2023/2024 Trade Rumors and Speculation Thread

[dammage79]

I was think Vladar is more like Reto Berra

[iggyloob12]

Originally Posted by dammage79

I was think Vladar is more like Reto Berra

Except Vladar won't get the Flames a second rounder.

[dino7c]

I think he is more like Marc D'Amour

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Also if the Flames are entertaining the idea of trading Markstrom they probably want to keep Vladar around

for now

Yeah, if they can actually find a home for Markstrom then they can throw Vladar to the wolves while Wolf gets acclimatized

[dissentowner]

Here is the trend I always see here. Poster suggests a prospect from a team as a return in a trade. Other posters say that team would not move that prospect. Rinse and repeat.

Truth is we don't know who values what or who could be moved or couldn't. This is like a HF phenomenon that is starting to make its way here where any decent prospect is worth more than any established player. You can go back year after year there and see posters saying so and so prospect is not available and then at some point they are dealt.

The most overrated piece by far by fans is a 1st round pick. Yes, you can get a star player with a 1st rnd pick but the majority of them statistically end up busts. That is why I always say unless that 1st is a lottery pick in a good draft I would rather trade for good young players who have shown something.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Here is the trend I always see here. Poster suggests a prospect from a team as a return in a trade. Other posters say that team would not move that prospect. Rinse and repeat.

Truth is we don't know who values what or who could be moved or couldn't. This is like a HF phenomenon that is starting to make its way here where any decent prospect is worth more than any established player. You can go back year after year there and see posters saying so and so prospect is not available and then at some point they are dealt.

The most overrated piece by far by fans is a 1st round pick. Yes, you can get a star player with a 1st rnd pick but the majority of them statistically end up busts. That is why I always say unless that 1st is a lottery pick in a good draft I would rather trade for good young players who have shown something.

agree

I said it two times yesterday...the highest ever pick in Flames FRANCHISE history has a career high of 49 points

but late firsts and 2nds are very likely better than that to some who don't understand statistics

Keep all your own picks, trade UFAs/assets gained from UFAs for young players who you think are about to pop

there is such a thing as too many picks, you can only develop so many players of a certain age properly not to mention sign them

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by dino7c

agree

I said it two times yesterday...the highest ever pick in Flames FRANCHISE history has a career high of 49 points

but late firsts and 2nds are very likely better than that to some who don't understand statistics

Strong disagree.

The flames have very limited top 10 picks ever. Picking top 4 in a weaker year than most is not proof that those picks don't turn out more often than a bottom half first rounder. Bennett is not a great top 5 pick, I don't think many here will disagree with that overall.

But the flames have two homeruns picked at 6th overall. Monahan and Tkachuk blew away expectations.

The flames are one of only 4 teams in the league never to pick 1st overall. We are due. In the top 3 is by far the most statistically likely place to pick a franchise-altering talent. Our pick of Sam Bennett does not change that absolute fact.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Here is the trend I always see here. Poster suggests a prospect from a team as a return in a trade. Other posters say that team would not move that prospect. Rinse and repeat.

Truth is we don't know who values what or who could be moved or couldn't. This is like a HF phenomenon that is starting to make its way here where any decent prospect is worth more than any established player. You can go back year after year there and see posters saying so and so prospect is not available and then at some point they are dealt.

The most overrated piece by far by fans is a 1st round pick. Yes, you can get a star player with a 1st rnd pick but the majority of them statistically end up busts. That is why I always say unless that 1st is a lottery pick in a good draft I would rather trade for good young players who have shown something.

Yup.

Fans value picks and prospects way too highly, and actual players are given no value

[Sylvanfan]

If you can't figure out that one more year at 2.2 million is making Vladar tough to move...then I don't know what to say....contracts with term are hard to move.

In the case of the Oilers...they need to find a taker for Campbell's deal.

So when you ask why can't Conroy do something, it's because the entire league has collectively swallowed a 10 pound block of cheese whole when it comes to goaltending and cap space. It's slow moving to flush it out.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by dino7c

agree

I said it two times yesterday...the highest ever pick in Flames FRANCHISE history has a career high of 49 points

but late firsts and 2nds are very likely better than that to some who don't understand statistics

Keep all your own picks, trade UFAs/assets gained from UFAs for young players who you think are about to pop

there is such a thing as too many picks, you can only develop so many players of a certain age properly not to mention sign them

I'm not fussed over a great prospect versus a high pick.

Well, Jacques Richard and Tom Lysiak had a few more.

And of course, if you go to the next highest picks you get Monahan and Tkachuk as 6th round picks who did fairly well.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

If you can't figure out that one more year at 2.2 million is making Vladar tough to move...then I don't know what to say....contracts with term are hard to move.

In the case of the Oilers...they need to find a taker for Campbell's deal.

So when you ask why can't Conroy do something, it's because the entire league has collectively swallowed a 10 pound block of cheese whole when it comes to goaltending and cap space. It's slow moving to flush it out.

There is no trade activity of any kind right now, due to cap constraints, yes. But that is more or less always true at this time of year. As the year goes on, the cap becomes less of an issue.

More specifically to Vladar, the key is to wait until injuries make teams more desperate for goalies - happens every year.

Patience is the key here.

[Monahammer]

I agree that generally there's a "shiny new toy" syndrome with prospects and picks... but I think y'all are greatly underestimating the impact of cap implications on these valuations.

Most older established players have contracts at least commiserate with their production. Generally these aren't the players producing way above their contract value. It's the prospects with ELCs that come into the league and play way above their contract value that make pedestrian teams into competitors.

Dallas has been used as an example in the past, but this is exactly what they did. Their top performers have been Hintz, Robertson, Oettinger, heskainen, while they were paying out the teeth to have Seguin and Benn play supporting roles.

There's something to be said about valuing established players, but the cap implications automatically confer significant value on to unproven players with potential upside and ELCs.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

There is no trade activity of any kind right now, due to cap constraints, yes. But that is more or less always true at this time of year. As the year goes on, the cap becomes less of an issue.

More specifically to Vladar, the key is to wait until injuries make teams more desperate for goalies - happens every year.

Patience is the key here.

The Flames have no need to free up cap space or get rid of players. They explicitly stated they would be patient with Zadorov. The fans are getting anxious, but the club clearly isn't.

As we get closer to the deadline we'll see more moves.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by dammage79

I was think Vladar is more like Reto Berra

It's weird because I don't think Vladar is that good because he always looks shaky to me but he's 32-16-9 in his career which is pretty decent. Clearly for whatever reason he's received some goal support when he's in net.

[atb]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Flames should be making 25-30+ picks in the next 3 drafts.

As of right now they have 18 picks in the next three drafts. That's a 3 pick deficit.

An 8-10-3 team that is up against the cap and won a total of 1 playoff series in the last 8 years should not currently have a draft pick deficit.

The Flames need to follow what the Predators have done. Preds had two draft picks in each the first 4 rounds. This year they have their 1st, three picks in the 2nd round, two picks in the 3rd, three picks in the 4th. Over two years:

1st x 3
2nd x 5
3rd x 4
4th x 5
5th x 2
6th x 3
7th x 2

24 draft picks over two years, 6 more picks than the Flames will make over the next 3 years. The Flames amateur scouts have been amongst the best in the league, it would be exciting to see what they could do with a significant amount of draft capital.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

There is no trade activity of any kind right now, due to cap constraints, yes. But that is more or less always true at this time of year. As the year goes on, the cap becomes less of an issue.

More specifically to Vladar, the key is to wait until injuries make teams more desperate for goalies - happens every year.

Patience is the key here.

This is where I think the extra year of term makes it harder to move. If it's a one year deal, than teams can manage LTIR space if need be. But to absorb the deal next year I think limits how teams will look at Vladar. Even if its a one year deal though...contracts of this value are still hard to move at this time of year.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by atb

The Flames need to follow what the Predators have done. Preds had two draft picks in each the first 4 rounds. This year they have their 1st, three picks in the 2nd round, two picks in the 3rd, three picks in the 4th. Over two years:

1st x 3
2nd x 5
3rd x 4
4th x 5
5th x 2
6th x 3
7th x 2

24 draft picks over two years, 6 more picks than the Flames will make over the next 3 years. The Flames amateur scouts have been amongst the best in the league, it would be exciting to see what they could do with a significant amount of draft capital.

Chicago over the next 2 years have 4 1st, 2 2nds and 4 3rds as well.

[GioforPM]

Not a Flames target, but I suspect Chicago is going to try and dump Perry somewhere.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Strong disagree.

The flames have very limited top 10 picks ever. Picking top 4 in a weaker year than most is not proof that those picks don't turn out more often than a bottom half first rounder. Bennett is not a great top 5 pick, I don't think many here will disagree with that overall.

But the flames have two homeruns picked at 6th overall. Monahan and Tkachuk blew away expectations.

The flames are one of only 4 teams in the league never to pick 1st overall. We are due. In the top 3 is by far the most statistically likely place to pick a franchise-altering talent. Our pick of Sam Bennett does not change that absolute fact.

did you even read what I said?

I said KEEP ALL YOUR OWN PICKS

I would prefer good to very young players to late first and 2nds.

My point is people over value picks IMO...not all picks, if someone wants to give us a top 5 pick sure.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Not a Flames target, but I suspect Chicago is going to try and dump Perry somewhere.

Hide your mom's!