Plasma TVs and Image Burn/Retention

[Yamer]

Originally Posted by chemgear

It's a (sorta) problem that Costco has had in the past. I've heard many stories about how people go and "borrow" a brand new TV for the Superbowl. Mainly in the US though.

Not sure it makes sense to dismiss a product because of difficulties resulting from essentially (mis)using it in the first place. (hehe, sorta kidding - glad you can take it back.)

I understand you are 'sorta' kidding, but I didn't misuse the product. I took every precaution listed in the manual.

I am dismissing it because it is does not fit my needs (extended gaming sessions), and I am not going to baby a television set.

Plasma technology is not for me.

[onetwo_threefour]

It really must be a bad panel. I have the second cheapest Samsung 50" Plasma, bought in June, and have no problems with retention. I don't game a lot, but sometimes when I do it's for several hours at a time. I don't play many games with fixed images though as I mostly like platformers and RPG's and maybe that makes a difference since there's always enough action on the screen.

I did do some research before buying and knew that you are supposed to baby these things for a while, so I immediately calibrated mine based on recommended settings I found for my model online. (I believe AVSForum).

I don't know that the technology is bad, but it sure sounds like the unit you got had something erong with it.

[Yamer]

UPDATE:

Took the plasma back with no problems. Decided to spend an extra $300 and bought a Samsung LN46C650. Lost 4" of screen size, but gained a few other perks.

Not even 4 days into using it, I noticed a screen imperfection. A pixel stays blue.

I cannot believe my luck with TVs. I think I might go back to radio. I'm definitely going back to Costco.

[DownhillGoat]

So are you swearing off plasma and LCD now?

I hate stuck/burned out pixels. The first mac I bought had a ton of them.

[Yamer]

Originally Posted by kunkstyle

So are you swearing off plasma and LCD now?

I hate stuck/burned out pixels. The first mac I bought had a ton of them.

Yeah, TV is overrated.

On the serious side, I am finding I am more of an LCD person. I really like the picture on the Samsung I have (the second one seems to be working fine). And yes I am knocking on wood as we speak.

[8sPOT]

If only they could combine the PRO'S of Plasma and LCD into a PLasCd.

Seriously though, I bought a 42" Samsung plasma in 2005 and had serious pixelation issues. You would see red pixels going crazy on a dark image. Had a technician come out and he took it to their 'warranty shop' for a few days. When it came back it was better, for a while.

Anyways when we sold that house, we sold the TV with it mounted on the wall. I then bought a 50" LG Plasma LG50PC3D in 2007. I did follow the recommendations during the first few weeks as far as taking it easy on the set, and here we are 3 years later with no significant issues.

I play XBOX 360 on it, anywhere from 20 minutes to 3 hours at a time. Watch DVD's, Blu-rays, and SD/HD tv.

I have never noticed any burn-in other than the occasional NHL 11 score or menu when I turn the TV off.

My only issue is that sometimes the TV goes black, and I have to turn it off and back on. Funny enough it hasn't happened since I switched from Shaw to Telus a month ago.

For me, the fact that LCD has horrible picture for sports or any fast frame movement is enough to keep me on the plasma bandwagon.

Maybe the new LCD's are better but the 120Hz rate compared to 600Hz is a long ways off.

The only reason I would get a new TV is to get a 60" or 65" plasma, which I am seriously looking into.

Just my 2 cents.

[McG]

this is a good thread for me right now.

i go back and forth between technologies, features, and manufacturers.

today i was at costco and saw the lg led/lcd 46". the tv looked friggin awesome. it doesn't come with any of the bundled internet and stuff as the exact same model does at best buy. i don't know if i would use any of the other features though...

i found a samsung led/lcd at best buy and man the picture was awesome...but with a glossy screen. doh!

and of course...a costco samsung series 6 plasma; they had prince of persia going and it was at the part where his brother presses the dagger near the end... the dust swirling was unbelievable...i couldn't take my eyes off the tv!

gaming and sports are my primary interest...but this thread freaks me out on plasma!

can you get stuck pixels with an led/lcd? i suspect that you can but if anyone knows...

i love the technology; but i think i love the costco warranty more!

[DownhillGoat]

Originally Posted by McG

can you get stuck pixels with an led/lcd? i suspect that you can but if anyone knows...

Sure can.

[chemgear]

Originally Posted by Yamer

I understand you are 'sorta' kidding, but I didn't misuse the product. I took every precaution listed in the manual.

I am dismissing it because it is does not fit my needs (extended gaming sessions), and I am not going to baby a television set.

Plasma technology is not for me.

Been a while since I looked in this thread - my post totally wasn't directed at you. It was something I read about a year or two back about Costco's return policy in the US. I thought it was kinda funny (or a good idea) back then to be honest; to upgrade just for a few days/the superbowl.

[McG]

i have decided to go with the samsung UN46c6300. it is led/lcd, decent price, no internet apps but dlna and ethernet connection.

if i need the internet apps, i can upgrade the blu ray...

the final, final, final deciding point about this tv was a buddy asking me if the kids were using the tv, or anyone for that matter, would i be sitting around upstairs wondering if they were watching crappy SD MTV or playing a video game for hours that would burn the TV? would i be freaking out about it? damn straight i would be. which is exactly the point of me not getting the plasma, although secretly i think plasma would be the better tv for me personally.

since i chose a wife and subsequently added a family, i have come to learn that nothing i have or resides in this house is mine and mine alone, and i have to always overestimate how much stress that places on me WHEN THEY USE MY STUFF!!! (hehheh)

led tv it is! although in fairness, like many tvs i looked at, the picture on just about all of the sets is unbelievable.

[Yamer]

I'm really considering giving up completely.

I am on my second Samsung, and I just noticed distinct vertical banding. It shows up mostly on dark colors.

I'm beginning to think that Samsung has a serious defect in these TVs, and reading on AVSforum I see that it is all too common.

What should I do? I don't really feel like exchanging for the exact same model, as two have already been faulty. I don't have any higher of a budget, and I just can't afford to not get the extended warranty that Costco offers. This is a real nice television, but I just refuse to pay that kind of money for a faulty product.

Can anyone recommend a solid brand in the same price range? $1200. I am at my wits end. The kind of research that is required in order for it to be worth the cash just makes my head hurt. I don't want to go lower than a 46", and I don't want to baby a plasma.

Am I SOL?

[I_H8_Crawford]

Originally Posted by Yamer

I'm really considering giving up completely.

I am on my second Samsung, and I just noticed distinct vertical banding. It shows up mostly on dark colors.

I'm beginning to think that Samsung has a serious defect in these TVs, and reading on AVSforum I see that it is all too common.

What should I do? I don't really feel like exchanging for the exact same model, as two have already been faulty. I don't have any higher of a budget, and I just can't afford to not get the extended warranty that Costco offers. This is a real nice television, but I just refuse to pay that kind of money for a faulty product.

Can anyone recommend a solid brand in the same price range? $1200. I am at my wits end. The kind of research that is required in order for it to be worth the cash just makes my head hurt. I don't want to go lower than a 46", and I don't want to baby a plasma.

Am I SOL?

Panasonic has always been my favorite brand of Plasma.. look into their TVs, I know my G/F's father has had one for 4 years now, and no issue at all with burn in, and that is watching letterboxed movies and playing video games on it...

[Hack&Lube]

Originally Posted by Yamer

I'm really considering giving up completely.

I am on my second Samsung, and I just noticed distinct vertical banding. It shows up mostly on dark colors.

I'm beginning to think that Samsung has a serious defect in these TVs, and reading on AVSforum I see that it is all too common.

What should I do? I don't really feel like exchanging for the exact same model, as two have already been faulty. I don't have any higher of a budget, and I just can't afford to not get the extended warranty that Costco offers. This is a real nice television, but I just refuse to pay that kind of money for a faulty product.

Can anyone recommend a solid brand in the same price range? $1200. I am at my wits end. The kind of research that is required in order for it to be worth the cash just makes my head hurt. I don't want to go lower than a 46", and I don't want to baby a plasma.

Am I SOL?

Man, I've seen good Panasonic Viera 50" plasmas that are 1080p go for under $1100 price matched and no burn in issues with gaming. That would be my choice with that budget but then again, I understand if you have your doubts about plasma (and all TVs basically with your bad luck).

-edit

Sounds like I_H8_Crawford has the same opinion. That said, I don't want to suggest something to you and see you suffer again.

If you are restricted to Costco stock because of their return policy, you have much less choice as well. I've only had good experiences with plasma. I've had bad experiences with LCDs (black levels sucked, dead pixels) so it's the complete opposite of much of this thread.

Your dark color banding is due to low color depth, low black levels, and low contrast ratio on LCDs. LCDs usually have low color depth (like 6-bit) that's dithered to a simulated higher bit depth causing banding or abrupt color changes between gradients. I think plasmas are true 12 or 16-bit usually and the super high contrast ratio boosts the difference even more.

What other choices do you have at Costco?

[Yamer]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

Man, I've seen good Panasonic Viera 50" plasmas that are 1080p go for under $1100 price matched and no burn in issues with gaming. That would be my choice with that budget but then again, I understand if you have your doubts about plasma (and all TVs basically with your bad luck).

-edit

Sounds like I_H8_Crawford has the same opinion. That said, I don't want to suggest something to you and see you suffer again.

If you are restricted to Costco stock because of their return policy, you have much less choice as well. I've only had good experiences with plasma. I've had bad experiences with LCDs (black levels sucked, dead pixels) so it's the complete opposite of much of this thread.

Your dark color banding is due to low color depth, low black levels, and low contrast ratio on LCDs. LCDs usually have low color depth (like 6-bit) that's dithered to a simulated higher bit depth causing banding or abrupt color changes between gradients. I think plasmas are true 12 or 16-bit usually and the super high contrast ratio boosts the difference even more.

What other choices do you have at Costco?

Thanks for your input.

Yeah, I realize my choice is pretty limited if I prefer to stick with Costco. And another note, the black levels on this Samsung are comparable to the LG plasma I had before. I am quite impressed with the PQ on this model.

I have heard very good things about Panasonic plasma, and I'm not sure what my Costco has in stock. The website differs from the actual store quite a bit, and the prices do as well. The banding isn't terribly noticeable, but there is a bar running vertically that is a lighter shade than the rest of the picture.

The strange thing is, I only seem to notice it when I am playing the Xbox (game or movie). Is it related to the source I am using? Would changing my reference levels do anything...I have them on extended (I don't even fully understand what they are)? What I really want to do is take some sort of course on this so that I could be properly educated on these matters. The technical jargon on AVS makes me dizzy, but there certainly is a buttload of information there to work from.

Anyway, the last time I was at Costco to return the last Samsung there weren't too many models in my price range to choose from. I don't know if it is the TV or the inputs I am using.

Quite the conundrum.

EDIT: Also, would it have anything at all to do with the HDMI cable I use? They say that expensive cables are no better than the cheap ones.

[Diemenz]

I stated this earlier but added a LCD recently so heres my new feedback

I own 2 Panasonic Plasma's and 1 Sony LCD.

One panny get used about 6 hours a day give or take and has been left on with static images about 30-40 times most times for 8 hours. Not once I have noticed burn in. There is a image ghost for about 5-10 minutes when I first start watching but then its completely gone.

The sony even being a 120 and their highest model still looks blurry to me compared to my plasma's when I watch sports. Not only that but it cost twice as much as my plasma's and does not even compare in PQ.

I will purchase only plasma's as long as they make them.

[Diemenz]

Originally Posted by Yamer

EDIT: Also, would it have anything at all to do with the HDMI cable I use? They say that expensive cables are no better than the cheap ones.

Digital is Digital.
The cheapest HDMI cable will perform identical to the expensive Brands.

[Roast Beef]

Could it be a problem with the output of the Xbox that you never noticed before? Is it possible for you to either try a different Xbox or a different output method? At the very least I would try switching resolutions on the Xbox itself.

[Yamer]

Originally Posted by Roast Beef

Could it be a problem with the output of the Xbox that you never noticed before? Is it possible for you to either try a different Xbox or a different output method? At the very least I would try switching resolutions on the Xbox itself.

Fortunately, a sale went on last month and I purchased a new Xbox. My old one is just that, OLD....it was a model from 2006 that had no HDMI output. So I think I will try all of your suggestions. I'll even try the new Xbox on another LCD in the house.

Trial and error from here. And unless I train my eye to see it, the vertical line isn't a terrible distraction at this point. I have discovered that it is best not to watch DVDs on the Xbox, for some reason it will drop the FPS at certain intervals. Something that my DVD player does not do.

Thanks all, you guys/gals are a HUGE help!

[fundmark19]

if you are stuck with costco why don't you get a vizio lcd. They are highly rated by cnet and very well priced

[FanIn80]

Like other people in this thread, I've had a Panasonic plasma for quite a few years now. No noticeable issues with burn-in or ghosting. I use my TV for everything, too. It's the only one I have, and it's on for hours at a time. Movies, games, TV, music (from my Apple TV). I don't even baby it at all. When I bought it, I just set it up and turned it on. That was the only prep I've ever done.

I'm fairly certain this stuff has more to do with buying a crappy brand than anything else. It's very common knowledge that Panasonic makes the best plasmas.

Edit: Also, that bit about avoiding plasmas unless you have a super dark room is a bit whack, too. Just get the anti-glare option. Mine's in my living room beside a huge window that lets in a ton of light. There's also a window facing opposite in my kitchen that used to reflect on my old CRT TV all the time... no glare at all on my plasma. Any time of day.