TSN: 2 teammates independently corroborate Akim Aliu's allegations against Peters

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Why can't people can't wait for both sides of a story to come out before making judgements?

We don't need Peters side, what don't you get about that? The accusation was confirmed by other players, it doesn't matter what Peters says, we know he said it. Why can't you understand that?

[kukkudo]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Exposed as what?

As a Bill Peters Supporter haha

[Strange Brew]

I’m not as into the due diligence that the Flames and Hurricanes did or didn’t do. The more damning thing here is why stuff like this gets covers up and silenced in the first place. How can everyone in the league not have heard about this incident?

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by kukkudo

As a Bill Peters Supporter haha

At best. The alternative is definitely not a good look.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I’m not as into the due diligence that the Flames and Hurricanes did or didn’t do. The more damning thing here is why stuff like this gets covers up and silenced in the first place. How can everyone in the league not have heard about this incident?

I have no doubt that lots of players knew. But whether or not players would ever make it public or talk to someone in management is another issue entirely.

[stone hands]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I’m not as into the due diligence that the Flames and Hurricanes did or didn’t do. The more damning thing here is why stuff like this gets covers up and silenced in the first place. How can everyone in the league not have heard about this incident?

akim didnt want to sewer any chances of making a career playing hockey

bill peters obviously wouldnt tell anyone

traditionally in a hockey locker room(pretty much any one, i've witnessed some stuff personally and never played at a level to write home about) there is some awful, awful stuff said about people that you just dont talk about to people outside the room

i think the fact that the captain went to talk to bill peters and then akim and bill had a meeting meant that was the end of that for most of the guys in the room until today

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by nik-

What fact would Peters' provide that makes it ok to you? It's no longer hearsay, other players have confirmed his behaviour.

That's not what I'm getting at. The story is likely true and can't be denied, but we can't live in a world where people's lives are ruined by unsubstantiated tweets and something run by a media outlet before the whole story has unraveled.

TSN presenting the confirming of his action by other players is the hearsay at the moment. The team can come out with direct official statements from Aliu, the other players that were present, any statement from Bill about what happened.

It's a slippery slope otherwise. If corroboration from other people is enough evidence, people can collude to ruin someone's life for any motive, without any actual evidence.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Hearsay would be if Aliu told his teammates what was said and then they said that was what happened, purely on Aliu's word.

What happened here were fellow teammates confirming that they WITNESSED the events, one of them even approaching Peters after to discuss the incident.

We have enough facts at this point. Besides which, Peters hasn't said anything to try and deny these accusations yet. Perhaps he cannot because it's absolutely true, and perhaps he is avoiding the media until things calm down. Either way, it doesn't matter when you have multiple people saying the same version of events. This is not a he said/he said situation anymore.

His teammates have now told a media outlet, not a court.

[jiginla12]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

That's not what I'm getting at. The story is likely true and can't be denied, but we can't live in a world where people's lives are ruined by unsubstantiated tweets and something run by a media outlet before the whole story has unraveled.

TSN presenting the confirming of his action by other players is the hearsay at the moment. The team can come out with direct official statements from Aliu, the other players that were present, any statement from Bill about what happened.

It's a slippery slope otherwise. If corroboration from other people is enough evidence, people can collude to ruin someone's life for any motive, without any actual evidence.

Here is the biggest example of that; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emmett_Till

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

It’s actually asinine anyone could assign culpability to Tre on this. If you’re an exec hiring a manager for your business you speak to that manager’s former colleagues (other managers) and more likely his superiors. You pretty much never call his former employees asking for their opinions. It’s just not how hiring is done in most cases. You might look at the results of hat manager’s employees but you’d rarely talk to them directly.

The hierarchy is a little different in professional sports compared to a business though. The "employees" in this case are the talent and are paid accordingly (there's a reason most coaches get 4th liner salaries). How many other businesses operate like that?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

His teammates have now told a media outlet, not a court.

There is not going to be a court.

Aliu tweeted on his own. That, at least, is not hearsay. To the extent the media is reporting actual words verbatim, and not an interpretation, that's not hearsay either, it's more like a recording.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Boy, if I hired someone who created this much negative press for my organization, and it was basically my personal endorsement that sold the hire, I'd be actively looking at employment elsewhere.

Jiri, imagine you hire someone at the radio station who is later accused some pretty awful workplace harrasment, and it was your endorsement of this individual that got this person hired in the first place.

Do you think there'd be heat on you?

Depends entirely on how I handled the situation.
I would expect the following
- I would be largely judged on how I handled it
- I would be asked and expected to review my personal hiring processes and steps I too to identify any gaps
- I would be expected to report back on those findings and specify how I would ensure it wouldn't happen again.

But no. If I hired someone that ended up being a racist - I don't think there would be a ton of heat on me. Unless I kept that person around.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

There is not going to be a court.

Aliu tweeted on his own. That, at least, is not hearsay. To the extent the media is reporting actual words verbatim, and not an interpretation, that's not hearsay either, it's more like a recording.

I'm not calling Aliu's tweets or the corroboration by the other present players as hearsay.

[icecube]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

So much irrational lynching without the whole story going on in here as usual.

Really?

[nik-]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

That's not what I'm getting at. The story is likely true and can't be denied, but we can't live in a world where people's lives are ruined by unsubstantiated tweets and something run by a media outlet before the whole story has unraveled.

TSN presenting the confirming of his action by other players is the hearsay at the moment. The team can come out with direct official statements from Aliu, the other players that were present, any statement from Bill about what happened.

It's a slippery slope otherwise. If corroboration from other people is enough evidence, people can collude to ruin someone's life for any motive, without any actual evidence.

Sorry, you clearly don't know what unsubstantiated or hearsay mean. Your posts are really bad.

[afc wimbledon]

There is no hearsay in this case, everyone involved was present and heard the conversation. Hearsay means you didn't hear it yourself, you were told about it by someone who was present.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Does removing Treliving AND Peters have a better reputational and product/consumer outcome than keeping Treliving in place?

I think it might. Especially with Maloney waiting in the wings able to pick up the slack without skipping a beat.

I don't think it does. I would conclude that the organization is reactionary with such a decision.
So far BT is handling this correctly.

Bill Peters is at fault here. That's it.

I don't know why we are rushing around to get other people fired because a racist idiot finally got exposed.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I have no doubt that lots of players knew. But whether or not players would ever make it public or talk to someone in management is another issue entirely.

I mean that’s kind of the issue. I have no doubt that players would have talked about this among themselves. This isn’t about a guy being hard on people. You have a problem with culture if everyone is afraid to speak up to decision makers about things that are obviously wrong.

And also, this was 10 years ago. I imagine there are people in management at various levels now who were players then who know about this.

[DJones]

Why are people going after Treliving?

I don't get that, how could anyone expect him to know the story.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

There is no hearsay in this case, everyone involved was present and heard the conversation. Hearsay means you didn't hear it yourself, you were told about it by someone who was present.

And you were told by a media outlet that other players have corroborated the story but weren't present yourself to hear those corroborations.