2012/13 General Heat Discussion Thread

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

The good news: Syvlester's first game back from injury and he's got two assists already this game.

The bad news: Heat were up 2-1 going into the second period, but the Stars responded and scored two very quick goals to open the second frame. And Ward... wait for it... pulled Taylor! Brust in.

EDIT - Yikes, what a collapse. The Heat have blown their lead and have allowed three unanswered goals. 4-2 early in the second. A Heat player ran Nihlstorp and Martin responded via a fight. Welcome back Martin!

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Can anyone point me in the direction where I can find TOI stats for the Heat?

Unfortunately no. I believe in the '06 season the AHL stopped declaring TOI publicly. Media people are given TOI sheets after each period, but other than that, no dice.

[StrykerSteve]

How's Baertschi looked tonight, PMM?

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by StrykerSteve

How's Baertschi looked tonight, PMM?

Not sure. Just listening to the game, but he seems very involved. No points to show for it though.

[Ashasx]

Another loss. Heat aren't going to make the playoffs.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Another loss. Heat aren't going to make the playoffs.

That seems incredible considering how they started. WTF is going on down there?

[Ashasx]

Nobody can move the puck on the back end (awful blue line overall), lack of confidence up front.

A team that can't score and can't keep the puck out of their net.

Just more reason IMO to get Ramage, Wotherspoon, and Culkin all in there next year.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

That seems incredible considering how they started. WTF is going on down there?

This may sound inappreciable, but the more and more I think about it, Brodie was a massive factor in this team's ability to win games.

Since Baertschi's been sent down, they've started scoring more than 0 goals (even though Sven hasn't got on the score sheet). Maybe that's a bright spot you can look at.

Taylor's still playing like a freak. If there's a goalie to go all the way to the Calder Cup with, I think it's him.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Nobody can move the puck on the back end (awful blue line overall), lack of confidence up front.

A team that can't score and can't keep the puck out of their net.

Just more reason IMO to get Ramage, Wotherspoon, and Culkin all in there next year.

I thought of him a few weeks ago and thought, "really? Is he physically mature enough to put up with the grind of an AHL season?"

Then I found out he's 6'1" 182 lbs, which is the same size and weight as Brodie. So yeah, I think he's physically mature enough.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Pierre "Monster" McGuire

I thought of him a few weeks ago and thought, "really? Is he physically mature enough to put up with the grind of an AHL season?"

Then I found out he's 6'1" 182 lbs, which is the same size and weight as Brodie. So yeah, I think he's physically mature enough.

I don't see what he could gain from playing what would essentially be an overage season in the CHL. The AHL is where you learn to adapt to those things.

If I wasn't so worried about the Flames current development system, I'd have everyone of our prospects in the AHL if I could.

[Francis's Hairpiece]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Nobody can move the puck on the back end (awful blue line overall), lack of confidence up front.

A team that can't score and can't keep the puck out of their net.

Just more reason IMO to get Ramage, Wotherspoon, and Culkin all in there next year.

I saw this and immediately thought " so that they could be sat in favor of Mckelvie, Lamb, and Callahan?"

I agree with your thought, I just hope they are given a shot and given more time to adjust than, say, Ferland, before being benched.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by Francis's Hairpiece

I saw this and immediately thought " so that they could be sat in favor of Mckelvie, Lamb, and Callahan?"

I agree with your thought, I just hope they are given a shot and given more time to adjust than, say, Ferland, before being benched.

And what legitimate prospect sat for either of McKelvie or Callahan? I did not include Lamb because he was a college free agent who signed an ELC and is a legit prospect himself.

I also have to question why people keep bringing up Ferland like he is some good example of mismanagement. He is an example of a player who wasn't prepared to go pro. He wasn't just benched by Ward, he was also benched in Utah, which should tell you something about him if 2 different coaches didn't think playing him was a benefit to the team.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by Francis's Hairpiece

I saw this and immediately thought " so that they could be sat in favor of Mckelvie, Lamb, and Callahan?"

I agree with your thought, I just hope they are given a shot and given more time to adjust than, say, Ferland, before being benched.

I hear what you're saying, but Ward said a couple of weeks ago that if those exact guys (include Matczak and MacKenzie) don't perform now, "there will be guys from junior and college that will come April."

So he's prepared to put the likes of Wotherspoon, Ramage, and Culkin in IF the existing guys aren't getting the job done.

[Husky]

Originally Posted by Pierre "Monster" McGuire

I hear what you're saying, but Ward said a couple of weeks ago that if those exact guys (include Matczak and MacKenzie) don't perform now, "there will be guys from junior and college that will come April."

So he's prepared to put the likes of Wotherspoon, Ramage, and Culkin in IF the existing guys aren't getting the job done.

Thats the thing though it shouldnt matter "if those guys arent getting it done". I do not see any of those guys being NHLers or anything worth while for the Flames pro team. Give the prospects the time and work with them through the ups and downs as the chance of them making it and being worthwhile is much more.

[Ashasx]

Ferland played a total of 7 games with the Heat, playing 5 minutes a night. He was never given much of a chance.

That's simply unacceptable in my eyes.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by Husky

Thats the thing though it shouldnt matter "if those guys arent getting it done". I do not see any of those guys being NHLers or anything worth while for the Flames pro team. Give the prospects the time and work with them through the ups and downs as the chance of them making it and being worthwhile is much more.

Good point. And I agree.

But there are a bunch of other factors at play, unfortunately. There's the matter of getting into the playoffs which adds to teaching prospects how to prepare and (hopefully) thrive in a post-season atmosphere. There's also the matter of meritocracy. If a guy like MacKenzie (who is has recently turned into a big minute d-man for the Heat) is playing lights out, I don't think Ward should have to give a spot to Ramage, for example, just because he's a Flames draft pick.

Also, the thing with defensive prospects joining the team straight out of college or juniors is it'll generally take about a week or two of practice to learn Luke Strand's defensive system before they get a game in.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Ferland played a total of 7 games with the Heat, playing 5 minutes a night. He was never given much of a chance.

That's simply unacceptable in my eyes.

Ferland showed up to training camp completely out of shape. That's simply unacceptable in the coach's eyes.

His lack of conditioning meant he didn't earn a role any greater than he received. Especially in a lockout year where guys like Baertschi and Brodie were pushing players off the roster. It was the hardest year to win a significant role on the Heat and he destroyed his own chances by not showing up in shape.

Why do you think the organization should hand major roles to players who aren't in the shape to play them? Sounds pretty stupid to me. You excuse the player completely for something he had total control over and then blame the coaching staff instead. Makes no sense.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Ferland showed up to training camp completely out of shape. That's simply unacceptable in the coach's eyes.

His lack of conditioning meant he didn't earn a role any greater than he received. Especially in a lockout year where guys like Baertschi and Brodie were pushing players off the roster. It was the hardest year to win a significant role on the Heat and he destroyed his own chances by not showing up in shape.

Why do you think the organization should hand major roles to players who aren't in the shape to play them? Sounds pretty stupid to me. You excuse the player completely for something he had total control over and then blame the coaching staff instead. Makes no sense.

Kadri also apparently showed up to training camp out of shape. Look at him now.

It's always the same excuses for our prospects. "Out of shape", "Was never really that good". Look at other franchises.

At what point do we start blaming the team for continued failure in every way?

[JiriHrdina]

Kadri's "out of shape" wasn't comparable to Ferlands. Ferland wasn't ready to play any pro hockey. Blaming anyone but him is silly.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

From Pinder's interview with Sven a few days ago:

He says things have gotten complicated for him lately. When made the team out of camp, it was always in the back of his mind that he might get sent back down. Then he started to get comfortable in the NHL and thought he'd stay up there permanently. He bought a house and a car in Calgary and everything was good.

Then he got sent down and it's been a bit of a whirlwind for him lately.

However, he seems genuinely excited about the opportunity ahead of him with the Heat.

He said he can do things down here that he can't do in the NHL. He says the game is a bit slower, so he can try things. He's excited about the amount of ice time and the situations he's being put in down here.

I say we all be patient with the guy. When the dust settles and he gets his game back in gear, we'll know it. A lot of people on here are shocked and bewildered that he hasn't got on the scoresheet in two games yet, but put yourself in his shoes for a second. It would take an abnormally mentally stable person to be able to go through what he went through these last couple of weeks.