A Song of Ice and Fire **Spoilers** Now more TV talk!

[RatherDashing]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

They're hinting at Jon being a Targaryen a lot this season.

First they show Littlefinger smirk when Sansa says that Rhaegar raped Lyanna...which wow that sentence seemed a lot creepier than it was meant to.

Barristan has held Rhaegar in high-regard while talked about the Mad King being crazy very openly now.

And just last episode Aemon Targaryen said something like "there's nothing sadder than a Targaryen alone in the world" while cutting to Jon being all like "sup?"

Combine that with Ned and Jon's final conversation that made his mother seem to be important early in the show, I think there's room for non-readers to start picking up on things. It's just that no real reason was given that leaves me skeptical.

There was also a scene back in season 1, in the episode where Ned figured out that Joffrey isn't Robert's son. He is flipping through that book and notices that all of Robert's line have black hair (and dark eyes?), then they flip from a profile shot of Ned to a shot of Jon, who has much darker hair. I thought for a while that the show was going to change it up and make Jon the son of Robert and Lyanna, but I guess they are going with Rhaegar.

[Hemi-Cuda]

Originally Posted by RatherDashing

There was also a scene back in season 1, in the episode where Ned figured out that Joffrey isn't Robert's son. He is flipping through that book and notices that all of Robert's line have black hair (and dark eyes?), then they flip from a profile shot of Ned to a shot of Jon, who has much darker hair. I thought for a while that the show was going to change it up and make Jon the son of Robert and Lyanna, but I guess they are going with Rhaegar.

Ned wouldn't have had to hide the child if it was Robert's though, he was already supposed to marry Lyanna and he had plenty of ####### children already. But if it's Rhaegar's then Ned knew Robert would kill him during the purge of all Targaryens as a direct threat to his rule, and Lyanna probably made him swear to protect John before she died

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

Ned wouldn't have had to hide the child if it was Robert's though, he was already supposed to marry Lyanna and he had plenty of ####### children already. But if it's Rhaegar's then Ned knew Robert would kill him during the purge of all Targaryens as a direct threat to his rule, and Lyanna probably made him swear to protect John before she died

Jon*

[Bobblehead]

There have been differences between the novels and the television show since the first episode of season one. And for just as long, I have been talking about the butterfly effect. Small changes lead to larger changes lead to huge changes. HBO is more than forty hours into the impossible and demanding task of adapting my lengthy (extremely) and complex (exceedingly) novels, with their layers of plots and subplots, their twists and contradictions and unreliable narrators, viewpoint shifts and ambiguities, and a cast of characters in the hundreds.

<snip>

David and Dan and Bryan and HBO are trying to make the best television series that they can.

And over here I am trying to write the best novels that I can.

And yes, more and more, they differ. Two roads diverging in the dark of the woods, I suppose... but all of us are still intending that at the end we will arrive at the same place.

In the meantime, we hope that the readers and viewers both enjoy the journey. Or journeys, as the case may be. Sometimes butterflies grow into dragons.

http://grrm.livejournal.com/427713.html

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

Ned wouldn't have had to hide the child if it was Robert's though, he was already supposed to marry Lyanna and he had plenty of ####### children already. But if it's Rhaegar's then Ned knew Robert would kill him during the purge of all Targaryens as a direct threat to his rule, and Lyanna probably made him swear to protect John before she died

There's references to the promise he swore to Lyanna on her "bed of blood"

[Puckin' Rights!]

Anybody want to speculate on Danaerys and her dragons? As far as I can figure, she is the only rider and has two spares. My best guess is that Tyrion Lannister gets one...

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Puckin' Rights!

Anybody want to speculate on Danaerys and her dragons? As far as I can figure, she is the only rider and has two spares. My best guess is that Tyrion Lannister gets one...

Jon "Targaryen" "raised from the dead" Snow gets one for sure

[Puckin' Rights!]

I wanted to believe John Snow is a targaryen but there's been some information to the contrary. Lyanna had brown hair and the targaryen's have white. His is quite dark.
He may turn out to be the redemption of the men of the wall, considering all the changes he attempted to introduce but currently I believe his soul is bound with ghost and they are north of the wall. Can't wait for book six!
I'm considering a reread for the time being to see if I've missed any hints or foreshadowing the first time around.

[Street Pharmacist]

It's been a while since I've read the last book so pardon the ignorance, but who was the hidden Targaryen child that was supposed to be dead? Surely Danaerys would let him have one?

[Puckin' Rights!]

Ah yes he slipped my mind! Good call on that but I believe he resides with Stannis Baratheon. Melisandre wanted to sacrifice him and use his blood for a major ritual to help Stannis gain the throne. So far she has had to be content using his blood collected by leaching and had used it to kill three people.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by Puckin' Rights!

Ah yes he slipped my mind! Good call on that but I believe he resides with Stannis Baratheon. Melisandre wanted to sacrifice him and use his blood for a major ritual to help Stannis gain the throne. So far she has had to be content using his blood collected by leaching and had used it to kill three people.

No, you're thinking of Mance Rayder's infant son who was sent away with Sam. The Targaryen SP referred to was Dany's baby brother who was supposedly killed by The Mountain in the sack of King's Landing by the Lannisters. Long thought to be dead, he was apparently spirited away and raised in Essos by Jon Connington and is now being promoted as a potential ruler and claimant to the Iron Throne.

Though I think that is just a ruse by Varys and Illyrio.

[Puckin' Rights!]

I'm going to have to brush up on my books here!
But you do agree one of the dragons goes to Tyrion? It just seems obvious to me!

[Puckin' Rights!]

And from what I recall, there were two children melisandre wanted to sacrifice. The first was a boy of roughly eight years old in lord Stannis's care. Davis took that one away before melisandre could kill him. The second was Mance Rayder's child.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by Puckin' Rights!

I'm going to have to brush up on my books here!
But you do agree one of the dragons goes to Tyrion? It just seems obvious to me!

Beats me. I'm half convinced that Dany and the dragons never come to Westeros.

Originally Posted by Puckin' Rights!

And from what I recall, there were two children melisandre wanted to sacrifice. The first was a boy of roughly eight years old in lord Stannis's care. Davis took that one away before melisandre could kill him. The second was Mance Rayder's child.

That first one was just a ####### of Robert's, not a Targaryen. But you're right, Melisandre has been very pro-sacrifice.

[Puckin' Rights!]

Oh they have to to wipe out the walkers with dragon fire! And forge new weapons the same way. Westeros needs dragons, hence they need targaryens ...imo

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

No, you're thinking of Mance Rayder's infant son who was sent away with Sam. The Targaryen SP referred to was Dany's baby brother who was supposedly killed by The Mountain in the sack of King's Landing by the Lannisters. Long thought to be dead, he was apparently spirited away and raised in Essos by Jon Connington and is now being promoted as a potential ruler and claimant to the Iron Throne.

Though I think that is just a ruse by Varys and Illyrio.

Aegon Targaryen, who we are told is Young Griff, was Rhaeger's son. That would make him the older nephew of Daenerys.

The boy that Davos saved was one of Robert's #######s.

Bran was told he was fly, could just mean birds but I'm hoping he does some skin-changing with a dragon - if that counts.

[LanceUppercut]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

Beats me. I'm half convinced that Dany and the dragons never come to Westeros.

Complete speculation time:
She will end up in Westeros. Victarion has his fleet there now that can transport her troops. Drogon is going to roast the leader of the Khalasar that he landed in front of and Daenerys will take control of it and head back to Mereen to clean up the slavers. So quickly, you resolve the Slavers Bay and add more troops to her army, and a waiting method to transport those troops. Sprinkle in news of the Targaryen already in Westeros with an army and she will rush to join him.

Reality: none of this will probably happen and I am completely wrong.

[Puckin' Rights!]

You're Right, Oling (can I call you Oling?) Where is Aegon? I always had the impression that Dany is supposed to return to westeros and marry him.

[Puckin' Rights!]

Ohh I like it, LanceUppercut!

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

Aegon Targaryen, who we are told is Young Griff, was Rhaeger's son. That would make him the older nephew of Daenerys.

Whoops, you're right. Thanks for the correction.