[Rumour] Flames closing in on signing Zary (3 yrs)

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by stemit14

I could see Zary’s argument for wanting AAV closer to Rossi. If he was given the same opportunities and was given a long run at centre and got to play a powerplay with someone like Kaprisov, his numbers are probably even closer to Rossi.

“If.”

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Which means he’s either extended at 26 or traded for a haul before then.

I'm still scarred from the Tkachuk trade. I would rather see Zary on a 1-2 year deal followed by a big extension instead of walking him so close to UFA.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Wolven

I'm still scarred from the Tkachuk trade. I would rather see Zary on a 1-2 year deal followed by a big extension instead of walking him so close to UFA.

The QO rules have changed so it's a little different.

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The QO rules have changed so it's a little different.

I totally missed that... do tell!

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Wolven

I totally missed that... do tell!

Not sure but in this thead it was said that the calculation was different. Maybe it's AAV related instead of last year salary? I dunno.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Wolven

I'm still scarred from the Tkachuk trade. I would rather see Zary on a 1-2 year deal followed by a big extension instead of walking him so close to UFA.

Zary isn’t good enough to hold onto the way they held onto Tkachuk.

If he’s not signed by that deadline, he’s not going to be a Calgary Flame.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Not sure but in this thead it was said that the calculation was different. Maybe it's AAV related instead of last year salary? I dunno.

The QO at most can be 20% more than what the cap hit was over the life of the deal as opposed to salary in the final season. In the case of Marco Rossi his AAV is 5, and salary in the final year is 6 million. So his QO will be 6 million as its the same number either way. When MT did his he was like 6-6-9. Under current rules his QO would be 8.4 instead of 9.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by calumniate

3.99999995. Because there has to be a 3 in it

An yes...the 'Ian White.'

Gotta leave Conny enough left over for a Subway $5 footlong!

[stemit14]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

“If.”

For sure it’s a big if but in a negotiation, I could see Zary’s camp making that argument. Even when playing well, his overtime minutes were limited. They were cautious with his usage when he returned to the lineup. He lost his shot at centre when frost was acquired. If all those things went differently, injury or not, he likely puts up better numbers and has a chance to call himself a legit centre at this point. Zary’s camp could argue that usage and opportunity (which he does not really control) have limited what he could have proven to be at this point. Flames management will likely argue he just has not proven himself yet. Probably both sides are right to a certain extent.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by stemit14

For sure it’s a big if but in a negotiation, I could see Zary’s camp making that argument. Even when playing well, his overtime minutes were limited. They were cautious with his usage when he returned to the lineup. He lost his shot at centre when frost was acquired. If all those things went differently, injury or not, he likely puts up better numbers and has a chance to call himself a legit centre at this point. Zary’s camp could argue that usage and opportunity (which he does not really control) have limited what he could have proven to be at this point. Flames management will likely argue he just has not proven himself yet. Probably both sides are right to a certain extent.

So just meet in the middle and lets get going. The wiggle on each side must be less than $1 million. It’s not like the Flames have no cap space. I’m not pushing for Conroy to cave. But like you said both sides are right. But both sides will also suffer if Zary misses training camp.

The best deal is when both sides are unhappy. That’s the correct price.

[Geeoff]

Originally Posted by Wolven

I'm still scarred from the Tkachuk trade. I would rather see Zary on a 1-2 year deal followed by a big extension instead of walking him so close to UFA.

Hopefully, Zary becomes the type of player we are concerned about losing

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Zary isn’t good enough to hold onto the way they held onto Tkachuk.

If he’s not signed by that deadline, he’s not going to be a Calgary Flame.

I am not sure any of us have seen enough of Zary to really know that answer. Last season was meant to be his breakout year and he spent most of it on the IR.

If he develops into a top 6 forward then giving him an opportunity to push his way out in a few years would be disappointing to go through again.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by Wolven

I am not sure any of us have seen enough of Zary to really know that answer. Last season was meant to be his breakout year and he spent most of it on the IR.

If he develops into a top 6 forward then giving him an opportunity to push his way out in a few years would be disappointing to go through again.

To me top line and top 6 can be a chasm of difference. If Zary becomes more of a top line guy...no chance he'd take a year deal and flee...if he did pop and wants to leave he'll be worth a good price.

If he's more of a Mangiapane, it's not a huge loss if he moves on.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Wolven

I am not sure any of us have seen enough of Zary to really know that answer. Last season was meant to be his breakout year and he spent most of it on the IR.

If he develops into a top 6 forward then giving him an opportunity to push his way out in a few years would be disappointing to go through again.

Zary is 24 and we still aren’t sure what he is as an NHLer.

We knew Tkachuk was a top-2 or 3 player on the team for years by the time he turned 24.

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

To me top line and top 6 can be a chasm of difference. If Zary becomes more of a top line guy...no chance he'd take a year deal and flee...if he did pop and wants to leave he'll be worth a good price.

If he's more of a Mangiapane, it's not a huge loss if he moves on.

Sure, it would also depend on which position he establishes himself in. If he caps out as a second line winger then we can more easily replace him from our prospect group.

However, if he turns into a good second line center then that is a bigger deal if he decides to force his way out.

Anyway, I am glad to hear that the Flames have a bit more leverage in that last RFA year than they did last time around.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Zary is 24 and we still aren’t sure what he is as an NHLer.

We knew Tkachuk was a top-2 or 3 player on the team for years by the time he turned 24.

You're kind of comparing apples to oranges here. Tkachuk already played for 5 seasons and ~350 games in the NHL by the time he was 24, and that year there were still a lot of questions about his play and character after only putting up 16G, and 43P in 56GP the Canadian Division. I remember many were hoping he'd become a consistent PPG player. That was one of the reasons the Flames signed him to 3 x $7M instead of 8 x $8.5M. I definitely didn't see him as a 100+ point player, and a top 10 Wing in the league.

[Freeway]

Tkachuk was also a unicorn of a player, coming in, playing with Backlund, and immediately figuring out what type of player he needed to be in the NHL. Few prospects ever have that immediate clarity of role and purpose.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

To me top line and top 6 can be a chasm of difference. If Zary becomes more of a top line guy...no chance he'd take a year deal and flee...if he did pop and wants to leave he'll be worth a good price.

If he's more of a Mangiapane, it's not a huge loss if he moves on.

Mangiapane was a 1 season wonder that played a hard game that he stepped back from once he got paid

Zary is better fundamentally

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Goriders

So just meet in the middle and lets get going. The wiggle on each side must be less than $1 million. It’s not like the Flames have no cap space. I’m not pushing for Conroy to cave. But like you said both sides are right. But both sides will also suffer if Zary misses training camp.

The best deal is when both sides are unhappy. That’s the correct price.

The best deal is when both sides are happy. That's the actual best price.

[NegativeSpace]

Originally Posted by Freeway

Tkachuk was also a unicorn of a player, coming in, playing with Backlund, and immediately figuring out what type of player he needed to be in the NHL. Few prospects ever have that immediate clarity of role and purpose.

I would even say his younger brother has taken longer to find out how to play effectively in the NHL.