[Rumour] Chris Johnston: Lindholm is interested in staying

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Redrum

So he's going to be our #1C for nine more years?

Who else will be our #1C anytime soon?


Why do you people think the franchise will be more competitive in the late 2020s than it is right now? It seems pretty clear that will be the natural bottoming out part of the lifecycle. Trying to fight that might achieve perpetual mediocrity at the very best.

[Redrum]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

Who else will be our #1C anytime soon?


Why do you people think the franchise will be more competitive in the late 2020s than it is right now? It seems pretty clear that will be the natural bottoming out part of the lifecycle. Trying to fight that might achieve perpetual mediocrity at the very best.

Nobody, because we won't have a choice.

I sure hope it's more competitive, because it's not competitive now. This signing would limit that possibility.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Redrum

Nobody, because we won't have a choice.

I sure hope it's more competitive, because it's not competitive now. This signing would limit that possibility.

What if it is competitive now?

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

Tkachuk is elite. Played first pp and 2nd line from day 1. Also played 1st line and 1st pp the last few years here. He was also top 5 rated in his draft. Who do we have that is Tkachuk?

If coronato got a 1st line 1st pp role. Who’s he playing with? Dube and Pelletier? Lol they all aren’t popping playing up and down the lineup. If they do we move guys. Once again if coronato plays first line and pops and gets paid his linemates are likely Huberdeau and Lindholm. Mangiapane and Kadri likely are on the 2nd line. Really you’re dreaming if you think everyone pops all at once. If they do look out we are a contender

Where the hell did I say that?

As for Tkachuk, he popped in year 3 from 49 to 77 points and could have locked him down at $8.5/9m but didn't have the cap space so Treliving gave him the dumbest bridge ever.

If Coronato or any other player shows elite progression it would sure would be nice not having $9m tied up in another aging player like Lindholm, even Nostradamus wouldn't know if any of our young players will pop to elite let alone you.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

8.5 will be 2nd line money in 6 years.

I really hope were not watching a core of 34 year old Lindholm, 35 year old Weegar, 36 year old Huberdeau, and 38 year old Kadri in 6 years.

[tkflames]

Originally Posted by Locke

The whole Sutter thing is wild to me. It all seems so out of character and makes so little sense.

I've said it before, but either Sutter is experiencing early onset dementia or his actions were those of a man trying to get fired.

Because otherwise the pieces as we know them just dont seem to fit.

How can Sutter coach the team to a great season, win the Jack Adams, everyone loves them and then fast-forward to this absolute s###-Show?

The piece of those tweets that I have a hard time believing is that Lindholm has been here all these years, everything by all appearances has been great and then this one crazy, crappy year absolutely demolishes all Goodwill.

This organization is a goddamned mess and they'd better figure it out.

I don't think it's that complicated. Sutter knows what it takes to win a cup and trains his teams a certain way to do that. Those that have won a cup understand what he is trying to do and that's why he has allies in the room that love him (Lucic, Lewis...etc.). If Regehr had been on this team...he would have been on team Sutter also.

Everything he does: player ice time usage, playing style, intensity training, all of it builds up so that the team performs in the playoffs.

Then you bring in the new highest paid player by nearly double who hasn't won a damn thing, wants to get the easy points like he did in Florida (because all he knows is how to score the easy season points) and Sutter starts turning up the pressure because that is all he knows. Members of the team continue to push back because they think he oversteered their little early season win streak, because Sutter knows the only way to get out of the division is through Edmonton (didn't turn out that way but I understand the thinking). As the losses pile up , the room continues to split between those that believe in the vision, knowing what it takes and those that are always the victim.

Fast forward 8 months...and you start dumping those on the team that knew what it takes in favor of making the highest paid forward and his 2nd in command happy collecting regular season points.

The only decision now is whether you are going to cap hamstring the Coronato/Peltier/Honzek/Zary/new picks from this year generation in 5-8 years with another boat anchor of mediocrity so that in 10-15 years the team can be good. Or if you start unwinding it now and get good again in 5-7 years.

Would love to be proved wrong...but it's a pretty bleak outlook.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Where the hell did I say that?

As for Tkachuk, he popped in year 3 from 49 to 77 points and could have locked him down at $8.5/9m but didn't have the cap space so Treliving gave him the dumbest bridge ever.

If Coronato or any other player shows elite progression it would sure would be nice not having $9m tied up in another aging player like Lindholm, even Nostradamus wouldn't know if any of our young players will pop to elite let alone you.

But that was Treliving who did that and maybe the player played a part in that too. The Flames could have given him $8 mil no problem even with broken Monahan as a #1 center and old Giordano who every was so worried about how his contract would age.

Tkachuk is elite, basically a superstar. If any of our prospects are that good this team does not need to rebuild. We will be contenders.

If 1 of them turns out to be elite there are options to shed cap.

Odds are if any of our prospects play like a Tkachuk his linemates will be Huberdeau and Lindholm and we will have a new elite 1st line.

Shed other guys not your #1 center who rumors to be ok with a fair contract extension.

Backlund - $5.35 mil
Magiapâne - $5.8 mil
Tanev - $4.5 mil
Markstrom - $6 mil

That is over $20 mil and players that our prospects are more likely to replace.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Hackey

I really hope were not watching a core of 34 year old Lindholm, 35 year old Weegar, 36 year old Huberdeau, and 38 year old Kadri in 6 years.

Because you want to watch a team that has

Kadri and Huberdeau and a bunch of rookies right now

Hey we might suck in 6 years so lets suck now. I would be ok with it if I thought the team would go full suck. But I do not think they will so if that is not an option then we need to keep Lindholm

If they suck 6 years from now it might actually make more sense because Kadri could be traded 50% retained and we would have an old team at the bottom with players contracts that are going to expire when the rebuild is done. Makes sense and if the owners want to block us from doing a full tank job they might not have a choice.

[blender]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

8 years is a long time, what happens in a few years when 2 or 3 other kids pop to stardom and our cap space is being held hostage by over 30 players with NMC's?, this is how we lost Tkachuk.

As much as I like Lindholm I just know while we still have Huberdeau and Kadri signed into their late 30's he's not a good fit for this team.

He isn't even signed. Maybe he doesn't want 8 years

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Hackey

I really hope were not watching a core of 34 year old Lindholm, 35 year old Weegar, 36 year old Huberdeau, and 38 year old Kadri in 6 years.

Even if we win a Cup or two on the way there?

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Even if we win a Cup or two on the way there?

With that core we won't even beat deadmonton let alone win a friken cup

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

With that core we won't even beat deadmonton let alone win a friken cup

If I know one thing about watching NHL hockey for 40 years it is that you can't predict things like that. Even yearly there are teams that are projected to be bad that are not and vice versa. Every season.

[traptor]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Even if we win a Cup or two on the way there?

The only thing we have to base the future success of this core is based in last season which was a ####ing tire fire, and it wasn't all sutter, the players share some of that responsibility.

It's understandable why there is so much pessimism towards the capabilities of this current group and relunctance to commit to it for the better part of a decade.

[Redrum]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

If I know one thing about watching NHL hockey for 40 years it is that you can't predict things like that. Even yearly there are teams that are projected to be bad that are not and vice versa. Every season.

I'm hoping for something beyond catching lighting in a bottle, which is what you're talking about. An actual decent team that can compete for something meaningful, outside of a fluke year.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

If I know one thing about watching NHL hockey for 40 years it is that you can't predict things like that. Even yearly there are teams that are projected to be bad that are not and vice versa. Every season.

Yeah there's the odd fluke and team owners depend on those flukes to sell tickets but the fact is 90% of the time the cream rises to the top. And, If you build a team properly most of the time they become the cream.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

Avoiding bridge deals was a huge key to TBL's b2b cups.

Yep, the Flames ended up signing probably the worst bridge deal (whether it was player decision, GM decision or a combination of both) in modern NHL history. It cost us a superstar right as he hit his prime.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Hackey

I really hope were not watching a core of 34 year old Lindholm, 35 year old Weegar, 36 year old Huberdeau, and 38 year old Kadri in 6 years.

There is a ton of turnover on every team, every year. Predicting what the team will look like in 6 years is absolutely pointless. And the only way that all of them will still be on the team at that time is if they had a fair bit of success along the way.

Also, just because they have signed big contracts (in today's dollars) doesn't mean they are 'the core' and it will remain static. Young players will develop and change the dynamic of the team. Some will even become core players themselves. And yes, there will be cap space to sign them.

Here is the list of players that were on the team 6 years ago, that are still on it now:
Backlund
Mangiapane
Andersson

And Backlund is only a maybe at this point. The entire core from 6 years ago (Gaudreau, Monahan, Tkachuk, Frolik, Giordano, Hamilton and Brodie) is gone. Hell, Jaromir Jagr was on the team 6 years ago.

Some fans have gotten way too entrenched in their ideas about things, and are just projecting their negativity out as far as they can see. Relax, and try to be more flexible with your thinking.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Without a tear down coming, the Flames need to sign good players to contracts that provide value over the life of said contract. Lindholm is a good player which makes the Flames better. So it makes sense to re-sign him so long as the contract makes sense. Assuming an 8 year deal, it is fair to say that $9mm is too much, but I do think anything in the $8.5 range is probably decent value. We can argue with the number but it isn’t fair to say we will never win with him or we are guaranteed to finish 13-17 every year.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Yep, the Flames ended up signing probably the worst bridge deal (whether it was player decision, GM decision or a combination of both) in modern NHL history. It cost us a superstar right as he hit his prime.

No guarantee Tkachuk hits his prime that same way without the motivation of a contract year.

But, cool...would have been awesome if we still had him signed for 2 more years (he was never signing more than 6 years) and now we could trade him for a much worse return than we got a year ago...because we can be pretty sure he'd take the opportunity from the toxic last season to get the hell out of here.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

Avoiding bridge deals was a huge key to TBL's b2b cups.

Avoiding the cap entirely was probably a bigger factor.

And, depending on how you define a bridge, they bridged their top 3 forwards. And Hedman. Yzerman liked 5 year deals that bought only 1 year of UFA.