Blues trade F Vladimir Tarasenko to Rangers

[bax]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

This opinion is garbage. The Rangers have been constructed pretty honestly. Yes, they signed some big free agents, but it's not the sole reason why they're good. They've drafted some key players, and used other assets to trade for some key players. There's only a handful of free agents that have any significant impact on the team.

Drafted
Shesterkin
Lafreniere
Kakko
Kreider
Chytil
Kravtsov
Miller
Schneider

Trade
Zibanejad
Trouba
Lindgren
Goodrow
Tarasenko
Gauthier
Hajek

Free agent signing:
Panarin
Trocheck
Vesey (retread, but had his ELC with the Rangers and was developed by them)
Harpur
Halak
*Fox (He was actually traded to the Rangers. I'm only throwing this in there because it was known that he would test free agency and sign with the Rangers if possible)

There's no reason to talk like this about the Rangers at all. It's an old narrative that doesn't apply anymore in a salary cap league where lots of factors go into where players decide to sign.

Maybe I’m just biased because I live in NYC, but I find their fans to be some of the most arrogant, entitled, and insufferable in the league. Most them don’t even understand how fortunate it is to draft 1st and 2nd overall in back to back years, let alone having a 22 year old Norris caliber defensman say he will only play for your team.

Might just be a New York mentality, plenty of people here think the world revolves around them.

I go watch the Flames play the Devils, Islanders, and Rangers every year and I’ve only had issues at MSG. Hope they never win anything again.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Sec214

Bullet Dodged.

Now dodge all those other rentals and sell what you can. Don’t push this current roster, it’s too inconsistent.

The Flames will not be sellers no matter what.

[calf]

[Flames1217]

Surprised with the return.

Good deal for STL.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

This opinion is garbage. The Rangers have been constructed pretty honestly. Yes, they signed some big free agents, but it's not the sole reason why they're good. They've drafted some key players, and used other assets to trade for some key players. There's only a handful of free agents that have any significant impact on the team.

Drafted
Shesterkin
Lafreniere
Kakko
Kreider
Chytil
Kravtsov
Miller
Schneider

Trade
Zibanejad
Trouba
Lindgren
Goodrow
Tarasenko
Gauthier
Hajek

Free agent signing:
Panarin
Trocheck
Vesey (retread, but had his ELC with the Rangers and was developed by them)
Harpur
Halak
*Fox (He was actually traded to the Rangers. I'm only throwing this in there because it was known that he would test free agency and sign with the Rangers if possible)

There's no reason to talk like this about the Rangers at all. It's an old narrative that doesn't apply anymore in a salary cap league where lots of factors go into where players decide to sign.

Fair enough, though I'd include traded players who had some control when considering that NYC is a desired location. Dunno who that applies to. Tarasenko for sure. and there are some trades that happened for pending ufas - Trochek and Zibanejad, I think, and I suspect the fact they would sign long term in NYC was a factor in where they went.

[Moneyhands23]

These prices are terrifying.

Please please stay out of this trade market BT

[SuperMatt18]

Kind of funny actually. Rangers trade Buchnevich before the 21-22 season for Blais and a 2nd. Because they wanted to get tougher.

Now 20 months later they trade Blais, and a 1st (the other pieces are kinda meh) for Tarasenko.

Over those two seasons though:

Buchnevich: GP: 111 G: 45 P: 114 (27 years old)

Tarasenko: GP: 113 G: 44 P: 111 (31 years old)

Probably should have just kept Buchnevich.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

This opinion is garbage. The Rangers have been constructed pretty honestly. Yes, they signed some big free agents,

Yes one of the best forwards and best dmen in the league (who they had to trade for at far below market rate).

It's an advantage. They've made good moves yes, but let's not ignore that they also have a massive advantage that plays out all the time.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Yes one of the best forwards and best dmen in the league (who they had to trade for at far below market rate).

It's an advantage. They've made good moves yes, but let's not ignore that they also have a massive advantage that plays out all the time.

I don't disagree but was Fox way below market rate?

Honest question because it's probably tough to say what a 4th rounder who won the Hobey Baker was worth but two 2nds isn't nothing to pay for that.

In hindsight it's way below market value for sure - but at the time before he's actually in the NHL it's a tough question to answer.

You really never know either because it's really the same situation as the Flames getting 2 2nds and Roman Horak for Tim Erixon (who was a 1st and probably just as well regarded at the time of the deal as Fox was coming out of college) and that one looks like a more than fair return with the benefit of hindsight.

(Fun fact is those picks actually turned into Rasmus Andersson via Markus Granlund, and it's too bad we didn't take Kucherov over Wotherspoon).

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Yes one of the best forwards and best dmen in the league (who they had to trade for at far below market rate).

It's an advantage. They've made good moves yes, but let's not ignore that they also have a massive advantage that plays out all the time.

Counterpoint: Johnny Gaudreau signed in Columbus. Flames signed Kadri fresh off a Stanley cup victory.

The salary cap creates parity because every team has an opportunity to sign big free agents, not just the Rangers and Leafs.

It's an old narrative that just isn't true anymore.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

Well this was a trade so the "because its new york" argument doesn't really count

But I want to reiterate that I still don't see the appeal of new York whatsoever. Would be one of the last places I would go to live. Players have interesting tastes for sure.

Tarasenko had a complete NTC, so the "because of New York" thing was probably the main consideration for Tarasenko.

If you are mega-rich, there seems to be two main choices. You live in some kind of huge ranch/mansion in the middle of nowhere or live in a big city. NYC is probably the best option in North America for the city lifestyle. Although some do prefer places like Miami, LA, etc..If you have the cash, a place like NYC provides some of the world's best cultural, restaurant, sporting, music, etc.. experiences. The only other consideration might be family ties, but Tarasenko is from Russia and has so so English. NYC has hundreds of thousands of native Russian speakers.

[dino7c]

come on now they got a young Norris winning dman because of geography alone

Rangers have a MASSIVE advantage

2 seconds! at the time of the deal every team in the league would have paid 5x that. Christ Flames could have actually made a real trade with him but everyone knew he was going to NY

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by dino7c

come on now they got a young Norris winning dman because of geography alone

Rangers have a MASSIVE advantage

2 seconds! at the time of the deal every team in the league would have paid 5x that. Christ Flames could have actually made a real trade with him but everyone knew he was going to NY

Don't disagree it's a big advantage for New York.

But would they really pay 5x that? (which would be 10x 2nds or like 4 firsts)

As good as he was he was still an unknown at the NHL level.

I bet somebody would have given up a 1st if they had assurances he would sign, maybe a 1st and a 2nd but I do think the Rangers did have to give up decent assets.

[calgaryred]

Originally Posted by dino7c

come on now they got a young Norris winning dman because of geography alone

Rangers have a MASSIVE advantage

2 seconds! at the time of the deal every team in the league would have paid 5x that. Christ Flames could have actually made a real trade with him but everyone knew he was going to NY

NYC is an advantage in every league

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by calgaryred

NYC is an advantage in every league

Tell that to the Knicks.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

The Flames will not be sellers no matter what.

Even when the Flames are bad, they would hardly classify as traditional sellers. The owners are not going to allow for anything outside of standing pat, but even that seems like a longshot. BT will go after something, which at this point does seem like a bad idea to me as I don't see the type of player in this team's range as one that will be capable of correcting the inconsistencies that are plaguing this group.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

This opinion is garbage. The Rangers have been constructed pretty honestly. Yes, they signed some big free agents, but it's not the sole reason why they're good. They've drafted some key players, and used other assets to trade for some key players. There's only a handful of free agents that have any significant impact on the team.

Drafted
Shesterkin
Lafreniere
Kakko
Kreider
Chytil
Kravtsov
Miller
Schneider

Trade
Zibanejad
Trouba
Lindgren
Goodrow
Tarasenko
Gauthier
Hajek

Free agent signing:
Panarin
Trocheck
Vesey (retread, but had his ELC with the Rangers and was developed by them)
Harpur
Halak
*Fox (He was actually traded to the Rangers. I'm only throwing this in there because it was known that he would test free agency and sign with the Rangers if possible)

There's no reason to talk like this about the Rangers at all. It's an old narrative that doesn't apply anymore in a salary cap league where lots of factors go into where players decide to sign.

They drafted Sherstiken and Kreider....

They acquired Fox, Panarin, and Vesey just because they all wanted to play in NYC. The trades have also largely been because those players wanted to go to NYC. When players have NTC/NMCs, destination becomes the main factor. I guarantee you Tarasenko provided a very short list of teams he would play for.

Trouba demanded to got to NYC, because supposedly his fiance was going to medical school there.

Meanwhile their recent development has been atrocious. They've had 4 top 10 pics, in the last 6 years, and all have failed to become impact players: Lafreniere (#1 overall), Kakko (#2 overall), Kravstov (#9 overall), and Lias Andersson (#7 overall).

How would the Flames look if Tkachuk, Gaudreau, and Fox had all agreed to stay at discounts, plus 3 more stars had demanded to play in Calgary? That's what the Rangers are spoilt with.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I don't disagree but was Fox way below market rate?

Honest question because it's probably tough to say what a 4th rounder who won the Hobey Baker was worth but two 2nds isn't nothing to pay for that.

In hindsight it's way below market value for sure - but at the time before he's actually in the NHL it's a tough question to answer.

You really never know either because it's really the same situation as the Flames getting 2 2nds and Roman Horak for Tim Erixon (who was a 1st and probably just as well regarded at the time of the deal as Fox was coming out of college) and that one looks like a more than fair return with the benefit of hindsight.

(Fun fact is those picks actually turned into Rasmus Andersson via Markus Granlund, and it's too bad we didn't take Kucherov over Wotherspoon).

By the time he was traded his value of a prospect had grown a lot. He was widely considered to be one of the top d prospects in the game.

But yes that twice where the Rangers were able to trade for a prospect knowing that they were the only team that prospect was interested in playing for. Does that not seem like an advantage?

As an aside Sven turned into Andersson not those picks. Granlund was flipped for Hunter Shinkaruk.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Counterpoint: Johnny Gaudreau signed in Columbus. Flames signed Kadri fresh off a Stanley cup victory.

The salary cap creates parity because every team has an opportunity to sign big free agents, not just the Rangers and Leafs.

It's an old narrative that just isn't true anymore.

That opportunity isn't equal.

You think Calgary has the same ability to sign free agents, for the same cost, as a market like NY? No way.

They have to overpay. We see it consistently. Or target players with some connection to the city, meaning they are focusing in on a smaller talent pool.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

That opportunity isn't equal.

You think Calgary has the same ability to sign free agents, for the same cost, as a market like NY? No way.

They have to overpay. We see it consistently. Or target players with some connection to the city, meaning they are focusing in on a smaller talent pool.

There are definitely some players that target cities like Calgary. Those types of players typically don't tend to be young stars unfortunately. There have been lots of guys who want to play in Western Canada. A reason so many players swap between Edmonton, Calgary, and Vancouver.

But yeah, I'd rather be signing the Panarins of the world....than the Lucics and Hamonics.

A decent number of hockey players are more rural orientated, and might prefer Calgary. Also, some Swedes seem to like Calgary too.