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Old 06-25-2025, 08:31 AM   #1161
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Treliving didn't draft Cowan so I could see him being traded. They do have assets, I could see the going after either Kadri or Backlund.
Even if he did, still one of his teams first round picks so I could see him being traded…
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Old 06-25-2025, 08:35 AM   #1162
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Since I’m a small-minded, petty, jealous person, I’m still trying to forget that Calum Ritchie was traded to a team other than ours- and I don’t care about the circumstances, lol.
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Old 06-25-2025, 08:36 AM   #1163
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I see your point, but that's such a weird way of picking 1 best forward.

I thought that P. Kane(Conn Smythe 2013) was the best forward for the Hawks, and an argument can be made for Tkachuk in FLA. Marchessault (Conn Smythe) and Stone in VGK. As you mentioned Zetterberg also won the Conn Smythe.

I agree that you don't necessarily need 100 point stars, since that doesn't apply to ROR(77P), Towes(81P), Getzlaf(91P), Barkov(96P), Kopitar(92P), or even Bergeron(79P). I mean Datsyuk had a career high of 97, so that's a pretty high bar. That said there were a lot less goals scored in the NHL from 2004-2018, and there were 3 x 100 point getters per season on average. For comparison there were 6 this year, 9 the year before that, and 11 the year before that.

IMO this is a team game, and a better way of looking at it is by counting star-seasons. A team needs at least 4 players having a star seasons(top 18.5% WAR) to be considered a contender.
You need star players and all the guys I mentioned put up points, but some seem to think we need McDavid or MacKinnon to win.

I'm not saying that all these players were the best players during the cup run, but points and Conn Smyth doesn't show me the real value of a player. How many points did McDavid, Matthews, Aho or Kucherov get this playoff against Florida? Barkov and Reinhart won them the cup, even if others on the team outscored them. Having a star forward who dominates both ends, wins cup.

When the Flames make the playoffs, Backlund is the guy coaches trust the most against stars. Issue is, he isn't elite in the O-Zone and do you want him playing 22 mins a night? Superstar 2 way forward like Barkov, yes you can play him 22 mins, and he will score and will shut your star down. Not suggesting it was all him, but the value of guys like him always get way undervalued by most fans or media when saying who the best players are or who should win the Hart or Conn Smyth
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Old 06-25-2025, 08:41 AM   #1164
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Sec and I will have to go for beers and share war stories.
If I promise to buy may I come too?
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Old 06-25-2025, 08:42 AM   #1165
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Originally Posted by Sandman View Post
Since I’m a small-minded, petty, jealous person, I’m still trying to forget that Calum Ritchie was traded to a team other than ours- and I don’t care about the circumstances, lol.
I love Kadri but I think everyone would’ve been pretty stoked about that package from the Avs, let alone more as some on here were alluding to
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Old 06-25-2025, 08:54 AM   #1166
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It's how you spend those picks though.

Dallas got Mikko Rantanen.

Vegas got Hanifin and Hertl

Winnipeg got Toffoli, Schenn, and Tanev for their 3 seconds

Toronto got Jake McCabe, Brandon Carlo, Ilya Lybushkin, and Scott Laughton and it cost them 3 1sts, 2 2nds, and their second best prospect (Minten)

Really feels like they should have been able to get more impactful return on those assets than what they did
Yeah when you don't have great prospects you have to lean into your picks.

Dallas with Stankoven for example is a package that Toronto couldn't offer.
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Old 06-25-2025, 08:56 AM   #1167
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genetics
Yeah, this idea any player can just change their diet and hit the gym to put on 30 lbs of muscle is unfounded. Lots of guys get drafted at 180 lbs at age 18 and never reach a playing weight much higher than 190.
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Old 06-25-2025, 08:58 AM   #1168
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It's how you spend those picks though.

Dallas got Mikko Rantanen.

Vegas got Hanifin and Hertl

Winnipeg got Toffoli, Schenn, and Tanev for their 3 seconds

Toronto got Jake McCabe, Brandon Carlo, Ilya Lybushkin, and Scott Laughton and it cost them 3 1sts, 2 2nds, and their second best prospect (Minten)

Really feels like they should have been able to get more impactful return on those assets than what they did
just because we can , probably worth including EDM


their remaining ledger for next 3 years is 1 1st and 2 2nds


* I will also include the fact they used the Broberg additional 2nd


so as best I can tell basically 2 1sts, Broberg, a 2nd, some mid prospects (Wanner, Lachance) for Walman, Frederic, O'Reilly and getting rid of Kassian
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Old 06-25-2025, 08:59 AM   #1169
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Kyrou’s name is out there. Another winger, albeit a RW not LW. Trade protection kicks in July 1.

Stl was linked to Andersson at some point iirc. Either him or Robertson would look great on our pp.

Cool to see some of these big names out there and some of them attached to us.
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Old 06-25-2025, 09:04 AM   #1170
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Danielson had 39 points in 71 AHL games this season- you can’t ask much more from a 20 year old. He’s going to be a solid NHLer, even if he isn’t playing on a top line.
And Honzek got 21 points in 52 games in his 20 year old season. Not exactly a huge difference in their production and not really huge difference in their production at the junior level. Yet one guy is considered a blue chipper on this board and one guy is considered a borderline bust by some on this board.
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Old 06-25-2025, 09:31 AM   #1171
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Kyrou’s name is out there. Another winger, albeit a RW not LW. Trade protection kicks in July 1.

Stl was linked to Andersson at some point iirc. Either him or Robertson would look great on our pp.

Cool to see some of these big names out there and some of them attached to us.
Would love Kyrou here.
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Old 06-25-2025, 09:39 AM   #1172
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Originally Posted by Aarongavey View Post
And Honzek got 21 points in 52 games in his 20 year old season. Not exactly a huge difference in their production and not really huge difference in their production at the junior level. Yet one guy is considered a blue chipper on this board and one guy is considered a borderline bust by some on this board.
Thats stretching the goalposts.

.55pt/gm for Danielson and .40pt/gm for Honzek, plus add in the injury issues and Danielson trending as a Center and Honzek maybe winger.
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Old 06-25-2025, 09:43 AM   #1173
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Honzek: Are the injuries freak accidents or are they due to lack of conditioning?

Does anyone know?

It’s really only the latter that concerns me.
Not lack of conditioning as the others have said. He came into the season throwing his body around and playing with a high level of intensity after training hard with Pospisil over the offseason. That style of game really seemed to work for him, as he's got some soft skills that pair well with a physical, high intensity game.

My take is similar to aaronkarl, Honzek just needs to put on some mass so he can really be successful at that style of game.

His ankle fracture in the AHL at the back half of last year was just a freak injury where he took a puck off the ankle, but the possible concussion he took on October 15th off this hit by Connor Murphy suggests he needs to be heavier to be able to play that high intensity, physicial style:

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DBK5OKEpZkj/

I mean Murphy is a big boy, and a reverse hit is surprising, but the kid just bounced off of him like he ran into a wall... and he was looking for contact (although a little on his heels).

I still think he'll be a big success if his metabolism lets him add muscle in the next year or two.
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Old 06-25-2025, 09:51 AM   #1174
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Yeah, this idea any player can just change their diet and hit the gym to put on 30 lbs of muscle is unfounded. Lots of guys get drafted at 180 lbs at age 18 and never reach a playing weight much higher than 190.
Bit different when you are that tall. Being a 6'4 teenager playing professional hockey though is very hard to gain weight.

Hopefully he had more time this summer. He's gotta get to at least 215 imo
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Old 06-25-2025, 11:04 AM   #1175
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I mean, we've seen footage of him working out with Pospisil, and the stories behind that where he wants to kill Martin because he works him so hard.

I don't think conditioning is a problem.
Again, he hasn't gained weight, so something isn't working.

I'm not saying effort is a problem. Could be a diet thing.
But he is still extremely light for his height and hasn't gained any weight. It's not rocket science. Honzek clearly isn't consuming enough calories. Even with the videos including Pospisil, most of what they were doing had nothing to do with hypertrophy.

Hagens gained around 12 lbs this year. He's not naturally stocky. He just put the work in. He did the right work.

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Old 06-25-2025, 11:16 AM   #1176
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Again, he hasn't gained weight, so something isn't working.

I'm not saying effort is a problem. Could be a diet thing.
But he is still extremely light for his height and hasn't gained any weight. It's not rocket science. Honzek clearly isn't consuming enough calories. Even with the videos including Pospisil, most of what they were doing had nothing to do with hypertrophy.

Hagens gained around 12 lbs this year. He's not naturally stocky. He just put the work in. He did the right work.
Everyone's body is different. Honzek might not be able to gain weight for a few more years. That happens to a lot of prospects. I know a player that mentioned he couldn't gain good weight until he was in his mid twenties.
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Old 06-25-2025, 11:24 AM   #1177
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https://www.nhl.com/flames/news/honz...arents-on-hand

His undeniable work ethic resulted in what Flames Director of Sports Performance Rick Davis called an “elite score” in the speed bike test to kick off training camp.

The bike test (also known as the “Wingate”) records a player’s peak over a six-second interval, which then correlates to acceleration and speed capabilities off the line.

“Think horsepower or torque,” Davis said.

Honzek scored an eye-popping 19.9 watts per kilogram of body mass, which is the highest score of any Flame in the past 10 years of data.
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Old 06-25-2025, 11:27 AM   #1178
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kyrou’s name is out there. Another winger, albeit a rw not lw. Trade protection kicks in july 1.

Stl was linked to andersson at some point iirc. Either him or robertson would look great on our pp.

Cool to see some of these big names out there and some of them attached to us.
https://twitter.com/user/status/1937887634258342249
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Old 06-25-2025, 11:30 AM   #1179
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I'm sure he's talented and all, but that's just not a name that screams star...
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Old 06-25-2025, 11:32 AM   #1180
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Again, he hasn't gained weight, so something isn't working.

I'm not saying effort is a problem. Could be a diet thing.
But he is still extremely light for his height and hasn't gained any weight. It's not rocket science. Honzek clearly isn't consuming enough calories. Even with the videos including Pospisil, most of what they were doing had nothing to do with hypertrophy.

Hagens gained around 12 lbs this year. He's not naturally stocky. He just put the work in. He did the right work.

I remember at training camp/preseason, there was certainly talk about Honzek physically looking bigger over last year. No idea about the difference in weight (and you may be right about the weight itself), but there was some chatter about Honzek's increased muscle-mass (and along with the testing results mentioned a few posts before this one).
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