[GT] - Alberta debate 2023 - rumble in the rose bush

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by aaronck

A few random thoughts-
the arena deal never came up?
Did Danielle have Sharpie on her nose and literally almost choked on her own rage at some point?

Rachel stuttered a bit but came off as more believable I think. I don't think she was in attack mode, but brought up points and answered all questions, Danielle sure did not, the snake oil comments at the start of this thread were pretty appropriate.
No real talk about environment really, while Alberta is choked with smoke seemed to be a lost opportunity.

I thought it was a win for Rachel, but I don't know how many voters minds would be changed after

That's a local issue (mostly) so given the time limit on the debate that would rank way down there on issues that all Albertans would be interested in.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

go Danielle

Your location is correct.

[OutOfTheCube]

Left-leaning CP didn't like Danielle Smith at the debate.

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

I can't help but feel like this election has devolved into Alberta's Trump v Hillary moment.

Notley's message tonight came across as "Vote for me, cuz I'm not her."

I don't think Notley = Hilary is a great analogy, but let's roll with it a little further.

Hilary got buckled in those debates because Trump was able to play the role of the political outsider. She obviously didn't account for this and maybe even thought it was to her advantage. Either way, she didn't see the disconnect the American people had with the political establishment and Trump was able to lean into this to great effect.

Smith can't do this, even remotely. So when Notley attacked her, she was able to do so on, yes her lack of ethics or integrity (both things that actually worked for Trump) but also her record now and her record back then.

It's why, when Smith says stuff like, I don't know how to be a good lawyer when she's found in breach with conflicts of interest, or when she says she didn't realize that the sovereignty act was so poorly written, it makes no sense. You're an establishment politician, dummy!

Also, Smith doesn't have the meddle to hang in the fight like Trump had. I didn't hear him apologize once. Again, that played to his base. They valued strength over truth or civility. Smith can't stop apologizing and it comes off as incredibly weak.

So if Notley is Hilary, that Hilary would have crushed someone like Danielle Smith.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

That's a local issue (mostly) so given the time limit on the debate that would rank way down there on issues that all Albertans would be interested in.

Local except for the provincial dollars, that they now have to match for Edmonton.

[CaptainCrunch]

Did anyone actually land any punches?

I had it in the background, and it just seemed like both of them were in snipe mode without landing anything devastating?

[sa226]

I don't know why people look for charisma and fiery leadership in these things.

To me Notley has a good understanding of policy that matters in a provincial election. I'm far from and expert on any of this stuff, but Notley looked far more competent. Plus I didn't see much in the way of ideological discussion points from her.

Smith speaks well but she just alternated between lie and soundbite all night.

Sent from my SM-S918W using Tapatalk

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

It's also just damn hard to debate with someone who is not engaging in good faith.

If they know they would lose a battle in good faith, they're wise to drag that person into the mud with them.

Can be infuriating, but sadly in the realm of politics, it's effective nowadays.

I think we all know someone who isn't exactly a well of knowledge and has little real experience on some things they talk about, but they're very good at weasling around smarter people who challenge them by using clever deflections or just outright ignorance.

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

It’s always kind of funny that political debates have basically become these weird theatrical things where the majority of people have zero interest in what’s being said and base their entire judgements on how it’s said.

Someone can spend the entire time doing nothing but lying, presenting objectively terrible ideas, and dodging every question, but as long as they seem composed and well spoken, they can still “win” against someone who puts the truth and smart policy first if they stumble on a few words. It’s crazy.

And then you’re supposed to put together some well-written response to someone who says “Can’t vote for her, didn’t like the way she talked!” which is impossibly dumb as it is, but you’re the ####### for not treating it like it’s valid lol

Debates are nothing but political theatre at this point. Talking points regurgitated to its base to enforce their own team. There is no push back, no fact checking, no rules. They are practically useless.

I think the idea of demeanor and composure being the main focus largely comes from the Nixon/Kennedy debate; which many pundits though had an adverse impact on Nixon's campaign (among television viewers; many radio viewers felt Nixon performed better - i wonder if this was an age thing though?). I think many pundits put more weight on debates as a result of this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1960_U...al%20election.

[Looch City]

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

Left-leaning CP didn't like Danielle Smith at the debate.

Ultra left leaning, Trudeau loving, NDP loving CP you mean!!

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Looch City

Ultra left leaning, Trudeau loving, NDP loving CP you mean!!

CP? More like CCCP.

We must destroy this communist hell hole.

[PsYcNeT]

Reigning conservative party parodies actual fiscal conservatism, opting instead to dive headfirst into social conservatism

"WOW GUYS YOU SURE ARE A BUNCH OF PINKOS"

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

Left-leaning CP didn't like Danielle Smith at the debate.

It's not about being left leaning, it's about not being a kunt.

[Iowa_Flames_Fan]

UCP provincial lead in the Mainstreet tracker is now down to 0.5%.

https://twitter.com/MainStResearch/s...35032380809217

Technically this data has field dates of May 15-18th but it’s probably still fair to say this is almost entirely a “pre-debate” survey. I’m skeptical that the debate would change any of these trends anyway, but if it did we won’t be able to see that yet.

[MRCboicgy]

Originally Posted by Looch City

Ultra left leaning, Trudeau loving, NDP loving CP you mean!!

It's like they can't wrap their head around how some of us still think Trudeau is a schmuck, and see that Smith is a total moron.


Weird that some people can judge each choice on their own merits, rather than team-based voting.

[Torture]

Originally Posted by Iowa_Flames_Fan

UCP provincial lead in the Mainstreet tracker is now down to 0.5%.

https://twitter.com/MainStResearch/s...35032380809217

Technically this data has field dates of May 15-18th but it’s probably still fair to say this is almost entirely a “pre-debate” survey. I’m skeptical that the debate would change any of these trends anyway, but if it did we won’t be able to see that yet.

Supposedly if you have access to the detailed data that poll results in an NDP win.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1659636937022492673

[Iowa_Flames_Fan]

After realizing that I posted in the wrong thread it occurred to me I should probably close this one now since the debate is over.