Recall the UCP and other activist responses

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by Wolven

Right, that is gross. I forgot about that.

I think my point still stands - it is a very rare thing to have the NWC be used in Alberta and I think the terrible ways that the NWC is being used are justification to use the recall process. The Notwithstanding clause is not normal legislation and policy, it is extreme and radical and should only be used in emergency situations to protect the population.

It should not be used as a negotiation tactic with workers and it should never be considered to be a normal thing to for the government to use.

Oh, I wasn't disagreeing with you or saying you didn't have a point.
I agree with you 100%

I was just engaging in a bit of, well deserved, self loathing for being from a province that has actually used/tried to use the NWC in two instances where the point wasn't "We're going to strip people of these rights to protect others, and/or because we have no other recourse", but was rather "We're going to use the NWC to strip people of these rights....that's it...that's the point".

[Bill Bumface]

I think the most important step any one of us can take is to buy a used pickup truck and mount an upside down Alberta flag on it.

[surferguy]

Gonna need a slogan Bumface!

Danielle Smith!

“Keeping Alberta free…from accountability!”

[Nyah]

Originally Posted by surferguy

Gonna need a slogan Bumface!

Danielle Smith!

“Keeping Alberta free…from accountability!”

Way too big of a word if we're sticking to theme!

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Wolven

Went back to the Operation Total Recall website this morning and was shocked to see the movement. Last night only 4 recalls had moved out of the "Not Started" status.

Now there are 10 in motion.

• 4 targeted - Step 1 in their process
• 3 Initial Paperwork Submitted - Step 2 in the process
• 2 Organizing - Step 4 in the process, after initial paperwork approval and before gathering signatures
• 1 Gathering signatures

I love that one of the ones that just jumped all the way to Organizing is for Ric McIver in Calgary-Hays.

[#-3]

Originally Posted by Wolven

Went back to the Operation Total Recall website this morning and was shocked to see the movement. Last night only 4 recalls had moved out of the "Not Started" status.

Now there are 10 in motion.

• 4 targeted - Step 1 in their process
• 3 Initial Paperwork Submitted - Step 2 in the process
• 2 Organizing - Step 4 in the process, after initial paperwork approval and before gathering signatures
• 1 Gathering signatures

I love that one of the ones that just jumped all the way to Organizing is for Ric McIver in Calgary-Hays.

When I looked last night there ware only the 2.
I suspect a couple others that say paperwork submitted were already in motion yesterday, and they just contacted the owners of this site today when they saw it. And the ones that say targeted, they have probably had interested people from the riding. its still a big uphill battle.

But 1 should be enough to force the UPC to drop Smith.
4 should be enough to topple this government eventually.
7 would be enough to topple the government immediately.

I'm just holding out hope for 1.

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by #-3

When I looked last night there ware only the 2.
I suspect a couple others that say paperwork submitted were already in motion yesterday, and they just contacted the owners of this site today when they saw it. And the ones that say targeted, they have probably had interested people from the riding. its still a big uphill battle.

But 1 should be enough to force the UPC to drop Smith.
4 should be enough to topple this government eventually.
7 would be enough to topple the government immediately.

I'm just holding out hope for 1.

They are now at 15 in motion. It looks like the 2 in Organizing status rolled back to Targeted status. Probably confusion over the terminology. I am guessing that "targeted" means that there is someone volunteering to fill out the paperwork, pay the $500 fee, and be the proponent to put their name on the recall. If true, it is funny how fast they are finding proponents for recalls and Smith still cannot find a proponent for her imaginary pipeline.

But a 4th one now has the paperwork submitted!

• 10 targeted - Step 1 in their process
• 4 Initial Paperwork Submitted - Step 2 in the process
• 1 Gathering signatures

Note: The commitment from Elections Alberta is that each application submitted will be processed within 7 days. After the approval notification, the MLA will have 7 days to provide a 100 word response stating why the MLA thinks they should not be recalled. After the response is received (or the 7 day response window expires) there is another 7 day window before the recall petition is added to the recall website... so potentially 21 maximum days from submission to completion?

That might be good because that means you would get the approval notification and then have a 14 day window to organize and get canvassers signed up before the canvassing period starts.

Can you imagine how empowering it will feel to recall one MLA? When people see Nicolaides get recalled, do you think more and more of them will join in to recall their UCP MLA? How much momentum will build up on this recall initiative?

On the other side, at what point does the UCP do something? What can they do in the face of all of these recalls? The only thing I can think of is call an early election to try and stop the recalls.

[#-3]

Originally Posted by Wolven

They are now at 15 in motion. It looks like the 2 in Organizing status rolled back to Targeted status. Probably confusion over the terminology. I am guessing that "targeted" means that there is someone volunteering to fill out the paperwork, pay the $500 fee, and be the proponent to put their name on the recall. If true, it is funny how fast they are finding proponents for recalls and Smith still cannot find a proponent for her imaginary pipeline.

But a 4th one now has the paperwork submitted!

• 10 targeted - Step 1 in their process
• 4 Initial Paperwork Submitted - Step 2 in the process
• 1 Gathering signatures

Note: The commitment from Elections Alberta is that each application submitted will be processed within 7 days. After the approval notification, the MLA will have 7 days to provide a 100 word response stating why the MLA thinks they should not be recalled. After the response is received (or the 7 day response window expires) there is another 7 day window before the recall petition is added to the recall website... so potentially 21 maximum days from submission to completion?

That might be good because that means you would get the approval notification and then have a 14 day window to organize and get canvassers signed up before the canvassing period starts.

Can you imagine how empowering it will feel to recall one MLA? When people see Nicolaides get recalled, do you think more and more of them will join in to recall their UCP MLA? How much momentum will build up on this recall initiative?

On the other side, at what point does the UCP do something? What can they do in the face of all of these recalls? The only thing I can think of is call an early election to try and stop the recalls.

Well 7 recalls and their government is over either way. They'll immediately lose a confidence election at that pace. Likewise, if they lose 4 Bi-elections they'll fall immediately, nobody outside of the party would let this government continue to stand, so they need a majority to stand.

I think if there is even the risk of 4 by-elections, should be enough to spur this government into calling a general election. Anything less, I just don't see it making sense for them.

But I think at 1 successful recall should be enough for the party to oust Smith, I don't think that will change any of the outcomes they deliver, but maybe it will throw some cold water on the effort. If any members are recalled for government policy that should be enough to start a grassroots rebellion within the party

I do worry this government will challenge the legitimacy of recalls, drag it out far longer than the 21 days allotted, and/or change the rules. It would really be a strong endorsement of democracy if a government in majority power, without supermajority legislative limitations, allowed themselves to fall to recall votes that don't strictly need to be allowed, it wouldn't change my opinion of them but would surprise me in a good way for the UPC to be that accepting of democracy.

[D as in David]

One of the factors that aided the Forever Canadian initiative was the good autumn weather. Even poor weather wouldn't have prevented obtaining the requisite number of signatures in that initiative, but it could be a big factor in these recalls.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Are people allowed to go door to door? Because that makes it easier.

Wosh we had some sort of running count on the signatures to date.

[D as in David]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Are people allowed to go door to door? Because that makes it easier.

Wosh we had some sort of running count on the signatures to date.

Yes, you can go door-to-door.

[WideReceiver]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Are people allowed to go door to door? Because that makes it easier.

Wosh we had some sort of running count on the signatures to date.

Of course. I knocked on ~450 doors for Forever Canadian. There are no rules around this.

[Flames0910]

Assuming a healthy number of volunteers, if the recall initiatives can get organized enough to do door to door, it's probably their most effective tool.

Especially if you can get ahold of voter data and hit the houses most likely to support you.

[Caged Great]

Got another 70 today, about 150 total myself thus far. I think we are over 3K between everything.


We are looking at doing door to door soon once things get too cold. Looking at coordinating with some other groups to get volunteers to go door to door.

Basically looking at spliting the district up into sections to make it easy for the canvassers. Like each one takes 200 houses near where they live and have the volunteers knock on the doors and have people like me run from house to house with the clipboards for anyone who says yes.

My dad used to be the community association president 20 years ago, and I know all the fun things that he did to make things effective (he had by far the highest community association member sign ups by like 15X the norm). Been brainstorming all sorts of fun ideas to get things going. Just getting started

We are going to hit the goal. It's gonna be fun.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

Got another 70 today, about 150 total myself thus far. I think we are over 3K between everything.


We are looking at doing door to door soon once things get too cold. Looking at coordinating with some other groups to get volunteers to go door to door.

Basically looking at spliting the district up into sections to make it easy for the canvassers. Like each one takes 200 houses near where they live and have the volunteers knock on the doors and have people like me run from house to house with the clipboards for anyone who says yes.

My dad used to be the community association president 20 years ago, and I know all the fun things that he did to make things effective (he had by far the highest community association member sign ups by like 15X the norm). Been brainstorming all sorts of fun ideas to get things going. Just getting started

We are going to hit the goal. It's gonna be fun.

we need to get you guys a

NICO
LIE
DES

t-shirt

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

Got another 70 today, about 150 total myself thus far. I think we are over 3K between everything.


We are looking at doing door to door soon once things get too cold. Looking at coordinating with some other groups to get volunteers to go door to door.

Basically looking at spliting the district up into sections to make it easy for the canvassers. Like each one takes 200 houses near where they live and have the volunteers knock on the doors and have people like me run from house to house with the clipboards for anyone who says yes.

My dad used to be the community association president 20 years ago, and I know all the fun things that he did to make things effective (he had by far the highest community association member sign ups by like 15X the norm). Been brainstorming all sorts of fun ideas to get things going. Just getting started

We are going to hit the goal. It's gonna be fun.

There are many words I would like to say to you, but I think I can sum it up quickly:

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by #-3

Well 7 recalls and their government is over either way. They'll immediately lose a confidence election at that pace. Likewise, if they lose 4 Bi-elections they'll fall immediately, nobody outside of the party would let this government continue to stand, so they need a majority to stand.

I think if there is even the risk of 4 by-elections, should be enough to spur this government into calling a general election. Anything less, I just don't see it making sense for them.

But I think at 1 successful recall should be enough for the party to oust Smith, I don't think that will change any of the outcomes they deliver, but maybe it will throw some cold water on the effort. If any members are recalled for government policy that should be enough to start a grassroots rebellion within the party

I do worry this government will challenge the legitimacy of recalls, drag it out far longer than the 21 days allotted, and/or change the rules. It would really be a strong endorsement of democracy if a government in majority power, without supermajority legislative limitations, allowed themselves to fall to recall votes that don't strictly need to be allowed, it wouldn't change my opinion of them but would surprise me in a good way for the UPC to be that accepting of democracy.

I understand the concern around the government fighting the recalls. I am not sure that the government has a leg to stand on when they created this process. At this point their only real choice is to either call an election or just ride out the recalls and see how many MLAs they lose.

From a citizen perspective, I think if there is a successful recall in Calgary-Bow then that will prove that we can do it and empower the population to recall more MLAs. This is the ultimate 'populist' movement of Alberta as the people are rising up against the UCP, who are effectively the puppets of the elite. I do not think that the people will stop or slow down, even if the UCP oust Smith.

Even if the UCP kicked out Smith AND walk back the NWC in order to come back to the table to offer the teachers a reasonable deal... I do not think the people will stop this effort to kick this party out of government. It is like a switch has been flipped and every single thing the UCP has done to us is going into the petition and there is no way for them to walk back every grift, scandal, coverup, and outright fascist act they have done.

If any of the UCP wanted to save themselves, they needed to not sign the bill using the NWC and cross over to the new PC party. That moment is gone and now all of those MLAs who thought they should use the power of their elected office to revoke the rights of the people they represent need to be removed from office.

Operation Total Recall is now showing 19 recalls in motion:

• 12 targeted - Meaning someone has stepped up to be the proponent for the petition (Step 1 in their process)
• 6 Initial Paperwork Submitted - Paperwork has been filed with $500 payment (Step 2 in the process)
• 1 Gathering signatures

What impresses me the most is the number of targeted MLAs that are outside of Calgary. Grande Prairie and Highwood have their paperwork submitted! I can only imagine how those conversations are going to go during door knocking.

[vegasbound]

Anyone live in Airdrie-East? Recall for Angela Pitt has been approved! https://globalnews.ca/news/11508617/...n-ucp-alberta/

[troutman]

Originally Posted by vegasbound

anyone live in airdrie-east? Recall for angela pitt has been approved! https://globalnews.ca/news/11508617/...n-ucp-alberta/

mcclure says the cost of verifying these petitions and other potential referendum initiatives is taxing his staff, and he needs another $13.5 million to do the job.

$13.5 m? Wtf?

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by troutman

$13.5 m? Wtf?

Having to validate the 456K signatures on the FC petition is no small task. Even if it only takes 2 minutes to review each signature, that is still 912,000 minutes or 15,200 manhours or 380 work weeks. But what if it takes 5 minutes to manually validate a signature against a government ID database? Now you need to do 38,000 manhours in a fairly short amount of time to let everyone know that the petition is good to go.

They are going to have to staff up a bunch of temporary workers for short term contracts.

But then they are potentially going to have to validate thousands and thousands of more signatures for all of the recall petitions... Elections Alberta wasn't built to be busy all of the time.