Former cabinet minister Jim Prentice to seek Alberta PC leadership

[jofillips]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Some politicians just don't seem to understand that while most Albertans are pretty conservative fiscally, it doesn't mean they are also conservative socially.

^^
this

don't start suggesting all rural albertans are bible-toting bigots....

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

So all rural folk are backwoods bigots, eh?

Says pretty much everything one needs to know about your own bigotry.

In defense of SCD, he didn't say that all rural folk are backwoods bigots, and there's really nothing controversial about his comment. Statistically, people living in small towns and rural communities tend to be more socially conservative than their urban counterparts. That's true not only in Alberta but across all of Canada and the United States.

I don't have any hard data to back this up, but I strongly suspect it's simply a matter of city-dwellers being exposed to a greater amount of population diversity on a daily basis whereas smaller communities tend to be ethno-religiously insular. People are less likely to be irrationally hateful of homosexuals (or Muslims or Sikhs or InsertMinorityGroupHere) when they see them every day and have a personal and/or professional relationship with many people belonging to that group.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Fire

Art Pawlowski and his Street Church are idiots and it was a poor move politically by McIver, but the people saying he should resign from the race are bigger idiots.

He doesn't have to resign, but he might as well, since he just torpedoed himself.

[Ashartus]

My view of McIvor has always been that he's a good sort to have in government since he'll question any spending, but that he doesn't have the brains, education or vision to actually lead, so hopefully this will help ensure he doesn't win the party leadership.

[OldDutch]

I only thought he was running to be one of the 2 filler candidates (with Tom L-whatever), the window dressing on a "leadership race" the PC party is having.

I would get the chance he could pull a Ed or Allison and sneak in on second ballots if this was last time. The PC's have closed that loop hole, so really was/is any chance of him winning aside from Prentice being caught punching a baby?

I never understood why he entered the race. Either he entered early before he knew Prentice was coming and is stubborn, or is doing his service to the PC party to put on a leadership show.

Either way the guy isn't winning, and if he does, the party ain't next election. So I will save my outrage for people who actually have influence going forward. Bllinky might not even be an MLA after this goof.

[Resolute 14]

I don't see McIvor playing the jester role for Prentice's benefit. He's in it to win, even if he is also clueless enough not to realize that he doesn't have a prayer.

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Rural folk are rural folk, generally staunchly religious. It is what it is, like it or not. Look at electoral histories: Rural voters are substantially more conseravtive, especially socially. If you wanna act like somehow the support for gay marriage is the same in rural Alberta as it is in Calgary or Edmonton, well ok then.

A higher percentage than urban centres, certainly. But you were painting with a brush so wide that I stand behind my original comment entirely.

Also, it would be foolish to completely dismiss an area that still makes up nearly 1/3 of this province's population. In fact, given the PC/Liberal/NDP/Wildrose split that exists in the two big cities, I would argue that winning an election still requires a considerable amount of rural support. That same requirement is why the Liberals and NDP are unelectable.

That said, McIvor's antics here almost certainly will cost him support across the board - urban and rural alike.

[MoneyGuy]

I'm meeting Prentice tomorrow. I'm eager to get a sense of our next premier.

[Rathji]

People calling for Ric McIvor to resign his MLA position over this are being absurd. He did something entirely legal and completely in line with the values that I think most people have in this country, by expressing his views and the people he wants to support. If associating yourself with crazy people with extreme views was grounds to lose your job, I would be in trouble just from being in contact with my inlaws.

That said, dude gonna lose his seat next election for being a complete idiot, and I just hope that at this point I won't be marking an X beside the Liberal candidate if the WRP can't manage to field a decent candidate.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

The thing is you don't need to even slightly appeal to mouth breathers to win the election here. Edmonton and Calgary have 44 seats, which is enough for a majority in an 87 seat legislature. No offense to the rural folk, but you don't need em so don't appeal to their backwards views.

Up yours SCD! I'm not some backward viewing bigot!

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by Dion

Up yours SCD! I'm not some backward viewing bigot!

You live in High River correct? A suburb of Calgary? That's hardly a rural area, so you're in the clear.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

You live in High River correct? A suburb of Calgary? That's hardly a rural area, so you're in the clear.

If High River is a suburb of Calgary, then urban sprawl is even worse than I thought.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Rathji

People calling for Ric McIvor to resign his MLA position over this are being absurd. He did something entirely legal and completely in line with the values that I think most people have in this country, by expressing his views and the people he wants to support. If associating yourself with crazy people with extreme views was grounds to lose your job, I would be in trouble just from being in contact with my inlaws.

That said, dude gonna lose his seat next election for being a complete idiot, and I just hope that at this point I won't be marking an X beside the Liberal candidate if the WRP can't manage to field a decent candidate.

Actually, calling on McIvor to resign is a perfectly valid response. Social consequences of free speech. McIvor is, of course, under no obligation to resign and nor will he consider the idea. But it is really quite difficult to understand why he allowed himself to be put in this position. He's basically dead-ended his political career. The Tories can't put him back in a minister's position, and he's poisoned his name at any other level. Even if he gets re-elected, he might well have doomed himself to backbencher status.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Actually, calling on McIvor to resign is a perfectly valid response. Social consequences of free speech. McIvor is, of course, under no obligation to resign and nor will he consider the idea. But it is really quite difficult to understand why he allowed himself to be put in this position. He's basically dead-ended his political career. The Tories can't put him back in a minister's position, and he's poisoned his name at any other level. Even if he gets re-elected, he might well have doomed himself to backbencher status.

If there is no reason why he would logically agree or be forced to resign, by what standards do you use to judge that it was a valid request?

I mean, I would be within my rights to ask you for $1000, but that doesn't mean my request isn't absurd.

[burn_this_city]

I like Ric, but hes screwed himself on this. Not sure why he thought it would be good to associate with those people.

[Bunk]

As usual, Don Braid nailed it:

McIver let himself be associated with stunningly homophobic comments, and then did not renounce them.

It’s hard to know which leadership failure is most profound: the insensitivity, the lack of judgment or the sheer political stupidity.

http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/po...940/story.html

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

You live in High River correct? A suburb of Calgary? That's hardly a rural area, so you're in the clear.

Nice attempt at trying to deflect from your bigoted views. High River is not a suburb of Calgary and we are considered rural folks by most people.

My expectations from the provincial govt are just as important as those from the cities. For you to suggest otherwise is ridiculous. We are quite happy with Danielle Smith as our MLA and the work she has done advocating for our community and making the rest of Alberta aware of the culture of entitlement in the PC party. I only hope she is smart enough to bring in a platform Albertans can accept so we can get rid of the PC party.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

I like Ric, but hes screwed himself on this. Not sure why he thought it would be good to associate with those people.

A lady friend of mine is good friends with Danielle Smith. Smith told her that she realised that when in public you have to be very careful with whom you associate with and what you say to people. Things can twisted and turned to mean a certain thing like it has been with McIvor. Ric should have known better.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Dion

A lady friend of mine is good friends with Danielle Smith. Smith told her that she realised that when in public you have to be very careful with whom you associate with and what you say to people. Things can twisted and turned to mean a certain thing like it has been with McIvor. Ric should have known better.

What exactly was "twisted and turned" with McIver?

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Bunk

As usual, Don Braid nailed it:



http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/po...940/story.html

Wildrose, Tory, same old story.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by nik-

What exactly was "twisted and turned" with McIver?

That he supports the view that Gays and Lesbians were the cause of last years flood.