I'd be interested in your justification as based on your top 5 "this season" I already see a couple players who aren't even as good as Ovechkin "this season."
I don't mean based off this season play. That would be a useless list.
I meant as of this season who are the top 10 guys I think are the best in the world.
I don't mean based off this season play. That would be a useless list.
I meant as of this season who are the top 10 guys I think are the best in the world.
And the prime-aged player who led the league in goals (by 10 goals) and game winning goals, while being top 5 in points and being nominated for the NHL MVP last year, along with being the 4th highest goal scorer among active players (and younger than the top 3 by 8+ years)...
DOESN'T make the cut.
And the prime-aged player who led the league in goals (by 10 goals) and game winning goals, while being top 5 in points and being nominated for the NHL MVP last year, along with being the 4th highest goal scorer among active players (and younger than the top 3 by 8+ years)...
DOESN'T make the cut.
Again, I'd be interested in seeing your criteria.
The criteria is very simple who I think is the best player and who I think would help my team/would want on my team.
Ovechkin scores goals and does nothing else. He is poor defensively, thinks that taking runs at guys is smart physical play, is more concerned about getting his points than winning games.
The 10 guys on my list do more to help teams win games and for the most part I think that is evidenced in their teams having more success than Ovechkin despite him being surrounded by a lot and often cases more talented players.
I have also now seen two other lists with Ovechkin outside the top 10 in this thread alone so it isn't like I am the only person with this viewpoint.
The criteria is very simple who I think is the best player and who I think would help my team/would want on my team.
Ovechkin scores goals and does nothing else. He is poor defensively, thinks that taking runs at guys is smart physical play, is more concerned about getting his points than winning games.
The 10 guys on my list do more to help teams win games and for the most part I think that is evidenced in their teams having more success than Ovechkin despite him being surrounded by a lot and often cases more talented players.
I have also now seen two other lists with Ovechkin outside the top 10 in this thread alone so it isn't like I am the only person with this viewpoint.
Well when Ovechkin finishes his career, I am sure he'll be remembered as a top 10 player during his playing days.
Ovechkin is the least appreciated superstar I can remember. If his name was Mike Jones, and he was born in Canada, he'd be one of the most celebrated/popular players ever. Not great defensively lol, what an argument. He's in a league of his own. If he played in the 80s he would've scored 700 goals in that decade alone.
When it's all said and done 20 years from now, I'm confident he will be regarded as a top 10 player of ALL TIME, much less this nonsense about top 10 right now. He's going to end up #2 behind Gretzky for all-time goals ffs.
The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Fire of the Phoenix For This Useful Post:
Having a hat trick from Ovechkin is great, but if the other team scores three goals on you while he is on the ice it isn't as beneficial.
Toews +172 in 580 gp (+17 in 117 playoff gp)
Ovy +64 in 773 gp (+6 in 72 playoff gp)
(not saying +/- is that important a stat...)
Quote:
Originally Posted by GirlySports
Don't disagree but you need wingers.
You starting lineup would have to be
Price
Keith Doughty
Ovechkin Crosby Kane
Sure, if I was building a team he might be in the top 10 players I chose (I'd probably take 3 C, 4 D and a goalie before him though), but that seems to me a sillier exercise than a blow it up draft. Perhaps still a silly exercise, but if the scenario is that 30 teams draft all of their players from scratch every year (so only thinking one season; hence my valuation of Datsyuk over Ovi), I'm not picking Ovechkin over any of the 11 guys I had listed before. I might take Getzlaf, Bergeron, Giordano, Rinne and Rask ahead of him too.
I do think Ovy is the best winger of this generation, and behind only Howe and Jagr all time. Assuming he maintains decent production, I would go so far as to say "no winger was ever better than him" - though I'd make the same statement about Bossy, Richard, Howe & Jagr too (asinine to compare such broad time periods).
There are still dozens of C's, D and G's I would build a team around over any of those 5 (and I would take Howe or Jagr over Ovy on my team too).
The Following User Says Thank You to powderjunkie For This Useful Post:
Does Ovechkin have a more distinguished career then Jagr? I don't think so... Jagr transcends generations.
How about Teemu? I think its a saw off there.
As for the top 10, its really no slight to him and I probably might have him in the top 10, but I see a top 8 right now, and I don't see Ovechkin as a better player, overall, then any of the following :
Ovechkin is probably a touch above Getzlaf, Perry, Stamkos, Kane. Ovechkin and Lundqvist probably round out my top 10... but its close.
I think of the top 8 I listed above, you could make a pretty solid case those guys could be in the top 25 all time... just a lot of good hockey players out there. All in the class of Sakic, Yzerman, Forsberg, Jagr, Lidstrom.
__________________
"With a coach and a player, sometimes there's just so much respect there that it's boils over"
-Taylor Hall
Since this has become the Ovechkin thread I will weigh in and say that I think he is extremely under-appreciated and that the next five years of his career will cement him in the GOAT conversation, especially if the Caps have some team success and win a cup in that period.
You can nit-pick his game all you want but he is a rare player indeed.
The Following User Says Thank You to blender For This Useful Post:
Since this has become the Ovechkin thread I will weigh in and say that I think he is extremely under-appreciated and that the next five years of his career will cement him in the GOAT conversation, especially if the Caps have some team success and win a cup in that period.
You can nit-pick his game all you want but he is a rare player indeed.
Ovi is top 5-3 in terms of goal scoring ability, but the GOAT hockey player? Nah.
In his 19th NHL season, and at 38 years old, Iginla has played in all 15 games for the Colorado Avalanche this season. He leads them with seven goals and his 12 points are tied for second.
Quote:
Iginla's goal Tuesday against the Philadelphia Flyers was the 596th of his NHL career and moved him within one point of Peter Stastny for 38th place on the all-time points list. As the game gets younger, and on the particularly young Avalanche -- 14 players on their 23-man roster were under the age of 10 when Iginla broke into the NHL in 1996 -- Iginla is a rare breed.
On leadership:
Quote:
Soderberg said Iginla has had a positive effect on his game and provided great leadership for the Avalanche.
"He's the best guy to have on the team," Soderberg said. "He works every day and he's positive, so I think he helps a lot of us."
On longevity
Quote:
Iginla credits good fortune for having played more than 1,400 NHL games. He's missed 50 games in his career, never more than 12 in any season. Since 2005-06, Iginla has missed 20 games.
Quote:
"I've found I have to stay in shape and take care of myself," he said. "You have to enjoy the training, because the offseason training, you have to go hard, and I think you have to push and have the motivation there.
Truly a legend of the modern game. Flames fans were lucky to have him for so long.
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to CroFlames For This Useful Post:
Despite the NHL getting younger and younger and contracts harder to come by for older vets, I think Iggy will be one of the rare exceptions.
If you are the Avs, why wouldn't you extend him a year or two? Or if he reaches UFA, I'm sure there will be a good chunk of teams who would like to add leadership, experience and 20 some-odd goals (30 maybe?) to their lineup for relatively cheap.
I envisioned this season going a lot differently for the Flames, and that in 2016-2017 they would be a bona fide playoff team and they take Iggy on a 1 year deal and hopefully chase the dream one last time. Everytime I think of Iggy coming back I think of this video...
