Calgary considering banning new Drive-Thrus

[MelBridgeman]

Doesnt starting and stopping the car take more gas than idle? (maybe that was just my '78 impala)
I know some people in the winter would idle their truck all night long (used too anyway)

[habernac]

Originally Posted by MelBridgeman

Doesnt starting and stopping the car take more gas than idle? (maybe that was just my '78 impala)
I know some people in the winter would idle their truck all night long (used too anyway)

that's just older vehicles, Mel.

[SteveToms]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

holy sht Calgary is going crazy with bans and bylaws lately

Pretty big government for a so called conservative city, eh?

[SebC]

Wow... instead of making developpers pay for new infrastructure for new communities or creating a property tax system that reflects the increased cost to the city of suburban living relative to inner-city development, they come up with this? Lame!

[Burninator]

This is a pretty dumb bylaw. It's like when the water is overflowing the sides of your boat and you make a rule that no one can spit into the boat.

[Myth]

Originally Posted by 4X4

As much as it annoys me when I get stuck behind the guy that orders half the menu in the drive thru, last time we discussed drive thrus someone made a very good point about people like mothers on their way home, car full of kids, ordering from the drive thru because whet the heck else can she do? Lock the kids in the car? Unstrap the baby seat and lug it inside?

The only drive thru I really use is at the bank and it's because of my baby. Do you have any idea what a monumental pain the the @ss it is to take her in and out of her car seat over and over? Especially if I'm just running in and out of somewhere, it's so much easier to stay in the car if I can. Not to mention she gets pretty cranky if I keep putting her in and taking her out a bunch of times in a row, and if she's sleeping? I don't have much of a choice but to take her with me because if someone sees me leave her in the car (even if it's only for a minute or two) then there's all kinds of hell to pay.
I could also see that handicapped people have times where the drive thru is the best option for them.
If people are being encouraged to turn off their engine while sitting at a red light, why can't they do it in line at a drive thru?

[habernac]

People got in and out of their cars to pick up coffee, food, money etc before and we could do it again. The "give me convenience or give me death" mantra of people today is bordering on pathetic. A ban on drive throughs wouldn't break my heart any. And one of my bigggest pet peeves is unnecessary car idling.

[McMack]

Having said all that, I'm still baffled how people will sit in the drive through line for 10-15 minutes at the Westhills Tim Hortons in the morning (and most other Timmies for that matter). You could brew a whole pot of coffee yourself in that amount of time.

Also, they should enforce existing bylaws against businesses that impede traffic flow with their drive throughs. I am specifically thinking of the McDonalds on McLeod Trail near the Stampede.

[Daradon]

This is silly.

I cant imagine this is doing so much damage. And I'm very pro green.

The cars are on the road anyway. The extra 1 min-2 min they spend at a lower idle rate?

Sounds dumb.

The part I liked the most was the 'having to meet someone part'.

I think the whole world could do with some of that.

[llama64]

Originally Posted by Dan02

ummm how is turning your car off at a traffic light a safety concern?

Do you really want to be sitting at a red light with no way of moving? What if your engine stalls and you're left dead on the road?

Turning off your engine at a red light just seems dangerous to me.

Idling at lights usually isn't high on most environmentalists agendas. They are more concerned with the commute itself.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by fotze

Why doesn't the gov't get better timed traffic lights. Sometimes I fantasize about being the Incredible Hulk so i can take those lights at Bow Trail and Shaganappi golf course and fling them 50 miles away.

When you're done with those lights, wanna leap on over and take care of the ones on Glenmore, turning onto Macleod?

[redforever]

Originally Posted by Ironhorse

Good. Get off your duff and interact with the rest of society.

There are far too many people in this world who's first words out of their mouth every morning are not to a loved one, but instead to a metal speaker whilst sitting in their car.

And people of that ilk won't change their personalities and become social butterflies just because drive throughs are banned.

[redforever]

Originally Posted by Daradon

This is silly.

I cant imagine this is doing so much damage. And I'm very pro green.

The cars are on the road anyway. The extra 1 min-2 min they spend at a lower idle rate?

Sounds dumb.

The part I liked the most was the 'having to meet someone part'.

I think the whole world could do with some of that.

Meeting someone "inside" compared to "the drive through" is gonna be real interactive? give me a break. There was a recent thread talking about the poor service they receive and how those in the service industry rarely even acknowledge your presence let alone interact with you.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by habernac

People got in and out of their cars to pick up coffee, food, money etc before and we could do it again.

Yes, yes they did. I have very specific memories of being 4 or 5 years old and climbing all over the car seats (because we didn't have seatbelts let alone kids seats) while my mom went into the bank. Sometimes mom would even crack the window for my sister and I.

However if you tried that now, you would be crucified for child abuse. So you can't just go back to the way things were for one part of society and not another.

[redforever]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

My idea has always been to limit the size of the orders using drive-thru's. They were originally designed to make things go faster but a lot of idiots place huge orders and clog up the drive-thru. This is especially true for Tim Horton's, I use the drive-thru if I just want a coffee and maybe a doughnut but my biggest peeve is when some moron ahead of me orders 8 coffee's and numorous items off the menu. The solution to this problem is easy, limit the size of drive-thru orders.

Ever think they are making the coffee run or snack run for numerous people?

So then, you I guess would prefer 8 cars in the line up, all "polluting", each ordering one coffee and one donut?

[habernac]

Originally Posted by ken0042

Yes, yes they did. I have very specific memories of being 4 or 5 years old and climbing all over the car seats (because we didn't have seatbelts let alone kids seats) while my mom went into the bank. Sometimes mom would even crack the window for my sister and I.

However if you tried that now, you would be crucified for child abuse. So you can't just go back to the way things were for one part of society and not another.

how about taking that extra five minutes and taking the kids with you? It's not all that hard.

[Metro Gnome]

Originally Posted by Ironhorse

Good. Get off your duff and interact with the rest of society.

There are far too many people in this world who's first words out of their mouth every morning are not to a loved one, but instead to a metal speaker whilst sitting in their car.

Says the guy on an impersonal messageboard. I think we should all get together and talk about these issues face-to-face! It would be better for us in some supposed, general way!

Sheezus. It stuns me how vulnerable people are to nonsense psycho-babble. Do you actually think people talking directly to the Tim Hortons employee while they order their coffee (rather than through "a metal speaker") is going to have some far ranging benefit?

The imposition of fuzzy, feel-good sensibilities upon the general populace is amazing to me sometimes.

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by habernac

how about taking that extra five minutes and taking the kids with you? It's not all that hard.

Spoken like someone who doesn't have 2-3 kids aged 3-6.... It's hard enough with 3 10-14 year old kids.

[Ironhorse]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

The bigger question is how can anyone think the the ideling at drive throughs actually contributes anything to the total emmission output is beyond me. Why don't we all turn off our cars at traffic lights? That would save 10000X this initiative!

IIRC, All MINIs sold in Europe starting this past year come with start/stop technology. When you come to a traffic light, push in the clutch, put the gear in neutral and let the clutch out, the car turns off automatically. As soon as you push the clutch back in, the car starts again automatically. I believe there are a number of computer interlocks that prevent it from engaging whilst you're moving etc. From what I've heard thus far, it is quite non-invasive, and hardly noticable.

[Thunderball]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

Complete and utter BS. Global Warming is being used to inflict many new types of fascism upon the world. It's about choice. If you believe that drive thru's, living in the suburbs, driving in general, is the root of all evil, move to Kensington and shut the hell up, you have that choice. Enough with the smug attitude and the belief that it's your mission that people should be forced to live your "superior" lifestyle. As oil and gas start to cost more people are already making choices and priorities vis-a-vis, where they live in proximity to where they work, how big a house they want to heat in the winter, etc. It should be their choice to make and not forced upon them in the near term. Reality will force it's hand as Calgary gets more populated, let these things naturally play out instead of trying to convert Calgary into New York City overnight.

While fascism is a much stronger word than I would use, Cowboy is essentially correct.

This is the most brainless idea that has come from the leftist braintrust in Calgary for a long time. What they don't realize is the following:
1. Drive-Thrus operate as a queue reducing measure
2. People like this measure or they wouldn't use it, all one has to do is drive by a Tim Hortons to see that in practice.
3. Banning new drive-thrus will only create larger demands for the current drive-thrus and create market inequity for those who are not allowed to come in and add them.
4. Because people like this measure, and because there would be a cap on their availability, there would be less of them for an increasing population... hence, more idling at drive-thru queues.

Rather than tackle real issues, the council seems to be content to force some more nuisance by-laws down people's throats. Pesticides are not dangerous in limited quanities and if the right ones (read: not the cheapest, most toxic ones) are used. But hey, maybe the City Council wants the Dandelion to be the new Civic Flower.
The LRT needs significant capacity expansion, not range expansion. The road system needs significant expansion and many more efficient interchanges. The city needs to take their "basic, secondary and ultimate phases", shove them up their ass, and do it right the first time. But hey, as long as there's a couple hundred less "evil suburban dwelling, SUV driving zealots" waiting for their double-double, who cares about the thousands of cars stuck in gridlock idling, right?

Governments should not be forcing social engineering or their flawed utopian views on people. Personally, I think for all future civic elections, candidates should have to declare their party affiliation. I highly doubt that the Brian Pincotts of the world could get elected in a largely suburban riding such as Ward 11 if they had to affiliate themselves with the NDP, Green or Marxist-Leninist party. Calgarians tend to vote on the size and frequency of election signs when it comes to the civic level rather than actually getting to know the candidate and their leanings.