03-14-2023, 12:37 PM
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#61
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#1 Goaltender
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighLifeMan
Why are we just overlooking that this has been a consistent issue for Darryl Sutter led teams in recent memory? Last year was the anomaly due to the top line being as productive as it was. It's a systematic issue, and the results speak for themselves.
His last three years in LA his teams were analytically dominant yet struggled to consistently win hockey games. Missed the playoffs twice.
After taking over for Geoff Ward the team was an analytically top tier team (top 5-10 in all categories) over it's last 30 games yet had a 15-15 record down the stretch, and missed the playoffs in an extremely easy division.
This year we are an analytically dominant team that struggles to consistently win hockey games, and are a an extreme longshot to make the playoffs.
This is now the fifth time out of the last six years that Darryl's teams have vastly underperformed where the metrics indicate they should be. At what point does it not become about them being unlucky and lacking skill and more so an indication of the limitations of his system in today's game?
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Anyways.. I hope the boys come out with some urgency tonight and don't play down to their opposition. I'd like to see another big game from Huberdeau.
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What would have happened if the Markstrom we currently have showed up all season? Doubt we would be talking about underperforming...
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03-14-2023, 01:01 PM
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#62
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Scoring Winger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighLifeMan
Why are we just overlooking that this has been a consistent issue for Darryl Sutter led teams in recent memory? Last year was the anomaly due to the top line being as productive as it was. It's a systematic issue, and the results speak for themselves.
His last three years in LA his teams were analytically dominant yet struggled to consistently win hockey games. Missed the playoffs twice.
After taking over for Geoff Ward the team was an analytically top tier team (top 5-10 in all categories) over it's last 30 games yet had a 15-15 record down the stretch, and missed the playoffs in an extremely easy division.
This year we are an analytically dominant team that struggles to consistently win hockey games, and are a an extreme longshot to make the playoffs.
This is now the fifth time out of the last six years that Darryl's teams have vastly underperformed where the metrics indicate they should be. At what point does it not become about them being unlucky and lacking skill and more so an indication of the limitations of his system in today's game?
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Anyways.. I hope the boys come out with some urgency tonight and don't play down to their opposition. I'd like to see another big game from Huberdeau.
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How different is "his system" from those of say Tampa Bay or Carolina (legitimate question)? I suspect that the difference is not as dramatic as being described. It is easy to say it's the coach's system when most coaches have similar systems. When Sutter was hired, he said that the system being used by Ward was correct but the team was deconditioned and needed to up their pace of play. Was that wrong?
He's made some puzzling decisions this year, but I still think that coaches win awards when their goalies are on their game. With Markstrom at his career average, this team is getting ready for the playoffs not needing an improbable win streak to stay alive.
A good chunk of this team's offence left in the off season with both Johnny and Matthew being drivers of the team's offence. The guys who came to replace it have not performed the same (and I agree that the line combinations have not helped).
I have not heard any proposed replacement coach (who is willing to come to Calgary) that makes me eager to have Sutter replaced.
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03-14-2023, 01:32 PM
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#63
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toonage
Francis says no changes to the lines tonight, Markstrom starting
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Markstrom is starting until we are mathematically out.
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03-14-2023, 01:34 PM
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#64
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Barthelona
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bingo
Third period with 33 shot attempts, 15 shots and 9 high danger chances seems pretty desperate to me.
This isn't specifically on you, but I swear some judge games by the outcome only.
Like the shoot out win in Minnesota was lauded as a great game by the radio and print media when the Flames should have lost that game 4-1.
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Personally I think we're past the point in the season where fans should just be happy with a good effort, even if it results in a loss. The team should be judged by the outcomes at this point because they've been a little too comfortable with "good games" that don't result in 2 points.
If making the playoffs is the goal, the boys need to be playing like they're down 3-1 in a playoff series from here on out.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by snipetype
k im just not going to respond to your #### anymore because i have better things to do like #### my model girlfriend rather then try to convince people like you of commonly held hockey knowledge.
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03-14-2023, 01:34 PM
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#65
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighLifeMan
Why are we just overlooking that this has been a consistent issue for Darryl Sutter led teams in recent memory? Last year was the anomaly due to the top line being as productive as it was. It's a systematic issue, and the results speak for themselves.
His last three years in LA his teams were analytically dominant yet struggled to consistently win hockey games. Missed the playoffs twice.
After taking over for Geoff Ward the team was an analytically top tier team (top 5-10 in all categories) over it's last 30 games yet had a 15-15 record down the stretch, and missed the playoffs in an extremely easy division.
This year we are an analytically dominant team that struggles to consistently win hockey games, and are a an extreme longshot to make the playoffs.
This is now the fifth time out of the last six years that Darryl's teams have vastly underperformed where the metrics indicate they should be. At what point does it not become about them being unlucky and lacking skill and more so an indication of the limitations of his system in today's game?
----
Anyways.. I hope the boys come out with some urgency tonight and don't play down to their opposition. I'd like to see another big game from Huberdeau.
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I have brought up this point before as well, that his teams may put up a lot of impressive corsi stats but they struggle mightily to score and players numbers dip.
The best player this organization had his numbers drop by 30 plus points under Darryl.
Is the volume thing a way to curb the chance at holding pucks longer and potentially turning it over?
Its not like he has coached teams without talent. So a long history of a lot of strong underlying metrics without the production.
Goes back to what Conroy said he wants to win 1-0 every game. It can work for a period of time but its a hard way to play every game that's why the results show up at first but overtime its just a pace you can't sustain.
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03-14-2023, 01:48 PM
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#66
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: still in edmonton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mass_nerder
Personally I think we're past the point in the season where fans should just be happy with a good effort, even if it results in a loss. The team should be judged by the outcomes at this point because they've been a little too comfortable with "good games" that don't result in 2 points.
If making the playoffs is the goal, the boys need to be playing like they're down 3-1 in a playoff series from here on out.
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Mmmhmm
If they think they have a (slim) shot at the playoffs it has to be about results, not process. It's March, not December.
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03-14-2023, 01:50 PM
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#67
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mass_nerder
Personally I think we're past the point in the season where fans should just be happy with a good effort, even if it results in a loss. The team should be judged by the outcomes at this point because they've been a little too comfortable with "good games" that don't result in 2 points.
If making the playoffs is the goal, the boys need to be playing like they're down 3-1 in a playoff series from here on out.
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No place for moral victories a week or so back, let alone now with 15 games left….
It’s great to see markstrom finally looking like an nhl goaltender again, yet the flames are still hovering around .500 over that period.
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03-14-2023, 02:05 PM
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#68
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Franchise Player
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I hope they leave Markstrom out to dry and see if he's really back or if it's just a hot streak...
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03-14-2023, 02:08 PM
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#69
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Calgary
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GO FLAMES GO
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03-14-2023, 02:15 PM
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#70
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: SW Ontario
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvp2003
I hope they leave Markstrom out to dry and see if he's really back or if it's just a hot streak...
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Why would you hope that?
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03-14-2023, 02:21 PM
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#72
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dissentowner
Why would you hope that?
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It was a (bad) joke...
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03-14-2023, 02:30 PM
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#73
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Owner
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mass_nerder
Personally I think we're past the point in the season where fans should just be happy with a good effort, even if it results in a loss. The team should be judged by the outcomes at this point because they've been a little too comfortable with "good games" that don't result in 2 points.
If making the playoffs is the goal, the boys need to be playing like they're down 3-1 in a playoff series from here on out.
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Certainly was never suggesting showing up is a gold star for the group.
Has to be about results.
But those worried about them showing up seem a little over the top.
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03-14-2023, 02:38 PM
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#74
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Springbank
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvp2003
I hope they leave Markstrom out to dry and see if he's really back or if it's just a hot streak...
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He more or less stole the Minnie game. 40 save shutout. 10 minutes of penalties against his team (not counting the offsetting minors). Flames took 26 shots. Only 6 minutes of PP time drawn (one was the double on Hartman).
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03-14-2023, 02:55 PM
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#75
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Calgary
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Why isn't the team taking the us against the world mentality?
The refs hate us? Eff you! 
The league hates us? Double eff you!!
We'll come out like gang buster and crush everything in our path!
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03-14-2023, 03:27 PM
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#76
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First round-bust
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: speculating about AHL players
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Guys to watch for AZ tonight:
- #63 Matias Maccelli. One of the top young playmakers in the league. Leads all rookies in assists despite being injured for a month. Doesn't shoot much but scored in the last Flames/Coyotes game at Mullett.
- #29 Barrett Hayton. Playing 1C on the Keller line right now and crushing it. Eight points in his last three games. Won gold with Canada (captain) at the 2020 WJC.
- #15 Boko Imama. Called up from the AHL with Christian Fischer hurt. Enforcer who will probably try to fight Lucic. Also just a really great guy off the ice.
Looking forward to following along with this one although I won't be able to watch. I just hope both teams have fun ...
__________________
Need a great deal on a new or pre-owned car? Come see me at Platinum Mitsubishi — 2720 Barlow Trail NE
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03-14-2023, 03:30 PM
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#77
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First Line Centre
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This team always magically plays great once they know the season is over.
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03-14-2023, 03:31 PM
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#78
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Springbank
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheScorpion
Guys to watch for AZ tonight:
- #63 Matias Maccelli. One of the top young playmakers in the league. Leads all rookies in assists despite being injured for a month. Doesn't shoot much but scored in the last Flames/Coyotes game at Mullett.
- #29 Barrett Hayton. Playing 1C on the Keller line right now and crushing it. Eight points in his last three games. Won gold with Canada (captain) at the 2020 WJC.
- #15 Boko Imama. Called up from the AHL with Christian Fischer hurt. Enforcer who will probably try to fight Lucic. Also just a really great guy off the ice.
Looking forward to following along with this one although I won't be able to watch. I just hope both teams have fun ...
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Is Imama the guy that tried to fight Reaves the other night? I think the name was similar but I forget the team.
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03-14-2023, 03:33 PM
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#79
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First round-bust
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: speculating about AHL players
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GioforPM
Is Imama the guy that tried to fight Reaves the other night? I think the name was similar but I forget the team.
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Yes. That was bizarre. No idea what happened there. Almost seemed like neither of them actually wanted to fight.
__________________
Need a great deal on a new or pre-owned car? Come see me at Platinum Mitsubishi — 2720 Barlow Trail NE
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03-14-2023, 03:37 PM
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#80
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Park Hyatt Tokyo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvp2003
I hope they leave Markstrom out to dry and see if he's really back or if it's just a hot streak...
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100%. Going into the offseason you need to know the answer to that question, or else the answers to all other questions around the roster are hard to make decisions on.
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