Israel declares war on Hamas

[Zary's-Mustache]

Originally Posted by Nage Waza

I am not surprised, go look at the universities. One type of racism seems to be acceptable.

People protesting genocide isn't racism just because you don't like what they are protesting.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Nage Waza

And what places can Arabs not go to? What places can Jews not go to? Curious what you are thinking here.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/arab-i...-neighborhood/

Netanya family has had 4 cars torched in past year, received a death threat letter, with bullets; police, community rabbi take no action

An Arab Israeli man who even adopted a Hebrew name in a bid to integrate into Israeli society has been the victim of a series of of abusive attacks by his Jewish neighbors in recent months.

There are dinks everywhere, so that isn't surprising. The biggest problem here is the authorities doing nothing, just as we see when the Settlers run wild.

You can't have a truly free and open society when the police don't serve everyone. See Northern Ireland again for another great example where they had to tear down the police service and start again because of the same problem.

[_Q_]

Question for you Nage:

What form of criticism of Israel would not qualify as racism?

You also seem to constantly point out that 20% of the population of Israel is Palestinian. Does criticism of Israel also qualify as Arab hate?

Does Hamas hate qualify as racism?

Does Iran hate?

Is any other country afforded the privilege of being immune to criticism?

[Leondros]

Awesome news - 4 more hostages rescued. I’m shocked there are still hostages alive. Of note was Noa Argamani who was the 25 year old taken from the music festival. I can’t imagine the horrors she would have gone through.

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/ar...music-festival

[Azure]

Hostages held in civilian homes where the civilians knew they were there.

Shocking of course to everyone.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Azure

Hostages held in civilian homes where the civilians knew they were there.

Shocking of course to everyone.

You are right, Israel should probably just bomb every civilian home, to be sure.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Azure

Hostages held in civilian homes where the civilians knew they were there.

Shocking of course to everyone.

As opposed to where? You still haven't clued in that Israel would never let the Palestinians build military bases lol.

And why would your average Palestinian trust Israel with this kind of information, anyway? Israel is not a rational actor right now and would not do anything to protect Palestinian civilians in any sort of rescue operation. If I knew I'd stfu about it, too, just like anybody else with a brain in their head.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

I think as opposed to not having hostages. I think that the majority of the Palestinian population supports Hamas directly or indirectly. That isn't surprising though considering the main enemy of Hamas has been relentlessly bombing their land for the past six months.

Right now the Israeli government has painted themselves into a corner, they don't have any means of occupation without massive bloodletting and through their actions they have created a generation of people who have been radicalized and are more likely to support an organization like Hamas. With Netanyahu needing to project strength immediately after the attacks rather than taking a more measured approach it has resulted in a quagmire for all parties.

There is enough criticism to go around as it isn't a finite supply. The sad thing is that there are a lot of people who are caught in the middle and who will have very legitimate reasons to hate Israel after this. I know if I was subjected to incredible levels of violence and destruction I would hate the people I deemed responsible as well.

This is one of many examples as to how the easy flow of information across geopolitical boundaries has changed the face of war.

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by _Q_

Question for you Nage:

What form of criticism of Israel would not qualify as racism?

You also seem to constantly point out that 20% of the population of Israel is Palestinian. Does criticism of Israel also qualify as Arab hate?

Does Hamas hate qualify as racism?

Does Iran hate?

Is any other country afforded the privilege of being immune to criticism?

Criticism is perfectly fine. You can find hundreds of articles online about this very topic, and they are all pretty clear - If you are judging Israel differently than other countries, then it is beyond criticism. For example, those complaining and expending energy calling Israel assorted names for their treatment of Muslims in Israel is outlandish in particular when there are dozens of countries surrounding Israel that deserve every bit of criticism.

Criticism of Israel would include the Arab population which is certainly lost on many of the posters here who still post about there being Apartheid in Israel (are the Arabs in Israel committing Apartheid against the Arabs in Israel?). Comparing Israel to Nazis is certainly hate speech. In fact, that comparison is considered a part of the working definition of Anti-Semitism.

Hatred of Hamas is well deserved, they are a terrorist organization that treats people horribly. They are murderers and rapists, your question is very odd. If you think I would connect a democratic country to Hamas as part of your argument, well you would be wrong. Israel's method of fighting this battle can be debated, but to you or I, that would be like debating some other very complex subject we know nothing about. The Israeli military knows far more on this subject than you or I, and they believe this is the manner to best eradicate Hamas. The questions should be on why did they choose this method? What benefits does that provide? That is a good debate. 'Israel are disgusting just like Hamas' is an argument many have made here and is not reasonable, in my humble opinion.

I don't hate Iran at all and my Iranian coworkers (four of them) have supported Israeli actions here and hate Iran, not the people, but the government (do any of us want so much death? No, of course not. But we are capable of discussing Israeli actions without throwing around such incendiary language as this thread has displayed). They came here for a better life and are aware of what is happening. That of course might not be the sentiment of everyone from Iran, obviously. Has anyone anti Israel like some of the posters here come and talked to me? No, not one, not a single person has come up to call me a name at work, but that has been different for my kids, which is near daily and the schools are not prepared for this sudden increase in antisemitism. Several coworkers have asked me what is going on, and I try to walk them through it as fair as possible. That seems impossible with some of the posters here.

Nothing is immune to criticism, and while I don't always answer as well as possible, I hope you understand when 'criticism' of Israel is often looked at in such ways. When the UN only criticized Israel over the years when actual genocide is taking place, you would hope people in Calgary would see that something sinister is taking place there. And when I post findings from the NGO that actually reports on this and that is met with such vitriol on this site, you can see that they too have trouble seeing through their bias.

The saying if it ain't Jews it ain't news is there for a reason.

Thanks for asking though, I will always answer, and if I don't, it should be very apparent by those reading the questions. Let's see how many people now attack me for being a racist, liar, genocider, etc. this elicits (these attacks serve a purpose which is not to tell the truth that they think that, but to intimidate anyone for countering their propaganda - a super common tactic which is on full display here).

If you don't think the Israeli military is doing the right thing, I would be happy to discuss that. I happen to think that such a small country with such a small military must use absolute force to end the threat and to make anyone else think twice about doing the same thing. If you don't think that was a reasonable thought, provide an alternative.

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by Sliver

As opposed to where? You still haven't clued in that Israel would never let the Palestinians build military bases lol.

You have posted an insane argument several times and I wanted to point it out.

Hamas did not have to build military bases. They did not have to build tunnels. They did not have to use their citizens as defensive structures above their bunkers. They just had to make peace with Israel and start moving forward.

None of what Hamas did helped the people in Gaza. Why is it peace is never an option?

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

Right now the Israeli government has painted themselves into a corner, they don't have any means of occupation without massive bloodletting and through their actions they have created a generation of people who have been radicalized and are more likely to support an organization like Hamas.

So many posts here blame Israel, including yours, of creating their enemy. This is ridiculous. Israel has made peace with multiple countries in the region. Treats Muslims better than their neighbors.

And when a terrorist group attacks Israel, Israel defending itself is now used as a reason for those that hate them. It is getting old.

Hamas needs to surrender, and both sides need to work on peace, not justifying another generation of hate.

[Skootenbeeten]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

I think as opposed to not having hostages. I think that the majority of the Palestinian population supports Hamas directly or indirectly. That isn't surprising though considering the main enemy of Hamas has been relentlessly bombing their land for the past six months.

Right now the Israeli government has painted themselves into a corner, they don't have any means of occupation without massive bloodletting and through their actions they have created a generation of people who have been radicalized and are more likely to support an organization like Hamas. With Netanyahu needing to project strength immediately after the attacks rather than taking a more measured approach it has resulted in a quagmire for all parties.

There is enough criticism to go around as it isn't a finite supply. The sad thing is that there are a lot of people who are caught in the middle and who will have very legitimate reasons to hate Israel after this. I know if I was subjected to incredible levels of violence and destruction I would hate the people I deemed responsible as well.

This is one of many examples as to how the easy flow of information across geopolitical boundaries has changed the face of war.

This makes perfect sense until you add in the fact that Gaza was unoccupied for almost 20 years prior to Oct 7th and had all of the Israeli settlers removed to give the entire area to Palestinians. That's not even including the hundreds of suicide attacks Israel has suffered at the hands of Palestinians for 30 years before the walls were completed.


The reality is that Palestinians have hated Israelis long before any of the current events and teach their children to hate Israelis so the cycle is unending. They believe they have a right to murder any Israelis over land and that wont go away because of some "measured response".

[Fuzz]

Nage Waza, do you ever find it exhausting coming up with excuses to justify the killing of innocent people? Hamas justified it and went and did it. Now Israel has justified it and is doing it. I don't understand why you think we can't criticize Israel without it being antisemitism, or that we don't criticize other horrible acts equally. Honestly a lot of it is because of people like you. Their is no one on the Sudan side defending their right to commit atrocities, so we don't counter that. We all know it is wrong. You seem to not know this is wrong. We wouldn't be so hard on you if you did.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Sliver

As opposed to where? You still haven't clued in that Israel would never let the Palestinians build military bases lol.

And why would your average Palestinian trust Israel with this kind of information, anyway? Israel is not a rational actor right now and would not do anything to protect Palestinian civilians in any sort of rescue operation. If I knew I'd stfu about it, too, just like anybody else with a brain in their head.

Did you just equate Hamas with Palestinians?

Fascinating.

Even presenting the idea that Israel should let Hamas (oops you meant Palestinians) build military bases is pretty ridiculous, even for you.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Azure

Did you just equate Hamas with Palestinians?

Fascinating.

Even presenting the idea that Israel should let Hamas (oops you meant Palestinians) build military bases is pretty ridiculous, even for you.

LOL. Careful Sliver, he's got you on that one. Oh wait. Only if your interpretation is that Palestinians as a people do not have a right to military bases for protection. Which would mean they are are under the thumb of someone else. And then Azure would have to admit that the people aren't actually free, and haven't been, and have others dictating what they can and can't do, and admit that these things have been happening for decades. Which would be troublesome for their narrative, and they might have to find other reasons to justify murdering oppressed peoples.

https://www.oxfam.org/en/timeline-hu...-gaza-blockade

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Skootenbeeten

This makes perfect sense until you add in the fact that Gaza was unoccupied for almost 20 years prior to Oct 7th and had all of the Israeli settlers removed to give the entire area to Palestinians. That's not even including the hundreds of suicide attacks Israel has suffered at the hands of Palestinians for 30 years before the walls were completed.


The reality is that Palestinians have hated Israelis long before any of the current events and teach their children to hate Israelis so the cycle is unending. They believe they have a right to murder any Israelis over land and that wont go away because of some "measured response".

If your last paragraph is what you believe I see why you support the murder of Palestinian civilians. When you believe that all Palestinians believe they have the right to murder Israelis it becomes an us vs them scenario. So obviously it’s better to kill them first.

I’d suggest that you reevaluate if that is actually true. Consider if you could be wrong Because if you are wrong you could accidentally be supporting the murder of innocent people.

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by GGG

If your last paragraph is what you believe I see why you support the murder of Palestinian civilians. When you believe that all Palestinians believe they have the right to murder Israelis it becomes an us vs them scenario. So obviously it’s better to kill them first.

I’d suggest that you reevaluate if that is actually true. Consider if you could be wrong Because if you are wrong you could accidentally be supporting the murder of innocent people.

Cmon we both know he doesn't consider Palestinians human

[Skootenbeeten]

https://x.com/manniefabian/status/1799389311860642110


4 Hostages rescued, The hostages were held by Hamas guards in the homes of Arab families (Hamas paid the families to hold the hostages).


In other news many Calgary puck posters absolutely furious. One reported as saying "DDuuUURrrr NEtAnAYhuuuu wANted ThEm dEad1!11!"

[Zary's-Mustache]

Only at the cost of 210 Palestinians!

[Skootenbeeten]

Originally Posted by Zary's-Mustache

Only at the cost of 210 Palestinians!

Don't blame Netanyahu, he didn't want to rescue them.