[Trade] Flames trade Baertschi to VAN for a 2015 2nd round pick (Baertschi requested trade)

[Resolute 14]

Also in fairness, GioforPM, there were at least four Glencross trade threads over the last three months that probably encompass 2000 posts.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Don't say that. That doesn't fit the jilted fan's narrative

Agree, that sort of thinking seriously ######s the progress of revisionist history.

I would think by this point in the thread the rationalization exercise would be complete; how long is this going to take, people?

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

In fairness, he informed the team he would not re-sign (as is his right), after he felt the org had given up on him.

If that's his attitude then we're better off without him anyway, even if he turns out. He's obviously guilty of thinking he's better than he is or thinking he is bigger than the team, or both. I'm confident Treliving will find a way to fill out the roster without the almighty Sven Baertschi playing 2nd line LW. Such selfish, egocentric players are not the type you win with anyway, unless they possess elite skill, which Sven clearly does not.

[sureLoss]

Yeah the Glencross trade was expected and discussed for weeks. Return for Glencross was also not surprising.

Baertschi trade caught a lot of people off guard, especially to a division rival.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

In fairness, he informed the team he would not re-sign (as is his right), after he felt the org had given up on him.

It makes me wonder how much the Canucks have to offer him in his next contract though. It is going to a one-way in all likelihood given Baertschi's stance that he is an NHL player.

The fact that he determined this early that he would not sign with the Flames makes me think that his agent or daddy already talked to some KHL teams to see what they would pay. I am guessing the Canucks at least need to beat those offers.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

If that's his attitude then we're better off without him anyway, even if he turns out. He's obviously guilty of thinking he's better than he is or thinking he is bigger than the team, or both. I'm confident Treliving will find a way to fill out the roster without the almighty Sven Baertschi playing 2nd line LW. Such selfish, egocentric players are not the type you win with anyway, unless they possess elite skill, which Sven clearly does not.

Selfish? Egocentric?

You won't find a single person with anything bad to say about Baertschi as a person, in fact the opposite. He felt he wasn't going to get a chance, so he used the only currency he had. This isn't your average career path, things need to go right for a hockey player to make the NHL.

I'm sorry you're so upset about it all, but inserting character flaws is a little ridiculous

[indes]

Can't blame a guy for doing what he thinks is best for himself. I would've loved to see him stick around and reach potential here but it became clear this season, that wasn't going to happen. I hope he busts for the Canucks though!

[Bingo]

For my money I'd rather have the Flames risk now than the Canucks.

Calgary needs to turn a 2nd round pick into something, and the timeline on that something is in the range of 5 years. Could be a good selection or a package to move up. If Baertschi fails then the pressure to turn the pick into something drops off the map.

The Canucks have to get him mentally capable of winning a job and staying in Vancouver and they only have 6 weeks of a hockey season left to do it. If he isn't ready and they send him down they lose either by Baertschi getting claimed or by him not getting claimed meaning he has zero NHL value. This all comes to bare in this calendar (before Xmas of 2015)

Had Calgary not dealt him for a good return that would be the Flames timeline.

It no longer is.

Calgary can succeed regardless of what Baertschi does if they use their pick wisely.
Vancouver needs one specific outcome and it has to happen in the fall.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Don't say that. That doesn't fit the jilted fan's narrative

Do I really have to be jilted to support the team over the player in this instance? Because I certainly don't feel jilted, more relieved actually. It'll be nice to have all the consternation that was/is the Sven Baertschi saga die what I'm assuming will be a very slow death. At least the process has started finally. There was more drama regarding this prospect than any other in recent memory (not including Erixon), it'll be great once his name finally fades away. We can focus more on prospects that actually want to be here and who aren't so completely full of themselves.

[Robbob]

I also think that the price the Flames got at deadline this year would be a lot better than June-Oct 2015 if they had kept him and tried to trade his rights in the off season. Which is why I think it was an okay deal for the flames under the circumstances.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Selfish? Egocentric?

You won't find a single person with anything bad to say about Baertschi as a person, in fact the opposite. He felt he wasn't going to get a chance, so he used the only currency he had. This isn't your average career path, things need to go right for a hockey player to make the NHL.

I'm sorry you're so upset about it all, but inserting character flaws is a little ridiculous

He said the right things to the media, spin it how you want. The trade request and ultimatum tells me all I need to know, thanks. The dude was prepared to play in Europe rather that wear our icky jersey. All before his ELC had even expired and before he had proven a damned thing.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Also in fairness, GioforPM, there were at least four Glencross trade threads over the last three months that probably encompass 2000 posts.

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Yeah the Glencross trade was expected and discussed for weeks. Return for Glencross was also not surprising.

Baertschi trade caught a lot of people off guard, especially to a division rival.

I acknowledge both of those points and I agree with them. That said, the surprise is over now yet the thread is still going on (about the same stuff, generally) There were, in fairness, there were plenty of threads about prospects, future lines and call-ups that involved Sven. As well as general trade threads. And he's found his way into a couple others even now.

But I would have thought there'd be a lot more "now who fits into the Glencross slot now and next year" talk.

Anyway, it was maybe unexpected (though lots of people put him into packages in their proposals), and yes, he was a first round pick 4 years ago. But he was still a minor leaguer who played a handful of NHL games. And he broke CP. I understand why. I just find it really interesting.

[Nme-Territory]

Going all the way back to training camp in 2013, I thought Sven was done in Calgary. Actually, make that the young stars tournament... he greatly underwhelmed when he should have been the brightest star. Even this year, he was outplayed and outcompeted by players much lower on the depth chart. I am not surprised that he was traded, I was just caught off guard by who he went to.

In the end, he doesn't add to the culture this team is building and I feel like the Flames are better off without him.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

between #11 and #30 of the 2011 draft Sven is by far the best forward.

Not sure how you came to this conclusion, unless it's just your opinion.

15 - JT Miller - NYR - 38 games, 14 points.
30 - Rackell - ANA - 54 games, 24 points.

Not to mention Armia and Jensen who many would consider on at least equal footing as Sven right now. Not sure what Sven has done that makes him so much more highly touted than players playing on very good NHL teams at the moment.

[Fan in Exile]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

He said the right things to the media, spin it how you want. The trade request and ultimatum tells me all I need to know, thanks. The dude was prepared to play in Europe rather that wear our icky jersey. All before his ELC had even expired and before he had proven a damned thing.

Prepared to play in Europe for a year instead of wearing our icky jersey?! Who would want a guy like that on our team?!

Or as our captain?

I understand the trade since he wanted out. I understand why he wanted out. Too bad it didn't work out. I expect he'll put it together in Vancouver.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I acknowledge both of those points and I agree with them. That said, the surprise is over now yet the thread is still going on (about the same stuff, generally) There were, in fairness, there were plenty of threads about prospects, future lines and call-ups that involved Sven. As well as general trade threads. And he's found his way into a couple others even now.

Well, it's bloated by the initial shock and outrage, and the reason it's still going is that the initial shock and outrage has taken some time to quell in favour of the narrative that's been manufactured over the course of 1000+ posts to get everyone comfortable with the situation.

As has been said, the GlenX trade was essentially pre-justified, as are most when a guy is on the block. The return on that was basically as expected, except by a few optimistic people. Doesn't take that much communal effort to convince everyone to get on board with it.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Fan in Exile

Prepared to play in Europe for a year instead of wearing our icky jersey?! Who would want a guy like that on our team?!

Or as our captain?

I understand the trade since he wanted out. I understand why he wanted out. Too bad it didn't work out. I expect he'll put it together in Vancouver.

Gio wanted a 1 way deal, he didn't demand a trade. Different situations.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

Gio wanted a 1 way deal, he didn't demand a trade. Different situations.

Yup.

Giordano didn't want to sign the particular deal that the Flames offered him.

Baertschi made it known that he would not sign, no matter what deal the Flames offered him.

There's a world of difference.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

Do I really have to be jilted to support the team over the player in this instance? Because I certainly don't feel jilted, more relieved actually. It'll be nice to have all the consternation that was/is the Sven Baertschi saga die what I'm assuming will be a very slow death. At least the process has started finally. There was more drama regarding this prospect than any other in recent memory (not including Erixon), it'll be great once his name finally fades away. We can focus more on prospects that actually want to be here and who aren't so completely full of themselves.

You don't have to paint one a villain and one a martyr to pick a side. I'm happy with the trade based on how things were trending and think Treliving got the best he could for a diminishing asset. It wasn't working for Sven, so I don't think he's selfish for using his only currency to better his entire future.

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Two guys basically force a trade, one because he's a UFA who won't re-sign and one who will be an RFA and won't re-sign. Both have had lots of detractors and supporters here. One is a long time Flame, who's been a leader on the team and has scored a lot of goals for the Flames, so like him or not, the departure has a big impact on the actual team, by creating a hole that must be filled. The other played around 50 games, played a handful this year without any goals or defensive play, and wasn't on the roster at the time of the trade, nor was he going to be any time soon.

Which trade topic gets less than 500 posts and which one breaks CP? I find that interesting and indicative of New Era's take.

I think this misrepresents, or at least simplifies too much, the Glencross case. Had dollars and term made sense, he would have signed in Calgary. Sven was simply not going to re-sign, no matter what, while Glencross was a case of negotiations being too far apart.