2023/2024 Trade Rumors and Speculation Thread

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I'm not fussed over a great prospect versus a high pick.

Well, Jacques Richard and Tom Lysiak had a few more.

And of course, if you go to the next highest picks you get Monahan and Tkachuk as 6th round picks who did fairly well.

Calgary Flames franchise history and yeah you aren't getting those top picks for our UFAs

again I said keep your own picks, all of them (also for offer sheet reasons)

I am preferring YOUNG players to late firsts...which in my opinion are the most over rated assets in the NHL. You can get late firsts and flip them too. Its statistics, I'm glad the Flames traded Niewy for Iggy and not 2, 3, 4, late firsts...If CP existed at the time most would have wanted the picks.

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Not a Flames target, but I suspect Chicago is going to try and dump Perry somewhere.

I would do it just to see him deliver the party line of "I'm real excited to be a Calgary Flame" with a facial expression that suggests he stuffed a whole packet of Sour Patch Kids into his mouth at once

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Here is the trend I always see here. Poster suggests a prospect from a team as a return in a trade. Other posters say that team would not move that prospect. Rinse and repeat.

Truth is we don't know who values what or who could be moved or couldn't. This is like a HF phenomenon that is starting to make its way here where any decent prospect is worth more than any established player. You can go back year after year there and see posters saying so and so prospect is not available and then at some point they are dealt.

The most overrated piece by far by fans is a 1st round pick. Yes, you can get a star player with a 1st rnd pick but the majority of them statistically end up busts. That is why I always say unless that 1st is a lottery pick in a good draft I would rather trade for good young players who have shown something.

What are some examples in recent years of top prospects being traded? I can’t think of many. Suzuki to Montreal. Norris to Ottawa. Faber to Minnesota… was Raty a top prospect?

Players who look like they can step in within a year or two and be difference-makers on an entry-level contract have never been more valuable in the NHL. They do still get traded sometimes. But less often than they used to.

[butterfly]

Mintyukov, Luke Hughes, Wallstedt, Cooley, Gabe Perreault, Edvinsson, Nate Danielson, Bedard, Will Smith, Nemec, Michkov, etc., teams aren't going to trade these guys for "established players". No matter how good or bad the NHL team is right now.

Prospects are more valuable because their best years are still to come and they make no money.

What did Jack Eichel get? Peyton Krebs.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Calgary Flames franchise history and yeah you aren't getting those top picks for our UFAs

again I said keep your own picks

I am preferring YOUNG players to late firsts...which in my opinion are the most over rated assets in the NHL. You can get late firsts and flip them too. Its statistics, I'm glad the Flames traded Niewy for Iggy and not 2, 3, 4, late firsts...If CP existed at the time most would have wanted the picks.

It's funny because during the last Flames "retool" Feaster was adamant that the return needed to have a 1st round pick, and actually people look back at that now and get mad about it.

Would be interesting to look back at trades from the last Flames re-build and see what would have been better - the late 1st or a top 5 prospect from that team.

Iginla to Pittsburgh:

2013 1st: 28th OV - Morgan Klimchuk

Top Prospects in the Penguins System: Derrick Pouliot, Olli Matta, Teddy Blueger, Joe Morrow, Scott Harrington, Brian Rust

Bouwmeester to the Blues:

2013 1st: 22 OV - Emile Poirier

Top Prospects in the Blues System: Jordan Schmaltz, Ty Rattie, Dmitrij Jaskin, Joel Edmundson, Jaden Schwartz, Vladimir Tarasenko

Would be interesting to look back now but wonder if Jaden Schwartz was ever on the table before their first that year for Bouwmeester.

I think if there is a young player you really like, then I have no issue with the Flames getting a prospect instead of a pick in the 20-30 range.

Originally Posted by butterfly

Mintyukov, Luke Hughes, Wallstedt, Cooley, Gabe Perreault, Edvinsson, Nate Danielson, Bedard, Will Smith, Nemec, Michkov, etc., teams aren't going to trade these guys for "established players". No matter how good or bad the NHL team is right now.

Prospects are more valuable because their best years are still to come and they make no money.

What did Jack Eichel get? Peyton Krebs.

You're likely not going to get the top top prospects, but I do think there are likely good players to be had still.

Buffalo had a bad start to the season but it's likely not Benson or Savoie you could have traded for...but maybe Rosen would have been available and he's had a great AHL start this year now.

Tough to get a top 30 prospect, but think you can sometimes pry guys out beyond that.

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

It's funny because during the last Flames "retool" Feaster was adamant that the return needed to have a 1st round pick, and actually people look back at that now and get mad about it.

Would be interesting to look back at trades from the last Flames re-build and see what would have been better - the late 1st or a top 5 prospect from that team.

Iginla to Pittsburgh:

2013 1st: 28th OV - Morgan Klimchuk

Top Prospects in the Penguins System: Derrick Pouliot, Olli Matta, Teddy Blueger, Joe Morrow, Scott Harrington, Brian Rust

Bouwmeester to the Blues:

2013 1st: 22 OV - Emile Poirier

Top Prospects in the Blues System: Jordan Schmaltz, Ty Rattie, Dmitrij Jaskin, Joel Edmundson, Jaden Schwartz, Vladimir Tarasenko

Would be interesting to look back now but wonder if Jaden Schwartz was ever on the table before their first that year for Bouwmeester.

I think if there is a young player you really like, then I have no issue with the Flames getting a prospect instead of a pick in the 20-30 range.

It didn't work out with those particular players in that instance. These players were available at that stage of that draft:

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

What are some examples in recent years of top prospects being traded? I can’t think of many. Suzuki to Montreal. Norris to Ottawa. Faber to Minnesota… was Raty a top prospect?

Players who look like they can step in within a year or two and be difference-makers on an entry-level contract have never been more valuable in the NHL. They do still get traded sometimes. But less often than they used to.

That's a pretty good list. The Fiala deal (for Faber) is a good example of what ideally the Flames would shoot for. But they are rare. Minny got a 1st and Faber.

You could add: Kupari (in the Dubois deal), Reid Schaefer (Ekholm deal), Zach Dean (for Barbashev), Nils Lundqvist, maybe a few others. But those aren't blue chip guys, more later 1st guys that teams are more comfortable giving up.

Even the Meier deal, people thought NJD would have to give up a guy like Holtz, and they didn't.

You might be able to find a deal where a guy has fallen down the depth chart (e.g. Tippet being dealt to Philly) but your point is valid, that teams generally don't trade good prospects. You are often better to take the picks and let your scouts do the work.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by butterfly

It didn't work out with those particular players in that instance. These players were available at that stage of that draft:

There are always guys available, really the point is it comes down to if you can identify them.

So really if they think the prospect they are trading for is better than the guy they are potentially getting in that range of the draft then that's their call.

Don't think there is really a right or wrong way here in terms of what you prioritize. The key is being flexible and open to anything in return (don't lock on "just picks" or "just prospects", or that you need to get 3 pieces back) and maximizing assets, whether in the form of picks or prospects. And quality over quantity for sure should also be the focus.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Not a Flames target, but I suspect Chicago is going to try and dump Perry somewhere.

I predict he'll never play in the NHL again.

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

There are always guys available, really the point is it comes down to if you can identify them.

So really if they think the prospect they are trading for is better than the guy they are potentially getting in that range of the draft then that's their call.

Don't think there is really a right or wrong way here in terms of what you prioritize. The key is being flexible and open to anything in return (don't lock on "just picks" or "just prospects", or that you need to get 3 pieces back) and maximizing assets, whether in the form of picks or prospects. And quality over quantity for sure should also be the focus.

Oh, I absolutely agree with you there. My argument was that ELCs, prospects, and draft picks are not overrated assets. In fact, they almost exclusively comprise the entire list of assets (along with underpaid roster players).

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Hide your mom's!

That story if true is crazy lol.

Reminds of the time rumours started about Delonte West and Lebron and they had to get rid of him.

[Sylvanfan]

Unless a team has recently changed Management I think getting decent prospects is really tough. Teams highly overvalued their own drafted players because they have an emotional attachment to them. Whereas a future pick, the team has not made the personal investment yet.

If you can shed cap and do have an extra first you can use that to get a decent established player. I did pan the Canucks on the Hronek trade last year, but it's going to be tough to draft a player who produces more than he is with that pick. Although the Flames don't have a Perersson or Hughes on the team right now...so I still don't think that strategy would work for the Flames.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

That story if true is crazy lol.

Reminds of the time rumours started about Delonte West and Lebron and they had to get rid of him.

What's the story?

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

What's the story?

Took home a team mates mom. But not just any team mates, one he was brought in to mentor.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Took home a team mates mom. But not just any team mates, one he was brought in to mentor.

He was just really committed to the father figure role

[Monahammer]

Total yikes, hadn't seen that rumor until mentioned here. Perry will get blacklisted for that if true, imo.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

So Perry ####ed Bedard's mom?

Now his disappearance makes sense. Hopefully they find the body.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by butterfly

Oh, I absolutely agree with you there. My argument was that ELCs, prospects, and draft picks are not overrated assets. In fact, they almost exclusively comprise the entire list of assets (along with underpaid roster players).

Yeah I hate when I hear things like "We needed 3 pieces in return" or "The return has to include a young roster player"

You're boxing yourself in and also limiting your market when you set firm criteria like that.

Each negotiation with each team should be independent from one another, because each team's available assets are different.

Negotiate separately, try to get each teams best offer, and then make the decision based on what the best offer is as a whole. Not because your criteria was met to check off the box you had.

[dustygoon]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Total yikes, hadn't seen that rumor until mentioned here. Perry will get blacklisted for that if true, imo.

So Oilers will try to trade for him!

[Sled]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Total yikes, hadn't seen that rumor until mentioned here. Perry will get blacklisted for that if true, imo.

Bedard "Perry, how quickly you think I'm going to pass your stats?"

Perry "Doesn't matter because I @#$%ed your mom!"

That might be the most savage team Rat thing I've heard of, Perry wins all time best team Rat.