2023/2024 Trade Rumors and Speculation Thread

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

Sec, dissent...waiting on you guys lol.

I have heard nothing in regards to a Vladar trade being imminent.

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

LOL

Vladar is a valuable asset - trading him for a 7th (or anything similar to that) is brutal asset management

I would take a 7th for Markstrom! even an 8th rounder!...

[Muta]

Vladar for Makar. C'mon Avs, do it you cowards

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

THe value of the cap space doesn't change much, but as goalies get injured, the value of goalies goes up. The best time to trade a backup goalie is during the season, when other teams need a body.

It could swing the cap by a few million. If you trade Valdar and bring up Wolf, that saves us $1.4mil and gives us about $1.1 mil caps space on day 1. That's about $5.5 to $6 mil come deadline day.

Trade him in December after a good start, you have $3 mil space.

Depends on what the plan is come deadline, but like I said you have 1 of 3 scenarios play out where all have value. Worst case scenario is we broker deals like the wild did and get a couple 4ths on top of a 4th now vs holding on to Vladar and hoping he gets off to a good start and you get a 3rd or a 2nd. IMO a 2nd is not happening so is 1 3rd better than 3 4ths? IMO the cap space is more valuable.

Vladar would have to steal the #1 job and become a legit NHL starter before I would even care if we lose him. Unless Wolf is a complete bust, goalies are easier to aquire than any position players. As long as Wolf plays well, I won't care how good Vladar is in Colorado, as long as he isn't a legit star NHL goalie.

Trading him now is better asset management IMO. Hoping for a better return is not an automatic. Gaining the cap space is. Markstrom plays well, Wolf out plays him and we could be stuck with his cap hit is a risk too.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

LOL

Vladar is a valuable asset - trading him for a 7th (or anything similar to that) is brutal asset management

I don't know how valuable he is. A team would just be taking a gamble that he breaks out. I doubt they get much more than a 3rd like they paid for him.

[gvitaly]

Vladar has been a very strange player last season.

On the one hand he took the #1 job from Markstrom for a stretch. In fact I had a higher confidence with him in net half way through the season. He showed the ability to make some grade A saves, but the team also seemed to play better in front of him than infront of Markstrom last season.

However in the second half of the season Vladar was absolutely terrible. He kept getting beat up high, and costing the team games. After Jan 12th, he only had 2 out of 12 games with a sv% over .882%. As a result his analytics, show him as a replacement level goalie. In fact he was one of the worst goalies in terms of goals saved above expected per 60. If we take only goalies that played more than 10 games last season then Vladar is 67th out of 77 in terms of GAE/60. Markstrom was 46th in comparison.

Because the Flames are so close to the cap, I think that trading Vladar now even for a worse return is better. That way the Flames can at least keep more than 21 players on the team and be compliant. Hopefully the team would be able to play Wolf every 3rd/4th game in this scenario.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Bonded

I don't know how valuable he is. A team would just be taking a gamble that he breaks out. I doubt they get much more than a 3rd like they paid for him.

I really think a 4th is best case scenario right now. 2 months for now maybe we get a 3rd, but we could also be stuck with him for this year and next if he does not play well. It's being said like it is an automatic we get more later so hold out. IMO it's not, but it's an automatic we eliminate the risk of being stuck with his contract to trade him now. It's an automatic we gain an asset if we trade him now and it's an automatic that we gain very valuable cap space if we trade him now.

Because of Wolf, you take the automatic. Unless we are getting a 1st for him what is the difference in % of getting something worth something in the 3rd vs 4th? Really? Not a lot. Likely both picks end up being nothing.

[Bingo]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1704220146053869982

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

Vladar has been a very strange player last season.

On the one hand he took the #1 job from Markstrom for a stretch. In fact I had a higher confidence with him in net half way through the season. He showed the ability to make some grade A saves, but the team also seemed to play better in front of him than infront of Markstrom last season.

However in the second half of the season Vladar was absolutely terrible. He kept getting beat up high, and costing the team games. After Jan 12th, he only had 2 out of 12 games with a sv% over .882%. As a result his analytics, show him as a replacement level goalie. In fact he was one of the worst goalies in terms of goals saved above expected per 60. If we take only goalies that played more than 10 games last season then Vladar is 67th out of 77 in terms of GAE/60. Markstrom was 46th in comparison.

Because the Flames are so close to the cap, I think that trading Vladar now even for a worse return is better. That way the Flames can at least keep more than 21 players on the team and be compliant. Hopefully the team would be able to play Wolf every 3rd/4th game in this scenario.

Even early on he got the job not due to very good numbers, more the fact he was getting the W and Markstrom was not. Alot of those W's were due to the team playing better in front of him and better numbers in tight games. Markstrom seemed to have awful numbers when the game was close and good numbers if I recall when losing by 2 or more or winning by 2 or more.

It really had nothing to do with Vladar being great.

100% agree with the cap gains as the most valuable asset right now. Some were talking about Pinto, trading Vladar for a 4th helps us look at other options for a guy like Pinto.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

Even early on he got the job not due to very good numbers, more the fact he was getting the W and Markstrom was not. Alot of those W's were due to the team playing better in front of him and better numbers in tight games. Markstrom seemed to have awful numbers when the game was close and good numbers if I recall when losing by 2 or more or winning by 2 or more.

It really had nothing to do with Vladar being great.

100% agree with the cap gains as the most valuable asset right now. Some were talking about Pinto, trading Vladar for a 4th helps us look at other options for a guy like Pinto.

Yeah, the was winning with Vladar in the net but it wasn't because he was playing lights out. If he played the same number if games as Markstrom his stats would have been worse.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Vladar to COL makes a lot of sense though

He's a good option to come in for Francouz and cap friendly.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Bonded

Yeah, the was winning with Vladar in the net but it wasn't because he was playing lights out. If he played the same number if games as Markstrom his stats would have been worse.

That doesn’t make sense. Vladar generally faced tough opponents when he was called upon, and Markstrom got the majority of starts including the easier teams who were outside of the playoff picture

If he got more starts, he could have drawn easier competition

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Right but explain the downside to me in:
- Wolf getting starter duties in the AHL to max playing time
- While getting called up to get NHL starts. 20-25 for this year
- Vladar is the back-up but can be traded once value can be extracted. At that point Wolf assumes the full time back-up role.

I see Wolf being up and down between the AHL and NHL for a portion of the year, but at some point staying up full time and Vladar is dealt.


Isn't that the ideal scenario?
Why does this have to be fully solved at the start of the season?

It doesn’t have to be solved at the beginning of the season, but if Colorado is willing to give you something in the realm of a 3rd rounder, I don’t think they should be shy about making a decision that Markstrom/Wolf is how they’re going to roll this season, so prepare accordingly.

Wolf doesn’t need to prove anything in pre-season games. He’s the two-time AHL goalie of the year and the reigning MVP. He’s had one NHL start, and he gave up one goal on 24 shots. Barring a meltdown in pre season, you need to give him NHL games and let him practice against NHL players.

They’ve watched him in the Dome the last two years. They know how good he is, and I would guess everyone in the brain trust thinks he’s better than Dan Vladar.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

Vladar to COL makes a lot of sense though

He's a good option to come in for Francouz and cap friendly.

I think WSH could be an option mid season. That's mostly because I think that Kuemper is somewhat injury prone.

Arizona is also interesting with a tandem of Vejmelka and Ingram, they might need help a couple of games into the season. A similar situation is in SJ, but I don't know if either team would be willing to spend assets in a season they're not making the playoffs.

[FlamesAddiction]

Vladar is still pretty young for a goalie. I think there were only like 4 or 5 other goalies in the league his age or younger last season that played 25 or more games and also had a better SA%. Keeping in mind that the Flames in general had bad save percentages between both goalies, it is probably reflective of the team as a whole.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Vladar is still pretty young for a goalie. I think there were only like 4 or 5 other goalies in the league his age or younger last season that played 25 or more games.

Vladar is great - he’s been surpassed by Wolf. They’ll
Probably need pre-season to showcase Vladar, and make it clear Wolf belongs, so there’s no rush to take a lowball offer.

But they can’t keep Wolf in the minors indefinitely, and I suspect they won’t.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

That doesn’t make sense. Vladar generally faced tough opponents when he was called upon, and Markstrom got the majority of starts including the easier teams who were outside of the playoff picture

If he got more starts, he could have drawn easier competition

He wasn’t measurably better than Markstrom. Even during his point streak his save pct was just above .900 and he finished the season with .895%. There wasn’t a point last season where I felt comfortable that either goalie would make the needed save. Vladar could have done better than Markstrom if they flipped games played but I think he would have ended up with worse stats.

[redmile04]

Tanner Pearson has been traded to Montreal

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by redmile04

tanner pearson has been traded to montreal

https://twitter.com/user/status/1704248463003615641

https://twitter.com/user/status/1704250181405823083

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

It doesn’t have to be solved at the beginning of the season, but if Colorado is willing to give you something in the realm of a 3rd rounder, I don’t think they should be shy about making a decision that Markstrom/Wolf is how they’re going to roll this season, so prepare accordingly.

Wolf doesn’t need to prove anything in pre-season games. He’s the two-time AHL goalie of the year and the reigning MVP. He’s had one NHL start, and he gave up one goal on 24 shots. Barring a meltdown in pre season, you need to give him NHL games and let him practice against NHL players.

They’ve watched him in the Dome the last two years. They know how good he is, and I would guess everyone in the brain trust thinks he’s better than Dan Vladar.

Sure if you can get a 3rd for him yes they should trade him now.
But what if they can't. Dump him for nothing?