I don't know. I suspect a lot don't. I don't see how you could study this stuff for a lifetime and conclude it's true. I don't see how you could be part of the decision-making apparatus of men and believe a statement that no doubt would have gone through multiple drafts was somehow divinely inspired. I'm sure some naïve ones do fully believe, but at the higher levels these guys have worked their way up to and given they know how the sausage is made, I just can't see them being full believers.
All of the above is a giant guess, though. Not sure how you'd know for sure, but it'd sure be nice to give them truth serum and ask some questions.
It is because we as human beings do not by default make decisions on the basis of clear-eyed honest appraisals of facts and evidence. The fact the we require rigorous conditioning just to learn the basics of critical thinking—and even then most fail spectacularly to exercise it—attests to just how unnatural it is to form beliefs through "study." There are all sorts of much more powerful and affective social, cultural, tribal, economic and psychological pressures that inform religious beliefs, foster their development, and ensure their maintenance. Leaders in the Catholic Church may be more well informed than most, but they are in no way immune to the same irrationality that infects humanity.
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Dealing with Everything from Dead Sea Scrolls to Red C Trolls
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Originally Posted by woob
"...harem warfare? like all your wives dressup and go paintballing?"
Just imagine the meltdowns we are going to have when the aliens arrive and tell us the truth about religion and God. You know they are already laughing at us.
Just imagine the meltdowns we are going to have when the aliens arrive and tell us the truth about religion and God. You know they are already laughing at us.
Religious types are gonna lose it.
I'm afraid if the aliens reside in the same physical dimension we do, they won't be able to prove or disprove anything about an afterlife/god/other dimensions.
I’ll listen to any society that can travel light years and make communication with us. If a higher life form told us there was a greater being, I’d think they were maybe on to something.
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No, no…I’m not sloppy, or lazy. This is a sign of the boredom.
I’ll listen to any society that can travel light years and make communication with us. If a higher life form told us there was a greater being, I’d think they were maybe on to something.
Isn't that basically what missionaries did? Pretend they are superior to the aboriginal populations, then tell them "this is the way" and they won't be savages anymore if they follow the word of God?
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Yes but what if their afterlife promises slightly more virgins than any earthbound religion?
Say 75 virgins plus an extra 5 virgins just for converting to the alien religion?
Traditional religions have no chance.
No loving God is offering up any virgins, I mean who the hell wants that drama for eternity? a loving God would know you need three or four been around the block lasses who can cook clean and suck the chrome off a bumper hook possibly at the same time.
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