South Dakota bans abortions

[Azure]

Originally Posted by FireFly

Not all are desperate. In some cases, if a clinic won't do it, a girl would end up giving the baby to someone who wanted it.

Which is what I would want to happen. But I still believe in the freedom of choosing.

[SweetDoc]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

You're a 16 year old girl who made a big mistake with your first boyfriend. You think your dad is literally going to strangle you if he finds out you are pregnant.

Yes, it is a very real problem and a very real situation.

I went to school with a girl who got pregnant at 12 and had the baby at 13. She is an amazing mom now, did she think about abortion? Yes. Did she have every excuse to have one? Yes. But she didn't, and it's a damn good thing too. Just because you're in a tough situation doesn't mean you should be having an abortion, if you aren't responsible enough to have a baby, don't have sex. If you aren't responsible enough to have a baby and you have sex anyway and get pregnant, learn to accept the consequesnces of your actions, don't kill something because you can't deal with it, odoption is always a viable alternative.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by SweetDoc

I went to school with a girl who got pregnant at 12 and had the baby at 13. She is an amazing mom now, did she think about abortion? Yes. Did she have every excuse to have one? Yes. But she didn't, and it's a damn good thing too. Just because you're in a tough situation doesn't mean you should be having an abortion, if you aren't responsible enough to have a baby, don't have sex. If you aren't responsible enough to have a baby and you have sex anyway and get pregnant, learn to accept the consequesnces of your actions, don't kill something because you can't deal with it, odoption is always a viable alternative.

Exactly. I agree wholeheartely, but I still believe in the freedom of choice. Better that then the back alley.

[PYroMaNiaC]

Originally Posted by SweetDoc

I don't believe in abortion except for rape. Here is the thing, if it is rape, how can the mother keep the child knowing what happened and where the child came from? So then if she gives it up for adoption, what happens when the kid grows up and finds out where he/she came from ? The kid would have serious issues. If they could make sure the kid never found out he/she was a rape baby, then fine, I would never agree with abortion. This is a very strong statement and I don't if any of you have been in this situation to add feelings, but if I was with a woman and got her pregnant and she aborted it, I would be ****ed. For one thing I don't agree with abortion and for another, if she didn't want it, I certainly would, and I would give the child a great upbringing and great family life. I believe once the woman is pregnant and there is a baby in there, it is a child, if a woman makes the decision to end my child's life for any other reason than to save her life, she shouldn't feel to darn upset if I make the same decision about her life. Abortion shouldn't be an alternitive for not being responsible. If any of you know what it feels like to lose a child, you know what it feels like to see people abort one when yours is gone.

You may be an exception,but there are a lot of dead beat Dads out there. There are also an awful lot of children being raised in poverty. Now, I'm not saying that these are valid reasons for abortion, but a fifteen year old girl is scared out of her mind when she finds out she's pregnant. Her boyfriend just had sex with her because he could and it was cool and he's not going to stick around, let alone support the babe with his p/t job at McD's - that's for his weekly supply of liquor. Her parents toss her out on her ear because she's violated the church just by engaging in premarital sex. Now what? Adoption? She'll be shunned at school. And not one of her friends will look her in the eye. Now she's depressed. Her marks slip because she can't concentrate as the shelter is so noisy and she's not sleeping or eating well enough for one let alone two. The crazy mood swings any pregnant woman experiences are peanuts compared to the hormones she's enduring from puberty now doubled with pregnancy. This is her life for the next nine months - if she's strong enough to make it and the depression doesn't take the ultimate price. So, I'm sorry if some girl makes a choice thats right for her and not for you because this story is way more common than any of us want to acknowledge.

[Vulcan]

I believe in the sanctity of life, but is a fetus a living being?

For the religious among you, in the Bible, Genesis to be exact, referring to Adam, it says "He was formed out of the dust of the earth, and God breathed into his nostrils the breath of life". Thus, in one of the most important passages from this book, it says that Adam wasn't a life until he took his first breath.

I'm not saying I'm in favour of abortion, I value the fetus as a potential life, but I feel the woman should have the final decision.

[SweetDoc]

Originally Posted by PYroMaNiaC

You may be an exception,but there are a lot of dead beat Dads out there. There are also an awful lot of children being raised in poverty. Now, I'm not saying that these are valid reasons for abortion, but a fifteen year old girl is scared out of her mind when she finds out she's pregnant. Her boyfriend just had sex with her because he could and it was cool and he's not going to stick around, let alone support the babe with his p/t job at McD's - that's for his weekly supply of liquor. Her parents toss her out on her ear because she's violated the church just by engaging in premarital sex. Now what? Adoption? She'll be shunned at school. And not one of her friends will look her in the eye. Now she's depressed. Her marks slip because she can't concentrate as the shelter is so noisy and she's not sleeping or eating well enough for one let alone two. The crazy mood swings any pregnant woman experiences are peanuts compared to the hormones she's enduring from puberty now doubled with pregnancy. This is her life for the next nine months - if she's strong enough to make it and the depression doesn't take the ultimate price. So, I'm sorry if some girl makes a choice thats right for her and not for you because this story is way more common than any of us want to acknowledge.

Like I said, a child shouldn't have to die, or never exist, because it makes life difficult on someone. If you aren't responsible enough to handle the consequences, don't have sex, and don't take it out on a great life that could be. No one said it's gonna be easy, hell, it will be more than difficult, shattering even, but if a person isn't strong enough or determined enough to make up for their mistakes or to handle the consequences of their actions, maybe they should be rethinking their place in existance. Besides this isn't about me, it's about a life that should have the right to live on. Having a tough life is a small price to pay for letting a human being have a chance at theirs.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by SweetDoc

Like I said, a child shouldn't have to die, or never exist, because it makes life difficult on someone. If you aren't responsible enough to handle the consequences, don't have sex, and don't take it out on a great life that could be. No one said it's gonna be easy, hell, it will be more than difficult, shattering even, but if a person isn't strong enough or determined enough to make up for their mistakes or to handle the consequences of their actions, maybe they should be rethinking their place in existance. Besides this isn't about me, it's about a life that should have the right to live on. Having a tough life is a small price to pay for letting a human being have a chance at theirs.

So, how do you know it's a life?

[PYroMaNiaC]

What about the child who's having the child? Is her life any less valid? Is she a responsible adult because she made a poor choice? Or is she still a child who has the right to life - and not a shattered one - if she makes a tough decision?

[SweetDoc]

Originally Posted by PYroMaNiaC

What about the child who's having the child? Is her life any less valid? Is she a responsible adult because she made a poor choice? Or is she still a child who has the right to life - and not a shattered one - if she makes a tough decision?

If you believe yourself responsible enough to have sex, you should at the very least be responsible enough to handle the consequesnces. If you think about being a parent and it seems too much for you, don't have sex. Why does there always seem to be those people out there willing to shed their responsibilities because society gives them a way out. Why should society give them a way out? If we didn't, people would be more resposible and think about the consequences of their actions before they act.

And for the other person who asks me how I know it's a life? Because if you don't abort it, that's what it turns out to be. Once it's concieved, it's something, and will breath on it's own soon enough. They should have the same opportunity to live the rest of us were given.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by SweetDoc

Like I said, a child shouldn't have to die, or never exist, because it makes life difficult on someone. If you aren't responsible enough to handle the consequences, don't have sex, and don't take it out on a great life that could be.

It's a matter of perspective. What you are calling a "child dying" would not be considered a life by many at that point.
also where do you draw the line? Is protected sex preventing a child from existing as well?
Even choosing not to have sex is presenting a life that could be. I could be making a baby right now, but I'm chosing not to. Am I wrong?

I agree that you should responsible if you're having sex, but that's easier said then done. There is always gonna be people who aren't resonsible doing things they shouldn't, or people who are taken advantage of and made to do things they don't know better about.

[SweetDoc]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

It's a matter of perspective. What you are calling a "child dying" would not be considered a life by many at that point.
also where do you draw the line? Is protected sex preventing a child from existing as well?
Even choosing not to have sex is presenting a life that could be. I could be making a baby right now, but I'm chosing not to. Am I wrong?

I agree that you should responsible if you're having sex, but that's easier said then done. There is always gonna be people who aren't resonsible doing things they shouldn't, or people who are taken advantage of and made to do things they don't know better about.

The entire part about not having sex is irrelevant, you aren't killing something by not having sex. I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure something only starts happening when the sperm fertalizes the egg. And when a person has an abortion, it's because they know there is something insie of them growing. I believe people should have all sorts of rights, I'm very demanding of my rights, but abortion just doesn't make sense to me because once something is growing and going to live, it should have it's own rights.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by SweetDoc

If you aren't responsible enough to handle the consequences, don't have sex,

This would be fantastic advice (and much more than just a lame bumper sticker) if it actually applied to the real world. Unfortunately it doesn't.

I wonder though, how long into the child's life does your unreasonable cliché apply? 10 years down the road if the child's mother is pulling in welfare cheques would you also say "if you can't afford to look after the kids, you shouldn't have had them in the first place"?

Some people would say that. I don't know if you are one, but that's a confusing thing about a lot of hardass conservative types. They tend to be 1)anti-abortion 2)anti-welfare 3)pro-death penalty.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by SweetDoc

The entire part about not having sex is irrelevant, you aren't killing something by not having sex. I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure something only starts happening when the sperm fertalizes the egg. And when a person has an abortion, it's because they know there is something insie of them growing. I believe people should have all sorts of rights, I'm very demanding of my rights, but abortion just doesn't make sense to me because once something is growing and going to live, it should have it's own rights.

I only mentioned the not having sex part to demonstrate that there is no black/white point at which a life exists/is being created. To you, it may be when the sperm fertalizes an egg, but to others it may be different.

I respect that you feel this way about the issue, but you must understand that others may not define things in your terms. This is where the different views on abortion tend to come from.
It's not that people feel it's ok to kill children, it's that they don't consider a fetus at that point to be a child. Your definition of when life begins is simply your opinion, not a fact.

[Eastern Girl]

Originally Posted by SweetDoc

I believe people should have all sorts of rights, I'm very demanding of my rights, but abortion just doesn't make sense to me because once something is growing and going to live, it should have it's own rights.

A lot of women, much like yourself, are very demanding of their rights as well. So, whose rights are more important, the rights of the woman or the rights of the fetus?

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by SweetDoc

And for the other person who asks me how I know it's a life? Because if you don't abort it, that's what it turns out to be. Once it's concieved, it's something, and will breath on it's own soon enough. They should have the same opportunity to live the rest of us were given.

"It's something" alright and should be cherished. It has the potential to have life. Many things including aborition can happen until it takes it's first breath and becomes a true being.

[SweetDoc]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

This would be fantastic advice (and much more than just a lame bumper sticker) if it actually applied to the real world. Unfortunately it doesn't.

I wonder though, how long into the child's life does your unreasonable cliché apply? 10 years down the road if the child's mother is pulling in welfare cheques would you also say "if you can't afford to look after the kids, you shouldn't have had them in the first place"?

Some people would say that. I don't know if you are one, but that's a confusing thing about a lot of hardass conservative types. They tend to be 1)anti-abortion 2)anti-welfare 3)pro-death penalty.

I don't fashion myself as any type of person or follow any groupthink patterns. I'm simply myself and speak from my own feelings, none of which come from what any perticular group feels I should feel lol. 1) Yes I am anti-abortion 2) I am not anti-welfare but do believe that the government could look closer into the situations of the people they are giving it to. 3) I don't believe in the death penalty what-so-ever. Saying that though, In a very personal circumstance, I'm not sure I'd have enough rational power to stop myself from ending the life of someone who took the life of a loved one purposely, not by accident. But I can't say for sure.

And about your 10 years down the road remark, well no one said that adoption was out of the equation now did they? Have the baby and put it up for adoption. It sounds like a much better idea than having an abortion or living on welfare.

[SweetDoc]

Originally Posted by Eastern Girl

A lot of women, much like yourself, are very demanding of their rights as well. So, whose rights are more important, the rights of the woman or the rights of the fetus?

In which case whoevers rights allow them to live should have authority.

[SweetDoc]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

"It's something" alright and should be cherished. It has the potential to have life. Many things including aborition can happen until it takes it's first breath and becomes a true being.

Yes but abortion is making a decision for something to "happen" Illness and other things arent purposefull.

[PYroMaNiaC]

Sorry Sweetdoc. I get where you are coming from but I just can't agree. A 15 year old is not responsible enough to raise a child, and by your point, to be having sex. But it happens anyway. Her life should not be shattered because of a wrong choice. If a 5 year old chooses to find out what "hot" is, even after you've told them repeatedly they can hurt themselves, should they be punished further? Or is the pain of a burnt finger enough? The child has probably figured it out. For a 15 year old, sex is the same. You can tell them what the consequences will be, but sometimes they've got to learn it for themselves. Should they spend the next 18 years being punished now? And why would you want a child being raised in a home full of resentment or resignation anyway? That's not the kind of life and love a child deserves.

I'm a huge proponent of adoption but I can also see where fear can be the overriding sense. And it's not a perfect solution by any means. I've an Aunt and an Uncle that were adopted by my Grandfather. They had all the love the world could ever have provided for them. It should be also noted, however, that both of them have issues regarding their birth parents and they carry that with them everywhere in everything they do.

[jonesy]

Why does travelling down a fallopian tube make you a human?
A baby in the womb has measurable brain activity, responds to their mother's voice, kicks and moves around. How is that not a person?

As for the first breath, how is that applicable? It is getting oxygen into its blood stream to keep its heart pumping, just through a different temporary route.
Think about it, the baby has a heart, and lungs, a brain, nerves, balls (approx 50% of them anyways), in short, everything we have.
I hope my gran' pappy on oxygen is still a human